Quote from Don :

Do you really insist on the key shortcuts to be displayed in the ESC menu? IMHO, it will never look better with the shortcuts displayed there. It just looks much better and simpler without them. And my guess is, that people who`d use key shortcuts, are a bit of "pc geeks", so they`d read those shortcuts in keys.pdf - and for the "noobs", i guess they can just press ESC and click - its not that much work for them

Or maybe the best idea would be to add those key shortcuts into the list of reserved keys? that list needs update anyway (missing things like shift+u, F9, F10, F11, F12 etc...also, there is still the old replay speedup/slodown key shortcut SHIFT+F2/F3 [now its just F2/F3])

I'd prefer an option to have the shortcuts shown in the menus, as some other applications offer. It's the best of both worlds, when you need them, you can toggle them on. After you learn them, you can toggle them off. Then when you forget after you've had a dozen shots, you can toggle them back on..

Quote from Hyperactive :

I use this a lot more than lfsworld nowadays: link

It is kinda what lfsworld should be :/

I hope the owner of that site doesn't mind me posting the link, it seems not all even know about that site. Aaand that may be for a reason

I am so glad I asked now! Thanks that is 99% of what I was looking for. Would be nice to be able to see this on LFS World and be able to compare more than one racer.. Very Awesome!

Comparison of 2 with green/red coloring

Is there this capability for personal best times from races? Only hotlaps?

Thanks for the quick answer btw!

Congratulations. Very nice! Details on the actual last race somewhere? I must be missing it, right?

I've searched, and searched and searched. I've been directed and read through so many programming threads now, that this is probably a quick answer from someone in the know, since the search isn't the end all for finding information.

Now to the question:

I thought there was a way to compare lap times to others side by side ( possibly colored/highlighted for the higher ranked?) on the LFSWorld Desktop. Was this removed? Is it still there and I am missing it? Or is there some new app that does this? Or do I have to write up a php script to do this?

Thanks!

Why does licensing the LFS engine have to be a bad thing? Quake and Unreal license their engine for FPSers and they still have their own products. LFS's net/physics/driving engine would be awesome to see coupled with licensed real world tracks, cars, an equally optimized renderer utilizing some more recent graphics hardware capabilities.

Licensing the engine would not have to stop their own "LFS" product and development, just provide additional income and awareness in the market of it's superb capabilities.

Awesome as always!!!

Where is the escrow or payment link to get a 720p HD version in wmv format so I can stream it to my living room on the 360!


Keep up the incredible work!

Was this made with the latest W10 patch? or maybe an earlier W? Tires look like they aren't popping in and out of different LOD meshes as much.

Quote from dpcars :

been playing with the W patch on my newly built system - finally can run it at 1920x1080 and it looks great! getting over 90 fps at that resolution at LOD 1.0 when i don't limit it. whether my car will ever make it into the game or not i don't know (would be great, obviously) but i like the improvements in rendering. as i said before, i'm sure the devs can manage their priorities

btw, after a couple RL trackdays i got a whole lot worse at LFS - not that i ever got good at it to begin with but it is more clear to me now where the differences in skillsets lie. LFS is definitely useful and continues to impress. a friend of mine tried it yesterday and immediately asked for the link to download. he is a hardcore car guy and was involved as a sort of informal 'consultant' in development of both PS and Xbox games a couple years ago (one of his cars was recorded on a dyno by microsoft for the game sound) and he said it was the fist time he saw a game that was reasonably close to driving, as opposed to just being a game.

90fps with a a full grid of AI cohorts? nice.

As for Xbox "sims" even Forza2 and others fall so short of real driving, it's pretty much a big black eye for the console racing genre how poorly it is implemented. And even worse how it is defended/excuses made.

Quote from ThunderX86 :

Why are you using FRAPS to display the FPS? LFS is already doing this... oO

My LFS is set to display the time instead of the FPS. So with fraps I get both., nice eh?

Car details look much better! Awesome! I didn't notice any hood pins disappearing. Had everything maxed out and all sliders to the far right.

I was playing around with the Vsync and I'll have to double check and test with from FRAPS numbers and replays but I was getting low frame rates with it turned off, and constant with it enabled?!

When I am getting 75 with it enabled, I should certainly not get lower frame rate by turning it off.

Keep up the great work!

Quote from Scawen :

Well... no, the new idea is that at full LOD you shouldn't get any visible lod popping. And if you turn off the multiplayer speedup option, you shouldn't get visible lod reduction even if there are other nearby cars all over your screen. I'm trying to make this work for everyone.

Remember, I have now removed totally, all lod on tracks and trees because it's not needed. The only lod is on objects where lod has been specified (e.g. tyres and cones) cars and humans. As a developer I can't allow the total removal of LOD, it would be just crazy to draw a distant car which takes 5 pixels on the screen, with several thousand polygons. The aim is to set the lod correctly so that at Max User LOD, you don't see lod popping.

These last couple of test patches are all about lod and that's why it's gone on a bit, the lod system needed a big overhaul because it was all out of control and not giving control to the user. Now it's supposed to be simple, let the user control it and not let fov and screen resolution control it automatically in confusing and unpredictable ways.

