A lot of people are saying that the XRR is the 'step on the gas pedal and wait and wait and mybe till the next lap, the boost will come on' car. FXR is also turbocharged but has it's own, unique problems. One being the AWD transmission - power loss and tyre eating

I haven't searched, i haven't seen the improvement suggestions thread, i just got this idea on the bus on my way to school (typing this at my computer class), so if it was suggested, tell me to put my flamesuit on.

Anyway, the suggestion? Missfiring system. Many of you know this, for those who don't, it's used on WRC cars and is the thing that makes the 'BANG BANG' when the drivers lift of the gas pedal. What it does is pump some gas into the engine but the sparkplug doesn't ignite it. When it reaches the exhaust, it explodes because the exhaust is VERY hot. This then spins the turbo and once you press the gas pedal, hey presto, instant boost!

What do you guys think? Would be nice to be implemented and would probably help the XRR. Lately it has been used in the JGTC too, so it's not limited just to WRC. Would be nice if we also had backfires

EDIT:Wikipedia

Could work.

Sweet, it is based on real car tech, it is working, IT WILL HELP! I noticed that some overtaking with FZR are ititiated by a quick turn exit. Because of the acceleration delay of XRR and FXR is properly driven FZR faster on the exit and can overtake well if the exit of the turn leads to the longer straight.

Got the point, Primoz

A nice idea. The FXR is very nice on tyres though, don't know what you're on about there - just need to change the torque split from the default value a bit.

Bob i had R3s in front in a 10 lap race at Kyoto long and i just abrely made it through. I would not have made another lap I have to mention that i was using Flotch's setup though

Just to add that the bangbang system only work when the engine is hot, there is a switch most of the time to wait the engine temperature and then set it on...

Quote from Primoz :

Bob i had R3s in front in a 10 lap race at Kyoto long and i just abrely made it through. I would not have made another lap I have to mention that i was using Flotch's setup though

You can't take ANY setup from a hot lap and get 10 laps with it unless you drive a smooth 10 sec a laps slower pace. Torque split, camber, tire pressures, track bar ... etc .. all that will need tweaking to get an endurance setup.

I should also mention i have NO idea how to tweak the setup.. So yeah

BTW, back on topic

gtrs are endurance cars ... no way anybody would ever put a turbo system thats prone to destroy itself in any car thats supposed to do 24h races

Supercharger?

Quote from Quietus :

Supercharger?

parasitic loss.

Plus the idea of supercharged 4 cylinders just makes me laugh.

Shut it you!

Supercharged 4 cylinders are excellent! I'd love to see my Polo G40 in there.

You're all talking about this car as if it had a turbo lag problem. It's just coded that way, it would be much simpler for them to model turbo boost a bit better, or just reduce it and say they fitted a smaller turbo lol. Alot easier than programming an ALS.

I think the lag is all part of it though, that's the challenge, to keep it on boost. That means left foot braking and some trick foot and gear work.

It's still my favorite of the GTR's even with the lag, just because I grew up on the GT, then GT turbo.

Bi-turbo?

The FXR is too nice on it's tyres! While I was practicing for the 3hour race of Aston Historic I had a problem with the tyres, but it wasn't that they were getting too hot, it was that they were getting too cold! Aslong as you have the right setting for them they can last much longer than the xrr & fzr.

Quote from Psycho Evangelion :

parasitic loss.

Plus the idea of supercharged 4 cylinders just makes me laugh.

Actually it makes MORE sense to me than turbocharged 4-bangers. The classic high-performance 4 cylinder engine is known for terrible low-speed torque and a very narrow powerband. Supercharger=more low end torque and wider powerband. To me, it's the logical choice--no more worrying about falling off boost and accelerating like a slug. Sure, peak power would be lower than a turbo, but a broad powerband would be great for corner exits--with AWD, the FXR is already best equipped for early-acceleration driving styles. Imagine the FXR with the FZR's engine--that's what you'd get.

Of course, what would be really great is a twincharger system so at high speed the supercharger drops out and an enormous turbo takes over. Best of both worlds, Lancia's later Group B rally cars used this with great success. But they're the only people in racing history to pull it off--the only other twincharger I've heard of actually being used in a car was an aftermarket modification for the early Toyota MR2, and it was supposed to be almost impossible to tune.

Lots of (well, some) 1930s era cars used turbosupercharging, as they called it back then. Other than that I have no idea how they worked or how successful they were.

Quote from 5th Earth :

Actually it makes MORE sense to me than turbocharged 4-bangers. The classic high-performance 4 cylinder engine is known for terrible low-speed torque and a very narrow powerband. Supercharger=more low end torque and wider powerband. To me, it's the logical choice--no more worrying about falling off boost and accelerating like a slug. Sure, peak power would be lower than a turbo, but a broad powerband would be great for corner exits--with AWD, the FXR is already best equipped for early-acceleration driving styles. Imagine the FXR with the FZR's engine--that's what you'd get.

Of course, what would be really great is a twincharger system so at high speed the supercharger drops out and an enormous turbo takes over. Best of both worlds, Lancia's later Group B rally cars used this with great success. But they're the only people in racing history to pull it off--the only other twincharger I've heard of actually being used in a car was an aftermarket modification for the early Toyota MR2, and it was supposed to be almost impossible to tune.

I once read on a forum many years ago (2 or 3), about a mod a guy was doing to an Evo, which was a turbo so damn big he needed a super just to spool it up. He completed it, and ment to have worked very well, but I have no idea about any other information on it in more detail then that.

Quote from P5YcHoM4N :

I once read on a forum many years ago (2 or 3), about a mod a guy was doing to an Evo, which was a turbo so damn big he needed a super just to spool it up.

http://forums.evolutionm.net/s ... 7361&page=1&pp=15 ?

Twincharging has been tried out in the past but controlling which one was creating the boost was too complex, or at least that's what I've read. Lancia's S4 Group B rallycar had a system too, and the drivers loved it's instant response whatever rpm you had. The latest attempt on twincharging (that I know of) by a car manufacturer is the VW 1.4 engine used in Golf GT. I guess they have got things working relatively cheap if they can afford using the technique in a production car..

AFAIK the big GTRs in LFS are meant to mimic JGTC racing, and like it has been said those cars have antilag systems. Albeit Toyota used NA V8s in their Supras instead of the inline 4 and the NSXs are back to NA after trying out the turbocharged way (IIRC). Instead of having trick tech in the current specs, I'd like to see XRR and FXR engines changed to something that better matches todays engines.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Lots of (well, some) 1930s era cars used turbosupercharging, as they called it back then. Other than that I have no idea how they worked or how successful they were.

We need an ERA in LFS

Need superchargers first.

Oh that would be good.

Oooor...

we could slap some NOS on the two cars and give the guys a push-to-pass button? Just like they have in Champ Car, where people can't drive.

Fo' shizzle illepall

Anyway, back to the seriousness of being serious. Volkswagen developed a new engine boost technology some time last year called TSI. It's a combined supercharger and turbo (if I'm understanding this correctly) which gives you all the pros of both, without any of the cons like turbolag, lack of torque etc.
Another plus is brilliant fuel consumption.
You can read about the technology here: http://www.volkswagen.com/vwcm ... l_glossary/tsi/start.html

I don't know if it would work in GTR cars like the XRR and the FXR, but it's definitely worth a look.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Lots of (well, some) 1930s era cars used turbosupercharging, as they called it back then. Other than that I have no idea how they worked or how successful they were.

A common misconception--a turbosupercharger is just what we call a turbocharger today. See, the supercharger was invented first. When the turbocharger was invented, it was seen as just a new kind of supercharger, a turbine-driven supercharger as opposed to a belt-driven supercharger. This was shortened to turbo-supercharger, and eventually just to turbocharger.

Some of the turbosupercharged WWII fighter engines did in fact use a supercharger as well as an exhaust-driven turbocharger. Many of the supercharged aircraft engines had the supercharger built into the engine block and attached directly to the crankshaft, so instead of redesigning the engine to remove the supercharger, they just slapped a turbo on the end of it and let both run all the time.

It's hard to find actual numbers on the pressures they used, but at least one supercharged-only aircraft engine I've found data for ran at 35 PSI boost with water-methanol injection for anti-detonation. (Allison V1710 engine, total 2,250 HP war emergency power, claimed modern race-modified up to 4,000 HP). I've seen estimates of engines of this power level using something like 400 HP just to drive the supercharger.

If you get minimechanik change the 'time to rev' to a smaller value. If you set it to .00001 the turbo spools up almost instantly giving crazy wheelspin without changing anything else.

Quote from Huru-aito :

http://forums.evolutionm.net/s ... 7361&page=1&pp=15 ?

...Albeit Toyota used NA V8s in their Supras instead of the inline 6...

Sorry, but the Supras that I've seen (and they've been many) have all been 6 cylinders, and I've seen one V8 (besides in JGTC).

i love to see a backfire on cars with fire coming out of the back of the car and the sound bang.