The crash actually reminded me of the Marcos Campos crash. The Campos crash was more dramatic but the injuries were similar

Quote from JackDaMaster :

Its confirmed now.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77088

R.I.P Henry Surtees, February 18, 1991 - July 19, 2009.

Goddammit

Very bad year for racing. Let's hope that there'll be no more

RIP Surtees

Quote from TexasLTU :

Zanardi is still alive for example.

IMHO zanardi was just very very lucky. Drivers have died on the oval from much less.

Quote from Mustafur :

Oval racing is alot more dangerous with a standing car on track, getting hit by another car at 200mph will kill you instantly.

Which thankfully hasn't happened since Dana. But Meira's crash was close though (the wall contact) which made it scary.

Quote from Mustafur :

Thats extremely unlucky, the weird thing is if you where to die in a openwheeler these days this would be the only way how really.

Idk about that, I mean Meira fractured a vertebre in a hard crash at Indy. Had the contact been much worse the results would have been disasterious. But if ur only talking about circuit racing then probably...ya

Quote from TexasLTU :

Unnoficial news, that Surtees dead in hospital.

http://twitter.com/carlosiaconelli

Very unfortunate

Quote from The Very End :

Hehe, I don't really get it why you people manage to upset eachothers in such a ordinary topic. There must be a way to agree/disagree without going apeshit and throwing shit at eachothers while having a moment of rage on the keyboard

Shhhhhh ur ruining the fun

I'm talking about the "live gap" and the throttle control on the bottom of the screen

Can someone please create this?

Last edited by lizardfolk, Sun, 19 Jul 2009 08:54.

Well, we already have F1 style scoring as well as other various F1 tickers.

I was wondering, if a NASCAR qualifying ticker would be viable to create? I realize it would be very hard however, if anyone can create this insim I would greatly appreciate it. Plus it'll be really cool to have and analyze.

Here's an example of it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v ... &feature=channel_page

Quote from The Very End :

Oh bob, canot you go make a nascar VOB, I am sure the dev's won't notice / mind

Even if he did he wouldn't be allowed to distribute it publicly.

Ya you are right as bob's goal is to emulate nascar as best he can. It's too bad. The longest car we have is the FXR and even that doesn't fit the wideness of the stock car wheels

Curious bob, could you center the wheels to the XRT without seriously compromising the mod?

Ah ha, I've completely misunderstood your position in relation to the LFS devs.

I guess the best we can hope for is for the devs to change their policy on mods to incorporate well done ones (or at least allow them to be distributed)

Either that or the devs can create a stock car frame themselves

Quote from z-ro 8 :

any oval is a good oval...

Right hander Kyoto Rev? :P (Actually I'm starting to like the rev better than the standard )

Curious, Bob, you said that the devs dont want a mod that will edit the body work.

But cant they make an exception with this once since YOU are the one who created it? Not just some random kid who's bored?

I think a stock car frame would look very nice and an event around this would actually be really cool. Perhaps even see it being broadcasted.

EDIT: BTW I made some stock car skins myself.

#48 Jimmie Johnson
#55 Derrike Cope
#0 (my old XSCC skin )

EDIT: Regarding the body edit, I remember another group of devs (I think it's ASR devs not I'm not sure) said that they will absolutely not allow body edit but will possibly allow body edit that comes from inside their mod group. Personally, I think you can be allowed to edit the body without breaking the principle behind not allowing third party body mod.

Would you releasing a stock car frame to go along with the NASCAR mod really be that bad?

Last edited by lizardfolk, Fri, 17 Jul 2009 07:51.

Falkes I'm will waiting for the AUS template

Quote from Mustafur :

I think F1 is its own sepreate catagory, in order to get noticed to get a drive you have to win a feeder series but imo even the guy that came last in every race of that series may go better in F1 becuase hes racing style suits perfectly.

Its happened too many times to be honest, i mean look at Bourdais, Piquet Jnr, Zanardi for eg. all 3 have won or gone close to winning a premier feeder class to F1 yet all fail miserbly.

Then you look at drivers like Vettel, Kimi and Buemi who where not even in the top feeder classes and they all have done exceptional(buemi is still in his first season but so far so good).

