Quote from Shadowww :

Edited your error

Perfect. Thanks for proving yourself. Can't we have a mature talk about this topic?

Quote from bunder9999 :

NFS is a "racing game"... LFS is a "driving simulator"... people should just get over it.

Don't get it. And where did I say that I want to compare these games? Just read my post again a bit more slowly please...

Hi folks,

just something came to my mind again. Something what i thought about already dozen of times while reading this Forum.

Why do you always blame Need for Speed? Why do you always use Need for Speed as the worst example for something what LFS not is?

I just want you to consider that many of the "older" people here (24 and upwards) were maybe introduced to Racing Games with something like The Need for Speed, or Need for Speed II. Maybe even Need for Speed Hot Pursuit, or Need for Speed High Stakes. Some of the even younger people definitely thanks to Need for Speed Porsche.

Nevertheless NFS is always used in a very bad manner in this Forum. Of course its not a competitor, of course its not a simulation. But it surely is a game about cars and about the fascination of driving a car fast. There was a time where they haven't been any simulations like NetKar Pro, LFS, GTR and Co (I don't want to start a discussion about the "simulation" term, please resist). This was a time where something like Need for Speed really catched many car enthusiasts interest. Actually it was for me the reason to buy my first steering wheel - a Thrustmaster T2. Later I of course realized what bothers me about the NFS series and I searched for replacements. I went trough the EA F1 Games, Codemasters TOCA, GTR Racing 2002 for the F1 2005 (if i remember correctly), GTR (more or less only the Demo) and finally LFS. I definitely forgot some, but these are the main steps, even the sequence I am not sure about.

Of course some of you started directly with something like Nascar 2003 or maybe even Grand Prix Legends but not everyone.

I just want to remind some people that maybe NFS did the job for some of us to get us addicted to racing games in the first step.

Of course NFS developed in a specific direction, into a mass game and feeding the crowd, but its still the NFS Series and not just the games since Underground.

Don't blame a whole country for some silly citizens...

Yep, you are right, I don't have a complete free mind regarding NFS. If I am honest I have some kind of big past with it. Used to have very well known german NFS websites (The Racing Zone and later nd4spd.de/n4s.de) and worked for EA as the NFS Community guy in Germany. But this was in the time of NFS II to NFS Underground... it all went down with not beeing able to edit cars anymore and the Series to be adressed to a very young mass market crowd. Just to explain myself and the reason why I still catch myself fighting for the Series...

I hope some of you will think about what NFS was for one or the other some years ago...

my 2 cents,
Steffen

PS: This Thread just brought up this mind again... thats why I posted it now.

Quote from Chris P :

While braking on motorway from +/- 110 km/h ABS kicked in, but car didn't maintain a straight line. I had to steer a bit.

Exactly my point, i prefer the VW version. Most of the people will be able to countersteer a bit (even though i dont know if it should really be called countersteering or just steering in this case) instead of not being able to brake at all (The Ford way of life)

Quote from Chris P :

I imagine the last thing you mentioned be implemented when parking assist becomes more common. The technologies are combined nowadays and that's the beauty of these CAN network systems. The speed/force of the countersteering is what would worry me though. Anyway... that's slightly off-topic.

As for the straightline braking... that might be the case in some cars, but definitely not always as I myself have experienced in a relatively modern VW Polo ('07 model).

ESP 2+ including steering force is already integrated in all the new BMW since the E90 3series, I dont know about other brands, i bet atleast Mercedes is already par.

And what do you have experienced in your Polo? Dont really get you

Regards,
Steffen

Quote from Interjmt :

Also there is one other side ABS function. ABS also helps you to maintain straight line braking when your car is on different surfaces, for egg. left side on tarmac, other on mud. In such conditions when braking wheels on more slippery surface would lock quicker than on other, so car would start to spin at that direction. ABS as you all already know has ability to apply pressure to each wheel independently so it applies less pressure on those who are on gripper surface maintaining full control of the car.

Nope, actually not. If you have a ų-split situation (different friction on the sides of the car) and ABS would limit all tyres to the maximum slip, it would actually do exactly what you do not want it to do. Because the braking force on one side would be a lot higher because of the higher friction and the result would be a yaw-momentum around the vertical axis of the car, which would result in a self accelerating spin without countersteering by the driver. Thats why some ABS really suck on ų-split, for example the MK6 Ford Fiesta (even the ST i used to have) really sucked on these conditions, on several test i used all the testtrack length and more to stop. Why? Because the Ford engineers where over carefully, they let the ABS limit the brake pressure to the Minimum, to the maximum possible brake pressure without blocking the low-friction side. Result: No yaw-momentum, no need for countersteering but a very long brake distance.

Thats one of the reason there has been a ESP-2/ESP-2+ development, howerer its named in different cars. Its adding steering force to the steering shaft, so the car does the countersteering on its own, while braking as hard as possible and still going in the right direction.

Regards,
Steffen

Actually there is a very basic difference in lation spanish and castellano:

Latin spanish misses the second person in plural: Vosotros

Castellano:

Singular:
1. Yo
2. Tu
3. El/Ella/Usted

Plural:
1. Nosotros
2. Vosotros
3. Ellos/Ellas/Ustedes

Latin:

Singular:
1. Yo
2. Tu
3. El/Ella/Usted

Plural:
1. Nosotros
2. Ellos/Ellas/Ustedes

Thats one of the examples which is all over latin america the same. There will be more, so its a good idea to have a different language.

Regards/Saludos from the regional office of BMW Latin America, Panama.
Steffen

Quote from horrgakx :

Reminds me of the "resistor" selling on eBay that gives your car 20bhp.

Haha! I had exactly the same thought!

Greats from Panama!

What a shame that they did only show my fault lap, not my pole lap :P Thanks for sharing Mike... so your trip through Germany was good at all? i hope not only the munich beer...

Greetings from Panama...
Steffen

Some pictures of our team/car at the Formula Student Germany:


Me in the car just before the autocross run


Me, Tobias, our electrics and electronics guy and christopher, second endurance driver and responsible for the suspension after we had successfully finished the endurance event


The LR08 in action with christopher driving one of his autocross laps (Sorry for the picture size )

Last edited by Warper, Wed, 27 Aug 2008 21:57.

Quote from Primoz :

I am SUCH an imbecil. I meant in the name tag. Both the turbocharged and twincharged cars wear the TSI badge. Turbos should be 2.0T only i think. Like Audi does.

Thats not right. The 2.0T is called TFSI at VW and the 1.4 supercharged and turbocharged one is called TSI.

Greetings,
Steffen

Ok... now its time to ask who will take part at the Formula Student Germany next weekend at the Hockenheim Circuit?

Steffen

I do have to say that! I really do! I hate you english guys for all your cheap motorsport possibilites. In no way we have any of your possibilities here in germany. All these track days and entry series. You want to get track time in Germany? Be aware to spend some 100 euros just for that, excluding car and all the worn out stuff

Even the Nordschleife gets more and more expensive...

Be happy over there

Again congratulations to you and your team Mike for finishing the endurance and the overall result. Jeah, we had a lot of badluck but nonetheless I got 6th in sprint with my warmup lap None of the other laps were competitive... because of several problems. Fuel, weather and so on...

But even if we don't finished the endurance, we are very proud of the speed we achieved in the endurance. At least second best lap time, just a bit off the very fast Stuttgart guys.

But, we will see what will happend in Hockenheim at the Formula Student Germany. See you on track Mike.

Greetings,
Steffen

Quote from Bob Smith :

Sounds like a massive generalisation to me.

Since we had a Honda CBR600 engine in our first car 2002 and afterwards switched to Suzuki, it can't be that bad

So, no one here is going. Its more likely that all the people who going to take part are already there... My flight is scheduled for todays evening... but the whole team is already there.

Here is another video which is about 1 month old, from our anti-lock-brake-system application.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6x32gMtoi0

Exactly - developement/design; building from scratch; drive it; fix it; and argueing for it at the competition (Costs, design, business case).

BTW: The engine is a suzuki GSX-R 600 K4 engine.

Last edited by Warper, Tue, 8 Jul 2008 07:39.

Is anyone going to Formula Student in Silverstone this year? We will (Lions Racing Team, Technical University of Braunschweig, Car no. 61)! Our car is already on its way along with 4 team mates. All the rest of the team is going to take the plane from Hamburg to Luton tomorrow evening.

The car had been finished this morning, 2 hours later then the planned departure of our team-vans Why? Just because we damaged our engine at the final test on saturday and needed the whole sunday to find the problem and in the end change the engine. Ok, why did we still tested on saturday? Mh, maybe because we had to do a full repair the whole week, because we totalled our car one week ago while testing. We crashed with 65kph into a drain (Fotos: http://fsae.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/125607348/m/75110646541).

Here is a small video from our last test: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJyrEJzhOBw!

Hope to see some of you on side!

Greets,
Steffen

BTW: Of course we will also take part in Hockenheim, Formula Student Germany 2008!

Victor: Like already sad, its not a diesel. Its the 3 litre twin turbo engine which is also available in the 3 series. My father drives a 335i and the engine is a blast. But back to the tuning: There are already many tuned 335i's out there. Especially the Alpina B3 Biturbo is really interesting. Same engine, 360 hp - so it shouldn't be to hard to realise those figures. And i would never say that an alpina engine is overdone and not reliable.

There are also people who say that bmw already tested 400+ hp versions of that engine without having a lot of problems. The only problem i could really think of is the heat generation, but the engine base of the x6 should be big enough - the V8 biturbo also fits in it. And it also has some huge air intake holes in the front bumper so... this shouldn't be a big problem.

Do you want to buy a X6? Or why are you interestet..

Greets

To be honest, the only thing i really don't like thinking of drift racing is that nowadays you really need say "grip" racing if you talk about racing Just call it racing! It is!

Then you can drift as long as you want... :P

Patch Y19 killed my gfx card. I installed patch Y19, deactived driver controlled AA and AF and started LFS. I started a standard race at blackwood and while racing i changed AA and AF. After i switched both of them to 4x and 16x i got a black screen after 2 seconds. This was the end of my gfx card. Ok calm down, i just don't think that LFS is able to kill any gfx card but i just wanted to mention it if there is just a slight possibility that i won't be the only one. It was a Nvidia geforce 6600 GT with an old 4x.xx Forceware driver.

Greets,
Warper

Very nice work... thats great stuff! Thanks Victor!

Quote from halo :

Yes Alfa but, what an Alfa....

...imagine what will beta look like.

oh my god, no... not an "Alfa" version... its an alpha version. "Alfa" version would imply that it's made in italy and it would be rubbish... i just remember one simulation which is/was an "Alfa" version (orp rakten)

Sorry for beeing sarcastic

Quote from Bob Smith :

Ah lets have proper SI units:
Nm for torque
W for power
rad/s for engine angular velocity

Then by definition, the torque and power curves will cross at 1.

Or if you insist, use kW and they'll cross at 1000. Nice easy numbers.

Also if you use rpm and kW, the number is 1000*30/pi, so easy enough to calculate. Well, easier than lb ft and hp for sure.

Well said... and that from someone who lives on the island

Quote from tristancliffe :

So they don't know anything other than what they tried.

Thats nothing but the truth of course - but i don't think that they testet only conventional techniques... because SAE cars are everything but not conventional race cars :P

But nonetheless, you could of course let me know your theory - maybe our engine guys are interested

BTW: That was a typical "tristan":

Quote from tristancliffe :

... but it turns out it's at 9550rpm ...

Graphical approximation is not enough for you You just calculated the intersection. To be "exactly" it is at 9549,30 rpm

Last edited by Warper, Thu, 24 Jan 2008 18:41.

Quote from tristancliffe :

What are the axis? Presumably one is power in hp? What is the other side, the second y-axis? Is that meant to be torque (which would explain two curves per colour)? So why do they cross at ~9000rpm?

But that does not mean my suggestion would not work - all the cars I've seen in pictures could theoretically gain from it judging by the shape of the inlet system

I just have to mention... that our team last year not just used 3d fluid simulations to test the best air intake shape but also tried 6 different hardware air intakes on the engine testing bay But who knows? :P

The axis are torque in Nm (left) and power in kW (right) - what do you think about that diagram - of course do they only use SI-units :P Whats wrong with the lines crossing at about 9,5k rpm?

Last edited by Warper, Thu, 24 Jan 2008 17:55.

Quote from tristancliffe :

I still have an idea on how to improve most FSAE/Formula Student cars that I wasn't allowed to try when I was at Uni. Could provide in the region of 5% power/torque gains throughout the rev range, and still be perfectly legal. Plus with CNC it would be easy to make.

I would be a bit more carefull with that Tristan . Maybe it's true with the team at your university but especially in germany and austria there are a lot of teams with nice engine modifications. I'am not an engine pro.. not even close to but i know that the requirements for a FSAE engine are very special.

For example some dyno results from last years Formula Student Germany:

http://www.formulastudent.de/f ... SG07_Dyno_Results_1-9.jpg

Greets,
Warper

Quote from troy :

thats what i thought first too, but if you look close you will see an "on" "off" button for that too just over the mph/kph button

Iam so stupid... But then it should be improved a bit... so that the subpoint got a little difference in backgroundcolour or something like that.