Quote from BenjiMC :

tbh, Hamilton beat Trulli fair n square. Trulli overtook him under yellow...

Trulli went off-track when the SC came out, and Hamilton passed him. When Trulli rejoined, Hamilton slowed down and gave back the position. It's contentious.

and i quote:

"Both Vettel's and Kubica's cars sustained substantial front-end damage in the collision. But while the BMW Sauber driver spun off and hit a wall soon after, Vettel continued to drive his stricken RB5 with its left front wheel hanging off as the safety car emerged following the incident.

As a result the stewards have additionally fined him - and Red Bull Racing - US$50,000 for continuing to drive a damaged car."

anyone remember the 3 wheeled car from spa '88?

ahem, cough cough.

Quote from Intrepid :

An exceptional drive to me is when you can ask the question

"Could Driver X have done anything better?"

and the answer is

"nope, not much"

Then we would have at least a handful of exceptional drives every race weekend. That's even contradicting with the meaning of the word.

For example, I don't think Buemi or Sutil could have done a lot better yesterday. Does that make their drives exceptional?

or villeneuve in 79 ?

for those that don't here it is

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNJ-1frbzZA

It was a great race and there seemed to be something going on all the time and bbc coverage was good too

Regarding the drivers, there were some good drives out there but nothing 'exceptional' IMO. I am a fan of Hamilton but he drove as quick as the car would go and consistant in that he didn't make any big mistakes. He did overtake some cars and was lucky with the retirements too. I think he shut up the people who were "he can't cope unless hes at the front/cant cope under pressure" etc.

All my hope is that brawn can keep the advantage they have got and do well this year but I fear Ferrari and McLaren will slowly catch up to brawn.

Something I thought of last night - think of who wins if the Brawns are DQed for their legal Diffuser?

i didn't catch the story properly as i was on iracing at the time but bbc breakfast were saying that brawn have anounced they're laying off something like 1/3 of their staff. hope i got it wrong or its not true as even allowing for people that were associated with the testing team being surplus to requirements, that could hurt a lot of the development they'll need to stay in front.

Quote from J@tko :

Something I thought of last night - think of who wins if the Brawns are DQed for their illegal Diffuser?

You mean their legal diffuser, as declared by the stewards?

EDIT: Yeah they are laying off 270 I think

Quote from RossUK :

You mean their legal diffuser, as declared by the stewards?

EDIT: Yeah they are laying off 270 I think

Sorry yes

Quote from J@tko :

Something I thought of last night - think of who wins if the Brawns are DQed for their illegal Diffuser?

i think that if it's found to be illegal it will not be retro active, i.e. it just wont be legal for future races but will be ok for races that have taken place similar to how they ruled on mclarens "fiddle brake" arangement a few years ago. in someways it would be the ideal solution for the FIA as it would allow them to close the loophole but still give the teams concerned time to make plans for new parts plus a few races to gain the rewards for their ingenuity.

Quote from tinvek :

or villeneuve in 79 ?

for those that don't here it is

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNJ-1frbzZA

But they drove back to the pits... Vettel continued passed the pits and tried to finish the race with his car.

Quote from BenjiMC :

Button, was... ok i guess. Not to say button didn't deserve it but it's not so incredible like people want you to think. The story behind it all is, but not the actual drive.

My driver of the day, Hamilton for bringing that bag of crap to the front, he must of been doing qualifying laps the whole race to get that pace out of the car.

Ohh I just remember everyone praising Lewis Hamilton for being so well in his first two seasons. He was sitting in the best car as well and that's why he had the chance to become the champion.
But now with Button having a competitive car it's just ok and it wasn't him driving it properly but only the car's greatness?
Kimi failed again, looked like he wasn't 100% focussed and lost it. Button didn't so give credit to those who deserve it!

You also have to give credit to Lewis because he was doing consistent Laptimes, slower than others but with a smaller deviation (I followed the Livetiming on formula1.com) But he mostly benefited from crashes and KERS.