Also Don't ridicule American catagorys they did Produce Montoya remember, he was dominated by Zanardi the year before he got hes CART title, and look at the difference in there F1 experince, Zanardi got dominated badly by Ralf then Montoya came to Williams and after hes 2nd season dominated Ralf himself.

The problem with Montoya is he started F1 too late he would of been alot better if he had of started about 2-3 years earlier as he drove like a completle nutter.

I think Bourdais would of been in a much better situation if he got a drive after the F3000 title.

Very good points Mustafur.

It is perhaps very very different but in general I would say that ChampCar standards are lower than F1. IndyCar might be a very different story however...as the oval biased Dallara chassis are so different. Different style, different animal, with a much faster top speed while slower acceleration than the F1 cars.

And F1 rejects aren't doing well in IndyCar recently as they did well in ChampCar.

Robert Doornbos moved to champcar. In his rookie season he scored 4 podiums and 2 wins. Seems like another F1 reject thrashing the American open wheel eh?

ChampCar fell, and he moved over to the normally more competitive Indy field. To this day his best finish in Indy is 9th. And he crashed out of the practice and race of the Indy 500. Enrique Bernoldi, and Ernesto Viso met the same reception moving to Indy as well. Also, lets not forget Johnny Herbert not qualifying in Indy.

Currently it seems that ChampCar is a weaker series, but Mustafur is right. Zanardi dominated Montoya in CART, but Montoya dominated Zanardi.

Who's to say what would have happened if it was Indy instead of ChampCar with IRL's freak of a chassis

Last edited by lizardfolk, Thu, 16 Jul 2009 07:40.

Quote from amp88 :

There have been plenty champions of the lower European / Japanese formulae (e.g. British F3, International F3000, Formula Nippon) who have struggled in F1, so you can't really use it as an indicator of performance for F1.

No no, I'm not saying that because he's an F3000 champion he should do well in F1.

I'm just saying that Bourdais isn't necessarily an American product. Ya he dominated in ChampCar, but he rose from F3000. It's not like he went from Formula Atlantic to Indy to ChampCar or from Indy Lights to IndyCar.

I would like to thank FM for such a great time.

I was nice racing with you. Sorry if I screwed anything up

Quote from 88Reasons :

Thanks to everyone for your feedback about our race(s). We will likely be making this into an all out league very soon so keep checking back. We tried to get a sub-forum up for these events and it sure would have helped. But in the words of a forum moderator who will not be identified here, "Sub forums are only for leagues that have proven to be successful". Perhaps we've earned the required credibility now? Would be nice. Stay tuned everyone!

LOL it's so hard to catch you when I'm on

I'll be on the look out for you :P I would like to talk to you

Quote from amp88 :

...

He's an F3000 champion

Quote from amp88 :

I won't be sad to see Bourdais go if the story is true. No real personality, no real speed. Another champion of American open wheel racing failing to cut it in F1. Slightly better than Michael Andretti though.

Ya, he's not American, he's French.

Quote from AstroBoy :

Go the young gun
But no surprise really, Bourdias could of produced good results it just never happened.

Kinda reminds me of Alex Zanardi's situation

Quote from jasonmatthews :

TBH I am quite surprised at the lack of apparent talent in the USA. These drivers come over after dominating there own backyard, to find out that the real competition is very hard. Fair enough, the cars/teams have alot to do with it, but still I would expect a few American drivers in F1 who could cut it Also, seen as the USA is such a huge market, then why don't teams give the yanks a chance in a good car, at least for monetary/sponsorship reasons...

Edit: May I take Football (soccer) as an example - the USA is doing pretty well now, but only after quite a few years (100+) of America thinking of it as a minority sport. If only the USA would integrate with the rest of the world in more ways, do I think that they can be a real force in World Sport. We still have the crazy situation of them claiming the World series in baseball (come on, we did that when we were 12, then never again), and other sports, when really they only play a few sports with the rest of the world. Golf, tennis, football & boxing is as much as I can think of atm. America is rightly very good at these, when they integrate with the rest of the world and stop thinking that the world is the US of A

I would like to see in the future American drivers doing more feeder series in Europe and testing themselves against the best the world can offer. It is only a plane ride away, which us Europeans have to do for every race meet. If this happened, I think we would see more Americans in F1, the top
of motorsport, which they should be in tbh

Then you'll plunge into the ugly argument of whether IndyCar is a valid series. Nevermind NASCAR, closed wheel motorsports are an entire different sort (and NASCAR drivers have done well in other closed wheel events such as Terry Labonte taking 12hours of Sebring and the 24h of Daytona wins as well as various of other NASCAR drivers finishing respectibly in endurance racing).