Another reason why it may seem to have gone on a bit is there are so many different configurations.

But actually to me it doesn't seem to have gone on long at all... it's just like anything else, it takes a while to get right. LFS graphics have come along a bit these last few days, even without any of Eric's actual updates which are in development.

Thanks for clearing that up! I'll just carry on then.. Excuse me while I continue to enjoy LFS and the patches! Sorry for all those still experiencing a few hiccups.

Since this is LOD related. I shoot for the highest visual quality without any discernible mesh swaps, and am fortunate that I still can get 75 (+?) FPS with vsync enabled, but I still often see little details swapping such as hood pins disappear as distance from camera grows, a building that has some flicker/ z-fighting.. I am running at 1600x1200 at 75hz on a larger screen, but I don't want to use a smaller screen to avoid seeing these though, heh.

Is it conceivable to shoot for no visual mesh quality degradation before this patch? While testing this patch? or should I expect some noticeable swaps? I am completely on the maximum visual quality, big muscle PC side of things.

Thanks and Magnificent work!

Quote from Scawen :

Don't worry, you guys who use greater than 90 degrees FOV on high res screens, who now get more pop-up than before! I am no longer using a lower lod for view angles greater than 90 degrees. I still do increase the LOD for zoomed in narrow view, just not decreasing it for wide view any more. Also the moving trees aren't using LOD at all any more, so that helps a lot at Blackwood and probably some other places, specially if people do want to use a lower LOD for things like cars, now they can without trees popping up all over the place.

This pop-up/LOD switching has gone on a for a while. Would an option to disable all LOD switching/ stay at max geometry/meshes/textures be helpful in speeding up testing of patches?

This is not a question or needing any reply or discussion, just a comment.
Discussion can be had outside the patch forum if of any interest.
http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=16726

I'd vote to try and get *REAL LIFE* celebrities or even real life race drivers to run laps in a multiplayer event. Take the recordings and bloopers/practices etc for reasonably priced car bits.

That would take a fair amount of effort, planning, setup, but would be real nice.

FFB Drivers for the Wireless wheel will be nice if they ever show up for XP, not just Vista.

7 months later, this is just becoming more of a want for folks. To be able to set two laptops on each side of me and have them just be clients to my local machine on the network getting car/track/position , FOV settings and rednering their view, controlled by my local "center" view would be a great thing.

What are these curves based on as far as car setup?

In real life these "curves" change every lap, and with every tire pressure change, and with every chassis adjustment, so only knowing this part with out the other parts and their effects on these curves, it seems moot.

I think ELO is a joke, and It's horribly broken as the Xbox 360's live service is proving every day. Nice Try Microsoft, but no cigar.

I'd much rather when someone is in game when you show the list of connecting people that it would also show their best lap time for their currently selected car and the selected track. Also allow grids/qualify results to be setup based on their times, best to worst or reverse for grid positions. Good to have the info in game and the options, if you so choose to use em.

Maybe put some of the best in the back to give them a little challenge..

XNA runs on both windows and on the 360. So basically like moving from DriectX7 -> DirectX8-> DirectX9 -> DirectX10/XNA you get additional generic functionality so you don't have to write specific shaders/hardware calls for graphics pipelines and input/etc, but can write to a standard and then the hardware folks meet in the middle with their drivers. This time around though you not only get Windows/PC functionality but Windows/360 support. So it would allow you to have a uber powerful dedicated/streamlined PC (360) for $400 running LFS that runs way better than any PC you can put together for $400.

I am just wondering with Vista compatibility issues being addressed and looked at if they're looking also at the DirectX10/XNA hurdles, and if they would entertain compiling for the 360 in addition to XP/Vista.

LFS is written to DirectX8, correct? Moving to 9 with 10 out would be potentially non worthwhile.

As for patches, Xbox Live Marketplace has patches for many games every day, turn on, auto connects, auto detects update, asks you do you want it, Hit X, downloads, installs, reruns, boom. 5 seconds and one button press is how patches are handled. PLus the built in Voice chat/Music Streaming from any network device and other built in features of Xbox Live are nice. and come for free with the 360 OSes built in overlay accessible with the Xbox button.

Quote from wien :

That would require a total rewrite of the entire game, so I'm going to take a gander at "ain't gonna happen".

It's already a DirectX game.... I assume it's in C or C++ and moving to managed code is a PITA sometimes, but I haven't seen the source so that's why I'm asking those who have.

Scawen, Has there been any thought/possibility/dismisall of having an XNA/360 port of LFS?

http://msdn.microsoft.com/directx/xna/faq/

A few pros and cons I can see.

I'm hope some friends get some good FF wheels or G25s this Christmas and I can get them some late presents of LFS as gifts with the new V patch!


Great work all!

