Quote from keiran :

Why should it be Montoya's fault for the marbles ? illepall

Rosberg should have realised the conditions of the outside line and taken to the grass but he tried to hang on in there and ended up causing a collision. Montoya had the inside line on the brakes, Rosberg obviously saw him as he wasn't going to hit the apex, at this point Montoya had Rosberg but Rosberg didn't yield like he should have and in the end put himself out of the GP.


Keiran

1) No marbles as it was lap1
2) Rosberg had every right to that corner, he was there 1st. It was Montoya that jumped off the curbing, and managed to escape only temporarily mind you, before his car's damage showed itself. Usually in open wheel shunts, the car in back gets the worst of it. That was an overly aggressive move from someone whos got to show what hes got since he has no contract signed as of yet for '07. And that kinda driving aint gonna get one either.

Quote from Funnybear :

Just keep playing with the settings you have. You will get really frustrated when you just destroyed a setup that was working for you and you cant get it back again, but that's all part of leaqrning. But once you get to a point where you know what is happening to the car and what the track is doing to the car then you can setup a car for anywhere anytime.


I just started from the beginning very rarely taking and using sets from anyone. But there does come a point (Espeically with some idiosyncrasies like the old high nose bug) when you just need a some reference material. Someone elses set might still not work for you but you can factor in some of their attributes and gop from there. Making your own setups can be a bit time consuming at times but for me that is as much a part of LFS as the raceing is.

I have taken that to new heights many times. Once I find something "comfortable", I usually click new and continue my path to destruction on the new one.

About requesting setups, I usually will try to run what I have and see how I fare vs. others times (usually slower ), then I might ask to see what differs. But to no avail I have been finding. Not too many people offer them up freely, which I understand, but frustrating all the same. They know I will not be as quick as them, but like you mentioned, its nice to see what they do differently and try to interpret it into my own settings. Such a learning curve, but fun all the same.
If you can get in a room with a bunch of good players, its awesome, even if Im in last.

Thanks for the comments. I do have a question, how on earth can you make "lines" or other shapes within PaintShop that you can fill with other colors, similiar to what BlueSkunk did? Im tired of working in the vert/horiz planes.

And Blue, I like that. Better than mine so far.

And I have figured out how to take the skins from Masters and work in the individual layers. Made a big difference in how the skins are coming out. Just need to get angles and curved fill areas now, and Ill be set.

Last time I heard of the Gimp, it was Pulp Fiction.

Quote from Gentlefoot :

That's why road cars, if they have an LSD, have limited locking. Even on a track car I reckon anything over about 75% power locking is gonna make for some interesting moments on the exit of corners - rwd anyway.

Well, being a type "A" personality, things like that entice me. You'd be suprised at the things I've done with our version of your Lorrys'...

Quote from Bob Smith :

Yes, with a low power lock, it will be very easy to spin one wheel under power, and acceleration will be reduced. With a high power lock, it will be difficult to spin one wheel, but when a wheel does spin, it is more likely to be both of them (which could cause a slide).

The additional force on one side of the vehicle provided by a high power lock will also help push the vehicle round.

See, I did understand this backwards. I thought lower %'s meant that was the percentage the "other" wheel had to spin before the lsd would catch the other. My version would have meant that @ 50 Mph and 75%, the inside tire would need to be turning 37Mph slower than the outside before lock up would occur. 25% would need about 12 Mph.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Well, so long as the inner tyre never turns red in forces view under power, more power locking won't improve acceleration. I think with the GTRs I run around 50% myself. But of course there's no point going all out for being able to put the power down, if you can't handle the car. Making setups isn't just about extracting the maximum potential from the car, but about making you get as much from the car as you can.

I like your way of thinking.

Let me see if I understand it correct though. If I drop the torque lock up as low as it will go, then the rear end will lock up almost instantly with wheel spin, and the higher number means I could loop the car and both tires will never lock up. Just want to make sure Im going the right way, and Im a tad bit lazy right now to start the game and check the views. :tired: Long day of work and sailing.

Last edited by MagicMarker27, Wed, 21 Jun 2006 23:43.

Forgot to post my findings so far. Had GTR at Westhill, was running about 2:02.xx. Had GearRatCalc, 1 *.xls spread converted to work with the car, a hot lap analyzed by F1perf Calc, and now run consistent 1:35.xx laps over 10 laps or so. I believe the top time is 1:29.xx, and I think the rest is patience, practice, and luck. Took awhile to figure it all out, but after I made the changes suggested by all the programs, it was about the 2nd lap the times plummeted.
Good work to you guys who made all those little progs. Outstanding that they helped the way they did.

PS Bob, based on the graph in your Adv Setup Guide, if Im setting the clutch pack power at 38%, am I wasting power under acceleration? Should I finess the throttle a tad bit more?

Last edited by MagicMarker27, Tue, 20 Jun 2006 23:42.

Quote from al heeley :

Can you please post car skins in the relevant sections made available. Clue: Yours goes in the FZ section. Thanks and welcome

Gotcha, forgive the noob mistake. Had no idea about it.:slap:
Is there a way to send it there, or is that up to the moderators?