But strangely...graduates from C.A.R.T, ChampCar or Indy have never really done well despite a few being obviously talented (Zanardi). But results from these set of drivers just never came. Then there's Mansell who came over and was competitive (well...atleast in his rookie season) in Indy.

Of course the Indy field has changed a bit since back then and F1 failures have been finding it a bit harder to do as well as they did before (Ernesto Viso, Enrique Bernoldi).

But then...who came directly from Indy into F1 in recent ages (this is not a rhetoric question)? I personally know of no one (feel free to prove me wrong) and most if not all came from ChampCar.

So is Indy just a crap series that can never measure up to F1 or even GP2?

EDIT: But then again, do you consider Indy drivers and ChampCar drivers to be the same thing?

Last edited by lizardfolk, Thu, 16 Jul 2009 03:00.

Alright...another tire issue. BUT, it's not a complaint just a suggestion

I noticed that the tires are pretty independent from the chassis or anything else on the car anyways. No tire rub (this is of course closed wheel cars).

So...add tire rub. But I have more to suggest.

have the metal of the chassis have an effect on the tires (this can be both closed wheel or open wheel as the open wheel's front wing can be quite the blade). For example, if there's major contact between two cars, the possibility of a wheel being sliced open from contact (or punctured in open wheel racing).

Here is an example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v ... &feature=channel_page

Last edited by lizardfolk, Tue, 14 Jul 2009 23:07.

Quote from zeugnimod :

But not intentional contact. Which bumpdrafting is. IMO.

Malicious and intentional contact are two different things (atleast in the cases of stockcar/touring cars

Quote from 5haz :

T'is a bit harsh to say he is a total idiot, he shows flashes of brilliance, but thats the problem, showing flashes of brilliance is not good enough when you also show flashes of idiocy, real legendary racing drivers are consistantly brilliant.

Yes...that means he's a slightly above average driver. SO WHAT? Hamilton has achieved much more in McLaren than many F1 drivers can ever hope for in their careers. Christijan Albers, Sebastian Bourdais, Christian Klien, Takuma Sato, Alex Zanardi, Gaston Mazzacane.

All those drivers were (or are) pretty average in F1. These guys weren't complete crap, but saying that Hamilton is "below average" or a "complete idiot" is saying that he's below those lineup of drivers which is taking hyperbole way too far.

And to say he is complete crap is to put him among the likes of Alex Yoong, Yuji Ide, Sakon Yamamoto, Scott Speed and Jean Denis-Deletraz. Need I explain more? :rolleyes:

Is he champion material? Yes, but he's incredibly flawed. Arrogent? Pfffff, this is F1 we're talking about... :rolleyes:

Makes too many mistakes? Sure, absolutely. But this doesnt automatically cancels the fact that he is a rather talented driver with the ability to rise to the top. A quality I cant say for many F1 drivers. Has he utilized that talent? Well he was world champions wasn't he? Unless you now consider the F1 world title to be something meaningless and easily tossed aside.

Quote from 5haz :

I agree about categorising drivers as the next 'place legend here'.

People spend too much time being all nostalgic and comparing people to past legends, what people should be doing is making new legends today!

The whole idea of legends is pretty overrated. People take it so far going "ZOMG I BET <insert name> can beat <insert name> in this situation." Or "ZOMG <insert name> didn't exactly follow the steps for <insert name> so he's sh*t."

:rolleyes:

Meaningless arguments. One can never make an accurate judgments of this because racing has so many variables. So the tendency to bash current world champions and using past champions as a basis is an incredibly flawed thinking.

And I suppose that kovalainen is out performing Hamilton at every turn as well? :rolleyes: