Nice model. How much work did you put into it overall?
And now you'd better find a way of putting it into LFS. Oh well, I used a forbidden word, this is the off topic forum

<offtopic>
@Tweak: I'm sorry to hijack this thread as I just saw you posting here... but don't you read your forum PM's, E-Mails and ICQ messages anymore?
</offtopic>

Quote from Jakg :

its to do witht the g-forces exerted on the car, they move the text

Hmmmmm, like this??

Quote from the_angry_angel :

On Topic:
Hmm....not sure on this one. A video for each vehicle. Say 7MB per video. That adds up quickly...

Yep, you're right. 7x18=126 MB already. That's just the size of the whole S2 download :/
Those videos should probably not be included in the download then. Maybe put a button into LFS that will stream the videos on demand and maybe even save them permanently so they can be re-watched later.
Or maybe on the initial startup of LFS, there could be an option for the user to decide whether to download the additional videos or not.

Anyway, I think those videos should definitely be available from the LFS website so they can spark the casual visitor's interest. The ingame solution is open to debate though :/

Quote from the_angry_angel :

Off Topic:
I'm sorry , but I disagree. The devs do care about PR.

I agree with your disagreeance It would be fatal for any company to discard marketing as something that doesn't in any way relate to their product. If there's no marketing at all, there's no sales. Nobody will know about your product, nobody will be attracted to it.
I think, giving LFS a little polish is THE way to go to increase sales and help the devs making up a living from it.
I'm not mainly thinking of the devs' wallets though. I just think that good software and innovative development methods should receive the credit they deserve. And I think that LFS doesn't use its full potential at the moment. It has a lot of appeal and it has the potential to be presented. There's just the need for someone to do it.
That's why I wish the devs will have an open ear/mind on this

Quote from vain :

1. Better .avi, replays don't have predefined cam-angles. Or music.

I agree with vain on this. It would be up to the devs to include a function to record camera positions/paths/pans so those "videos" could be reproduced ingame. The music could probably be played back and matched to the ingame video while it's playing, but still this would require additional work from the devs. The hardcoded movie solution would be the easier way to go because the community resources can be used here

Quote from deggis :

ps. Some models aren't 100% finished yet, e.g. like RB4.

Yep, those final videos probably should be done once the models are 100% finished. Anyway, as of now, the majority of the cars seem finished already (except for the interiors maybe, which might affect onboard shots)

Quote from Don :

OT:
i also like the short NFS1/2 car showcase movies and inspired by that ive done the raceabout ad

http://lfs-news.bluepixel.dk/m ... t/default.asp?movieid=561

WTF :jawdrop: That video is so freakin' nice DoN! Love it! Imo, that's exactly the style those videos should have.
Maybe the vid could still include a short onboard shot, as the interior of the RAC is really worth showing. Also it might give the driver an actual impression of how the car feels and handles from the driver's perspective.
Also I'd love to see a shot showing the car's specs and features - like it does in the RB4 slowmotion video.

If we are to coordinate and gather in making these videos for the LFS cars, we should agree on certain aspects of these videos. I'd personally see this video as a reference, still I'd like to bring the points I criticized about it into discussion.
And probably those videos could even be 10-20 seconds longer, what do you think?

There's one quite important thing I'm wondering about: do we have the devs support on this? What do they think of this?

Hey

I've only just watched DoN's slowmotion movies with the FXO and the RB4 and it occurred to me that I had been posting about a similar topic a while back in RSC.
Just to bring up my idea again:
I wonder if any of you remembers the car show off videos from Need For Speed 1. I remember at that time, I totally digged those. (and guess what, my favorite was the Toyota Supra video. It was so very cool)
They were really done in a stylish yet mature way, showing drifts, quick road scenes or just nice upclose camera pans/shots that gave the cars a character and soul. While the game was obviously very "arcadish" and the physics simple, the videos and the flair conveyed by those still made every car feel special.

Now seing those videos from DoN, they come very close to my idea of showing off every car in its own special way.
I'd love to see those kinds videos in LFS as well. As we have almost only fictional cars in LFS which nobody can really relate to in the first place, a special video showing off the car's traits, accentuated by some cool and fitting music, might just help a great deal to "get to know" and "get to like" a certain car more.
These should be rather short but somehow make you want to try the car because of it's special features.

I've created a list of pro's and con's for integrating those videos into LFS:

pro
- better identification of players with cars
- cars will have a certain "soul" and "depth" to them
- the beauty of every car's special handling can be adressed in those videos
- those videos might serve to get newbies hooked with LFS
- the videos could be made available ingame as well as online on the LFS website. Basically we have a cars&tracks section now. Currently we have 4 screenshots showing off the car. Now imagine that with a simple click, you could see that car in action, in all its beauty
- a little "show factor" would do LFS good in terms of accessibility and promotion and will definitely attract those who are hesitant in trying LFS
- videos on a website are quick to download and quick to watch. The effort of downloading a video is much less than downloading and installing a game, setting it up properly and then trying a small part of it (demo (which might not even be representative)).
I personally would be much more tempted to actually try a game when a well-done video whet my appetite to try it

contra
- someone would have to create the videos obviously
- the videos shouldn't be too large (should they be included in the LFS download or just optional?) and hence shouldn't be very long (max ~1 minute)
- the background music tracks would have to be licensed if included in a commercial product. Maybe V³ could help out with some awesomely cool homegrown songs for each car here? :P

So, that's my suggestion basically. Does anyone else like the idea? Would anybody be interested in joining the party and create a movie for the car of his/her choice?
Just to let you know: I'd volunteer for the RB4

Hope to receive constructive criticism on this. I really think this could help to promote and advertise LFS. Heck, those videos could even be used as jaw-droppers for example in forums/chats/magazines (or whatever) all across the web...

So long....

biggie

ROFL

Loved the show like 10 years ago and it kinda reminds you of the old times to hear all the sounds and tunes again

I'd like to see the final version too

Hi again

There seems to be another (not very important) glitch with the TV cam.
I just noticed is that the player's name above the car is often not actually above the car, but a little next to it. The centered text also seems to be the entity the TV cam is pointing at, leaving the car itself a little off center.
It seems that if the car is approaching the camera, the camera is just a little ahead and while if the car is moving away, the camera lags behind a tad.
However, if the car is closest to the cam, the alignment is alright. It only seems to happen when the car's position is not exactly perpendicular to the cam.

biggie

Yeah, searching for the link in google and clicking on the "google cached version" helped.
Not really the user friendly way to provide content, I have to say.

Still, that video is truly fake illepall Why would the CPU explode like that and even break into pieces? It'd probably just smoke a lot and that's it.

Some small explosive underneath the CPU probably...

Quote :

Thanks for your interest in Google Video.
Currently, the playback feature of Google Video isn't available in your country.
We hope to make this feature available more widely in the future, and we really appreciate your patience.

That link doesn't work for me. What kinda crap is that? Some kind of censorship to rule out certain countries? How do they detect my country anyway?
Now this is really pointless and annoying. Isn't the internet supposed to be a world-wide open net?

I can play the first ~10 seconds of the video when I search for the title and then click the play button in the thumbnail. But it seems I don't have access to the full length version.
Do I need the google video player or something? :/

Quote from n1lyn :

better remove all your hotlaps now honey so i can get those wr's

As if that was your intention, sugarpuffy :P

Quote from ORION :

lol tell biggie about that

Uh...? FYI, I already know after reading this thread. So what?

A little addition to the XML hotlap log which Vic and I have been developing recently. I'm using the script's output for the WR log at the new LFS Files Setups page

<track> - The ids resolve as follows:
0 - Blackwood
1 - South City
2 - Fern Bay
3 - Autocross/Drag (should never occur in hotlap log)
4 - Kyoto Ring
5 - Westhill
6 - Aston

<config> - The ids refer to the number of the config, starting by 0 for each track.

<rev> - Boolean value 0 or 1 if rev or not.