1st true attempt at a skin, figured Id share it and get some feedback. More to come for sure
Of course it does actually look better in certain areas, only took screenshot to capture it. Need to figure out a better way to get nicer looking pics.

Last edited by MagicMarker27, Mon, 19 Jun 2006 02:12.

Quote from Bob Smith :

The spring rates we set in the garage. We know the mass on the spring, so we know the spring frequency. The wheelrate may well be lower than the springrate, but the basic frequency will remain. So you can still tune by frequency (since it is a more meaningful than spring or wheel rates).

Now this may be a shot in the dark, but I have followed racing for a looooong time, and one thing that sticks in my head, is that theres a rough formula that either 0.25lbs of air pressure is the equilivant of 25lbs of spring rate or a full pound, not 100% sure. But either way, there is something to this. Has anyone seen air pressure alter any of the graphs in F1perf? Or the *.xls sheets? I still havent figured out all the areas in either of those 2 areas, but if I do I will see if it holds merit.

Quote from Turbo Dad :

Magic , have you used F1PerView or Analyse For Speed yet.
apparantly F1PerView can be used for checking suspension travel (and loads more) but i can't make head nor tale of it

I have d/l F1perview, but everytime I attempt to record a lap, I wreck. And Im not sure how big the saved data file is going to be, then the replay of my wreck starts, and I get lost. However, now that Im home and can run good times, I might just record a few laps, and try to make heads or tails out of it. If I figure anything out, I will try to explain what Ive seen to you here. If I can, that is

Quote from Turbo Dad :

Correct 180 cpm (Cycles Per Minute)
therefore 180/60 gives you seconds
3Hz (cycles per second)

Ah ha! So a lower cycling susp. is smooth, and a higher one is the equivilant of a mexican jumping bean. So when Im hearing the car "hopping" or bottoming out, either too high a frequency and too low a ride height. Although Im sure low ride height is still attainable with the right stiffness/frequency. Awesome, and thanks you guys for pointing me in the right direction.
This is definitely the exact type of Racing Simulator I have been waiting to get my hands on. And to think Im only beginning to scratch the surface with it.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Aim to get tyres peaking at about 10 degrees above the optimum, or they'll get too cold on a longer race as they thin. If you're about 15 degrees over, try a touch more pressure (both front and rear to keep the car balanced).

So in theory, the 85 degree tire will work, just need to alter the pressure abit to compensate for the extra heat being generated. Have to stuff it into the .xls file and see what transpires.

Quote from Bob Smith :

For a road going sports car, I would agree.
For a race car with downforce, you'll need stiffer springs. Try around 180cpm as a start (3Hz).

Bob, I have read your Adv. setup guide, and found it extremely informational and well written. One thing I have a question about is the frequency you mention. Is there a formula to use I.e. 180=3Hz, is that 180/60=3, or is it more complicated. I have also d/l the setup analysers you had linked, and dropped my GTR times on Westhill from 2:02 down to 1:39, consistent over 10 laps.
Another question, setting the tire compound @ 85 degrees, the tires run @100. When I set them @ 100, they run@85. If I remember, fronts are 20.3 and rears are 23.8 lbs of air. Not at home, cant remember the rest of the susp settings. Both tire compounds or variations of them all yield the same results and lap times. Any suggestions?

PS also love the Gear ratio prog. Also helped improve my times. Awesome work.

My MSFF wheel is over 5 years old, and has been tortured (excessive feed back strength) and wrangled (monstrous hands). And my keyboard tray broke 1st. Cheap POS. Next table is gonna be oak.

One thing I have learned over the years, is that unless you can consistently run times on any track, no ones setup will produce the results people look for. Like Revenger said, 500-1000 laps will produce that. Some people I have met in the rooms freely share there setups. Some people also just jump in a room, almost demanding setups from people. If youre not willing to invest the time and effort to learn tracks, or how setups work for you, I would see why some people who have invested hours if not days wont share a setup. There are some great guides, Bobs from thefloatingwidget is awesome.

Quote from Gentlefoot :

Mate, you're gonna be so much faster with separate axis. When I switched it meant I could left foot brake properly.

My times have already improved with it, just need more practice on the tracks now to find the rest.
Left foot braking is how I drive everything in real life, but with 1 axis doing both just didnt cut it.
Again, thanks to dodo.ger for the help.

Quote from dodo.ger :

im not sure if you mean that, but you can seperate the axes with the driver from microsoft: http://www.technikteam.de/software/download.php?id=500

You are a God. Thanks bro, saved me from months of hard work setting up cars the wrong way. Huge difference in the cars now

With the MS Sidewinder FF Wheel, is it possible to assign the brake pedal to the Z axis, thus letting you have an individual input for each Brake and Accel? Seems kinda odd that full brake and gas at speed puts it into "coast" mode. Does this require rewiring something? Or some program out there that will assign it to the different axis?

Does anyone have any tips for using the SDI's 'F1PerfView' Replay Analyser? I have just gotten this and all the downloads I could find. I am hooked fully with this game, seems to offer everything I have been looking for in a racing sim. My big thing has always been tweaking setups. Even if Im not as fast as everyone else from the start, I do realize theres a huge learning curve to this. Tracks, car performance, etc. Cant wait to get my act together with at least one vehicle and have some great races with all of you.