Positive momentum. Nice. As a NASA member and instructor for racecraft, we see all types. Some that just don't belong on the track, and some that are naturals, and move on to full time pro seats, to everything in between. My Chief Instructor has not said anything about this and I haven't asked yet. it's the off season, we need a break. But I can see where proper flag awareness, making mental notes of corner stations, car handling fundamentals can be a big benefit and go a long way to getting a competitoin license. Granted not all the way. Every one still has to get checked out and participate in certification exams. For me this does nothing really, already been there done years back. But for students this would be a great tool. and I'd much rather them using LFS with a G25. GT4 with a DFP wheel is better then nothing, and nothing well, that's it, the bottom. Plus many HPDE students are so overwhelmed their first time on track, especially when they show up and truly are blank slates, having to learn flags, weight transfer, dry lines, wet lines, braking points, no coasting, gas gas gas, etc. Of course in game/sim there are big differences from the real world, and those tend to create a lot of pucker factor and fear for greens. Rightfully so, otherwise they go home, some folks are not worth getting in a car with.. and the sim influence goes both ways, folks come out and want to tell us how to do it becuase they did it this way virtually, and yet they aren't up to pace, and others recogonize the sim is not a 1:1 recreation, and see the good parts, can seperate the bad parts and ignore them so they don't slow them down on track in real life.

Gunn, thanks for your input, This does seam to be a completely US centric operation, so many folks here it might mean nothing to them ( and for them they can move on, I'm sure they have better things do do - then again maybe not) , other than possibly some more servers and maybe even good connections to them? Maybe? who knows.

I'll have to dig deeper into this R2P and NASA comp licensing relationship, maybe I'll meet some students online before I meet them at the track. Maybe I still will, but it won't be of any relation to R2P.

I'd suggest if the Cops are within 10 feet of the robbers and keep them under 10 mph for more than 10 seconds they are busted, and those numbers could always be tweaked easily.

I'm just trying to give an outsiders view in here. Sometimes looking in a mirror is the best therapy or most horrifying thing..

Thanks to those who sent me the pre-edits.

Two wrongs do not make a right. If someone comes in slinging mud, you don't have to sling mud back. I would hope the image the LFS community wants to display is that of, we can handle a situation like this without stooping to that level. After reading the pre-edit ( Why has no one posted this again here? why is it not being kept in the open, like it was originally intended when typed up and posted? ) I can see there is some relatively important issues of dishonesty and disrespect.


Me being from the US and a racer with NASA, I thought this might have some VERY good partnership/relationship/coming together between NASA and LFS, but I am appauled at the type of representation NASA is getting. This is not acceptable in my book for NASA and I'm sure NASA would not approve.

At the same time, again, looking in with the masses, from the outside world, having the original post so folks can see it, and an approach
to respond without stooping to disrepsectful levels goes a long way to show LFS community is *not* elitist, disrepectful, but open to suggestion, and open to lending a hand.

But it does appear the assistance asked for ( or demanded ), was out of line, and possibly not genuine, and sadly based on dishonest conversation. Tim has no S2 license, and not even picking one up is very sad.

When things come to light I understand folks who are wrapped up with their series and having lots of invesment in them getting frustrated and agitated, but remember there are MANY more folks reading than responding, and it would be nice to temper those posts that will represent the community (becuase the LFS community is part of the LFS game itself ), so folks want to return, not just get parts of the story, see a lot of name calling and find that's not the type of place they want to be.


And I certainly would hope one individual would not have any basis or effect on determing the worth or respect of 6.6+ billion other people.

I hope everyone has a Merry Christmas. I hope Becky keeps up the good work folks are enjoying. I couldn't locate a schedule on your site to see if this Texan might partake of some online fun while the track car gets refurbished for next season.

And Tim, I'd still like to hear your side, albeit right now most likely with some apologies for undo remarks, and *truthful* familiairity with LFS.

I would also hope everyone else "representing" the LFS community would not get there feathers so easily ruffled by the occasional wind gust.

Quote from danowat :

Tim said, in his hastily edited post, that, and I am para-phrasing here, that LFS wasn't a good enough sim to be included in R2P.

As far as I am concerned, that means to me any tie up between the two is pretty much dead in the water before it's started

If he is lying ro cracking S2, or if he is just ignorant and hasn't played them. You don't have to crucifiy him. He'll hang himself. Right nwo it seams folks are real quick to belittle folks, when bad folks tend to show through on their own. Again Hopefully Tim will show up, and I would assume from only hearing this side, not having seen "pre-edit" posts, and hear he has not ever driven LFS, used a crack, or maybe have some reason for it not beign good enough.

Was it not good enough becuase he *did not know* that LFS provides more than enough stats for ranking/points awards/etc? Before you stuff words in his mouth, let him explain why. It may just be stats, it may be the drivng model, it may the cloud textures, who knows? If it's becuase he is misinformed, I doubt anyone here will have a problem correcting him, although in a more constructive manner may need to be reminded.

Hopefully Tim will take an hour, get S2, run it, check out his stats on lfsworld, and then put a plan/budget together to tie the final pieces together, host some servers, and provide a great service that brings more folks to LFS and more real racers online. Especially now during the down season, it would be very beneficial to get more real world experienced drivers attention.