For example:
BL GP: track = 0, config = 0, rev = 0
Kyoto National rev: track = 4, config = 1, rev = 1
Aston Grand Prix: track = 6, config = 4, rev = 0

<car> - The cars are listed in the exact order as they appear in LFSWorld:
0 - XF GTI
1 - XR GT
2 - XR GT Turbo
3 - RB4 GT
4 - FXO Turbo
5 - LX4
6 - LX6
7 - MRT5
8 - UF 1000
9 - Raceabout
10 - FZ50
11 - Formula XR
12 - XF GTR
13 - UF GTR
14 - Formula V8
15 - FXO GTR
16 - XR GTR
17 - FZ50 GTR

Quote from Bob Smith :

Biggie - no Opeth/Tool?

Oh yes, Bob! I'm loving Opeth's Damnation album. It's so quiet and calm, very nice to chill out. Still it doesn't have that happy-jumpy flair but creates kind of a "dimmed" mood...
Blackwater Park is kinda cool too, even though I'm not so much into growling. But it's quite subdued on that album, you can try to ignore it. That's also what I like more about Damnation. Some nice singing there you can actually enjoy

About Tool: well yes, I also like Tool. However, I never had a complete album, I should better buy some
Anyways, did you know Tool's and A Perfect Circle's frontman are actually the same person? Yes, it's Maynard James Keanan. Some weird but interesting guy he is
Imo, "A Perfect Circle" are the better Tool. Their music is just so tight, emotional and athmospherically dense, it's unreal. They have the feel and melody Tool sometimes seems to lack.
Check this live performance (even though it's kind of a crime to pick one song out of the concept album and let it stand on its own ): http://boss.streamos.com/real/ ... 300.ram?siteid=artistsite

Quote from thisnameistaken :

No offense, but I find metal pretty predictable and boring.

Let me give you one simple equation:

Metal != Metal



Talking about Limp Bizkit, Slipknot (Nu-Metal, Hardcore) and whatever you happen to know, this is not the Metal I'm talking about. There's about as many varieties in Metal as in every musical genre. The only thing that defines "Metal" at all is the (extensive) usage of guitars. However, there's so many genres that do not sound alike at all.
You should maybe try listening to DT's "The Great Debate" for a start, it's really unusual and definitely NOT predictable (mind you, it's 14 minutes long)
Pain Of Salvation and A Perfect Circle I wouldn't even categorize as Metal. These are not exactly heavy but more intelligent and very diversified. It's more "pure music", art and creativity than it is Metal.

Quote from deggis :

[...]three songs to take with me to a desert island:

Well, for me it would be:
Dream Theater - The Great Debate
Pain Of Salvation - Nihil Morari
A Perfect Circle - The Outsider

But then again, this choice of songs is actually random. There's so many more of these bands on the same extremely high level

Quote from deggis :

Most of the nowaday's music is unbelievable crap. Especially hiphop. I get an awful headache after listening two minutes to some (s)hit music radio. illepall

I agree. Making money is still the driving power with most of the recent so called "stars"... sometimes there's a catchy tune on the charts which is fun for a maximum of one week, but after that it just gets boring and you can't stand that tune anymore. Most of the recent stuff is simple crap, streamlined and shaped to fit a standard which almost everyone can "tolerate". The main purpose of this music is to be used as background noise or humming/whistling accompaniment anyway. Seriously: who would ever get their headphones, sit back and dedicate their listening to chart music anyway? There's just not enough depth in it, that's simply not what it's been made for. It's been created to reach the broadest audience possible while the music I'm into aims for a very special niche market. You could never sell that music to a broader audience...
But there's the main difference: those bands don't make their music to sell to the biggest audience possible. They make their music because it's a part of them and it's coming from their soul. It's a pure expression of their very individual creativity... and some people really have a beautiful sense for that
I'm not saying this does apply to ALL the singers/artists on the charts, but to most of them anyway...

I've found that the music I'm into requires a lot more time to get "used to". In the beginning you don't quite get the hang of it. But the more you listen, the better it gets. The reward is that it almost never gets boring and you'll have much more of a lasting experience from it.
That's how I define good music: being a piece of art which never gets boring and keeps surprising and amazing you even after the 50th time you listen to it. Anybody with me on this?

Quote from sinbad :

"The Smurfs Go Pop" - The Smurfs
"Push the beat for this Jam" - Scooter
"The Smurfs Go Pop, Again" The Smurfs

Do you know "Schnappi"? You are gonna love that, I promise

Hey all

In relation to this thread: http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=3930
I'd like to start another more general thread in which you can tell us about your favorite music genres. I'd really like to know what music you're into, as (consuming) music is a very important thing for me.
Personally, I really enjoy getting lost in the music and sometimes doing nothing but listening to some complicated, tricky and sophisticated stuff that gets you thinking and is able to deeply move you.

For me, it's mainly (Progressive) Metal, some alternative stuff and a mixture of many different Metal/Rock genres. The most important and my absolute favorites being:

Dream Theater - Scenes From A Memory
(as well as almost any other album from DT )
A Perfect Circle - Thirteenth Step
Pain Of Salvation - Be
Pain Of Salvation - One Hour By The Concrete Lake
Pain Of Salvation - Remedy Lane
A Perfect Circle - Mer de Noms
Shadow Gallery - Room V
Kamelot - Epica
Kamelot - Karma
Kamelot - The Black Halo

There's many many many more albums I like a lot (many other genres among those I like), however those above are the most essential ones. I think it's also worth mentioning the two albums of "Liquid Tension Experiment" (side project of Dream Theater), which is basically the experiment "what can 5 musicians accomplish with only 1 week of studio time?". It's absolutely amazing if you like good and creative (!!) music and if you can live without a singer and lyrics

Now it's your turn: what are your favorites?

biggie

Quote from J.B. :

Now how awesome would that be?
Ah, I thought it might be something like that. Although I'm not really a demo racer, I just have a different forum name. No biggie.

Hello,

I've just noticed a minor bug when watching a replay at South City from the TV cam - the car seems to be floating above the track at that particular angle.
It's the first time I actually see this and this camera in South City seems to be the only camera that produces the effect, or at least I haven't noticed it elsewhere.

biggie

Happy Birthday Scawen!

Have a nice day

Quote from bbman :

I mostly agree with biggie, but I think the FXO (front) matches better with a Honda Civic (Coupe): http://www.speedsociety.de/det ... honda_civic_coupe_ej2.jpg

My pics only show the Vectra from the side/rear anyway, but I think for the rear that's almost a perfect match. I definitely agree with you that the Civic's front looks very similar.

My guesses:

XF GTI - Fiat Punto
http://www.novitec.at/Fiat/Bilder/Punto1_Oben.jpg

XR GT - Mitsubishi Starion
http://thumbs.automart.com/img ... umb/10520039555001030.jpg

XR GTT - Same chassis as XR GT but with rear "wing" and bigger engine

RB4 GT - Toyota Supra
http://www.fantasycars.com/der ... images/toyota/supra_1.jpg

FXO Turbo - Opel (Vauxhall) Vectra
http://img213.exs.cx/img213/2005/vectra13sy.jpg
http://www.fandjo.co.yu/cenovnik/gepek/vectra-a.jpg

FZ50 - Ferrari 550 Maranello's rear:
http://www.legendmotors.net/ca ... es/550MARANELLO%20001.jpg
and Porsche 911's front:
http://www.linke.de/Members/li ... 911-vollausstattung-1.jpg

FZ50 GTR: Ferrari 550 GTO:
http://www.7extrememotorsports ... rs/ferrari-550-gto-03.jpg
and
http://i.wp.pl/a/f/pjpeg/8571/ ... e_gt3_cup_race_car_04.jpg

FXO GTR - Opel Astra DTM
http://81.209.146.72/mospo-pics/BleekemolenZandvort2.jpg

Formula XR - Formula Renault:
http://www.johnmichaeledwards. ... ifs/ems_gelles_test_1.jpg

Formula V8 - Formula 3000:
http://www.kiesa.com/albums/f3 ... 000%20kiesa,%20action.jpg

Hi

Just look at these two screenshots, something weird going on there. These two messages posted before mine would be switching positions after each chatterbox reload.
There was however a point when it didn't happen anymore, after repeating it for 3-5 times (using the JavaScript reload funtion from the dropdown menu). Then on the next F5 page reload, the problem was back.

Oh btw, I was using IE6 when I noticed this.

biggie

Ah the good old times

I remember spending hours, days and even weeks in front of the PC together with an old friend of mine when we were only 10 or 11. Some of the most influential games in this period were:

• the Wing Commander series (especially WC Armada and WC3. Damn, we soooo loved the story&feel of it)
  
• Bioforge (really fine game for the time when it was released... with a very disturbing and "freaky" plot. It was back in those days where such cheesy horror stories actually DID shock and at the same time amaze you )
  
• the Command & Conquer series, especially C&C1 and C&C: Red Alert
  
• The Myst Series. Well, we were a little young for understanding the more complicated puzzles, but it was still fun.
  
• Carmageddon - revolutionary crash physics and a virtually free environment to experiment with. We just loved it!
  
• The Incredible Machine. Oldie but goldie. Everyone should have tried this. Just wicked!

But there were many other games I'd consider the most influencing:

• the NFS series. I was really having a blast playing the NFS1 demo and I was so amazed by the full verison including all the nicely made car demonstration videos. I liked NFS3 and played it a lot, when some day NFS4 came out. I think that was the time when I first started hotlapping I did have some competition with a friend of mine and we even had our own Excel chart to compare our times
  
• Some random Formula 1 sims, can't remember their names exactly. What I do remember is GP3 which I was playing for quite some time.
  
• Viper Racing... ah, I really loved that game. It was one of the first games I played that had the feeling of a real simulation about it. I also liked roaming the tracks and just playing with the physics.
  It was also the first game I seriously played with a wheel. Heck, I even completed the carreer mode all over
  
• Diablo 1 & 2. Damn, I just loved Diablo 1 to death. It was so revolutionary at that time and it just awoke the collector's and adventurer's spirit in me. I remember endless coop-1on1 multiplayer sessions with my uncle. Multiplayer was completely new for us at that time because we both didn't have internet. So it was a real blast being able to actually coordinate and cooperate with a real person while playing Can't remember how often I/we completed it... must have been 10+ times or something. Same with Diablo 2, even though it lacked the original Diablo 1 charm.
  
• Baldur's Gate. Awesome and very immersive story.
  
• Ultima 9. I really loved how immersing and real this world felt. Being able to walk everywhere just without delay, some places even felt like "home" when you returned
  
• The Tomb Raider Series up to Tomb Raider 3. After that it became only repetitive commerce with little innovation.
  
• Comanche 1 - I think it was the first game I played on my very first PC, a 386 DX-30 and I totally loved it
  
• Half-Life and almost any other 3D-shooter at that time.
  
• Counter-Strike for a while, but I got really fed up with it some day. I was glad when I found LFS and could leave CS. LFS really is just as addictive, but doesn't have all this unfriendlyness and harsh tone in the community. Also I think LFS is much less luck-dependent than CS... you know that if you spin, it is your fault, not somebody else's luckshot

Well, there's still so many more games I'm sure I have forgotten. But yes, there's been a lot.
Nowadays I'd say I'm playing 95% LFS and 5% just for a real change.

Quote from Scawen :

I can't see reproduce the bad text bug.

Anyone who sees text that is worse than before, please say :

- which text looks bad
- what screen resolution you are using (and if antialiased)
- ideally before and after screen shots (P8 exe and P9 exe)

- It's mainly the tire temperature text where the change became apparent
- I'm using 1024x768x32 Bit in LFS and Windows as well. As I mentioned, I do not use any anti-aliasing because my GF4Ti4200 can't really cope with it
- I've attached some screenshots (P7 and P9) showing some different modes I've tested

I've noticed that since P9, there seems to be a slight 1-pixel difference in the text sizes between the left and right tires. It's probably just an anti-aliasing issue, but the readability of the left tire temparatures is slightly higher than that of the right ones.
Anti Aliasing does solve the issue but absolutely kills my frame rates

One more thing: may I suggest to put another 1-2 pixels of margin/padding around the text so it doesn't "merge" with the tire contact patch bars above and the colored tire surface model below?

While I'm at it, let me mention that your attention to little details is always appreciated, Scawen. It's those little things being perfected that make LFS as awesome as it is now