The only thing I am very disappointed of is that both Vettel and Kubica didn't behave professionally, Kubica could have been more patient and Vettel should have backed off, you cannot hold a guy who's 2 secs a lap faster than you behind for 4 laps.

Quote from tinvek :

i think that if it's found to be illegal it will not be retro active, i.e. it just wont be legal for future races but will be ok for races that have taken place similar to how they ruled on mclarens "fiddle brake" arangement a few years ago. in someways it would be the ideal solution for the FIA as it would allow them to close the loophole but still give the teams concerned time to make plans for new parts plus a few races to gain the rewards for their ingenuity.

Quote from BBC Sport:

Quote :

They could allow the results of the first two races to stand, with the three teams concerned being forced to amend their cars from the Chinese GP onwards, or they could make null and void any points won by those teams in Australia and Malaysia.

So they might do

Quote from Intrepid :

1. What could Hamilton have DONE better?

2. If other cars had tyre problems then Hamilton/McLaren made the RIGHT call

3. If other drivers were making mistakes then the track was obviously tricky. HAmilton didn't make any.

4. Doesn't matter who built the car. if it's a dog its a dog. Schumacher should have won (properly) in 05 by your defiintiion

So again what could HE have done better to make his drive EXCEPTIONAL in your opinion as you failed to answer that VERY specific question

Simple. He could have won the race by a good 5 second margin. Now THAT would have been an exceptional drive.

As it was he was off the pace (no fault of his of course) and was smart enough to avoid trouble and benefit from some people who couldn't or just had bad luck/reliability issues as well as two safety car sessions that put him up behind people that he probably would never have caught otherwise.

I would say that Hamilton drove a good race, and there is no doubt that he got the best out of the car and made the best of the opportunities that were presented to him.

But to call his race exceptional is to my mind pure exageration. If he had managed the same gain in positions in an incident free race, without the advantage of having tens of seconds of track position handed to him by saftey car sessions and people falling off the track in front of him then I would agree it was an exceptional drive. But that's not what happened.

Quote from DevilDare :

So its Hamiltons fault Mclaren were smart and used KERS while others didnt....?

Seriously, I don't see where you're getting these ideas from. Where have I said that he was at fault?? Stop trying to extrapolate what I'm saying to mean something extra.

Maybe it's a language issue, but just to clarify again. I think Hamilton drove well, I just believe he was gifted some luck as well and he was smart/good enough to make best use of it. That means you can't make any objectively accurate prediction of his future performance in other races on the basis of where he ended up in this one.

Stop reacting to what you perceive as "hamilton hatred" by being just as blinkered and biased yourself. Objective critisism is just that, objective critisism. It's not rational to react to it with strawman arguments about what Ferrari or other teams have said or done.

I think he drove very well, but it won't stand out as a memorable drive in F1 history, so I wouldn't say it was exceptional. He did the best with what he had and stayed out of trouble, but then you could say the same for other drivers in that race. His good drive put him in the position to be the one who would benefit the most from all the chaos and retirements and safety car periods. You'd have to say he drove a good race whether it was 3rd or 8th.

He did the bare minimum of what is expected of him as an F1 driver - he didn't crash, he didn't fall off, he passed a few cars that he could and he finished the race. Doing that could have resulted in him finishing 15th or 1st. This time he was lucky with strategy, safety cars and others making mistakes that gifted him a finishing position 5 higher than he or McLaren deserved.

I don't think that makes it a particularly exceptional drive to be honest. Unless not making a mistake without any pressure is exceptional.

Quote :

He did the bare minimum of what is expected of him as an F1 driver - he didn't crash, he didn't fall off, he passed a few cars that he could and he finished the race. Doing that could have resulted in him finishing 15th or 1st. This time he was lucky with strategy, safety cars and others making mistakes that gifted him a finishing position 5 higher than he or McLaren deserved.

I don't think that makes it a particularly exceptional drive to be honest. Unless not making a mistake without any pressure is exceptional.

I wish to disagree with you Tristan, my view is that Hamilton drove very well, and showed that he is a tenacious racer by again pulling off some ballsy overtakes. Accepting that he is in a rather lacklustre car, let's look at a few facts.

He finished in a fairly high position in a midfield car. Compare that to other great recovery drives of say Nigel Mansell remember when he went from last to 1st? Alain Prost did the same thing too, and a few others of that era... But that era, cars where 4.5 seconds apart over a lap, and they had the best cars. The qualifying for Australia was a 0.7 second spread.

Sure he passed a few cars that fell off the road. Now I hate to break it to you but for as long as i've been watching F1 (25 years) there have been retirements in motor racing, quite a few actually, indeed, it's not a question of if a few cars fall off the road but how many.

Hamilton did a good job, he over delivered on expectations. Sure a few things went his way, and on another day they might not have, but I dont think many other drivers in the field would have achieved the same thing. Certainly I cant think of many drives by a certain Mr Jenson Button where he went from last to almost rostrum in a midfield car, and I can think of many races where he had the opportunity.

Don't you guys have anything better to do than argue on a Internet forum whether Hamilton's drive was "good" or "exceptional"?

Quote from mr grady :

anyone remember the 3 wheeled car from spa '88?

ahem, cough cough.

Schumachers wheel had left the car, Vettels wheel was still attatched, which makes it more potentially dangerous as the wheel could somehow disconnect itself when Schumacher hit Coulthard in the wet his wheel just flew off. With 3 wheels in Schumachers situation, he's only a danger to himself, with 3 wheels in Vettel's situation, he's a danger to everyone.

PS : Hamilton has KERS if he didn't, his drive on Sunday WOULD have been exceptional.

Quote from Kalev EST :

Don't you guys have anything better to do than argue on a Internet forum whether Hamilton's drive was "good" or "exceptional"?

Dont you have anything better to do than argue on an Internet forum whether a forum dicussion is justified as part of a fulfilling and healthy life or not?

I think the answer we're both looking for is: No not really.

meh, Hamilton had KERS... of course he did, thats the only reason his car wasn't an extra second off the pace!

Fact is, 18th to 3rd (Trulli went off on his own and hamilton had 3rd, FACT), is a good drive. But obviously not good enough for some

Quote from BlueFlame :

With 3 wheels in Schumachers situation, he's only a danger to himself, with 3 wheels in Vettel's situation, he's a danger to everyone.

so lets get this right.

he is driving slowly, in a damaged car in a situation where other cars have crashed due to poor visibilty, and thats alright?

Quote from Becky Rose :

Dont you have anything better to do than argue on an Internet forum whether a forum dicussion is justified as part of a fulfilling and healthy life or not?

I think the answer we're both looking for is: No not really.

True.

But usually there are atleast two opposing views or arguments. Right now everyone agrees Hamilton was good but are arguing about how good. Arguing for arguing's sake really. But that's kind of the point and the fun part of Internet forums, so get on with it.

Quote from Kalev EST :

True.

But usually there are atleast two opposing views or arguments. Right now everyone agrees Hamilton was good but are arguing about how good. Arguing for arguing's sake really. But that's kind of the point and the fun part of Internet forums, so get on with it.

Well i've not been too involved, with more posts to you than regards the argument raging, but I did feel when I watched Hamiltons drive that it was the drive you would expect of a champion, that he's prooved himself now.

Everyone in the anti camp argued Hamilton down because he had a winning car, they now have what they always wanted and that's to see Hamilton in a mid to low order car, and look what the guy did with it ... and they're still not happy.

*shrug* seems odd to me, so yeah I chipped in with a post on that. My thoughts on the GP though.

Vettel: That was a bit iffy with the whole Reliant Robin thing, it was a real shame because I hoped he'd do well, he was impressive at the end of last season and clearly is going to be a player this year. He's young, he showed his inexperience and his passion and determination. Personally I was disapointed Kubica took him out.

Kubica: It was his fault, I was dissapointed as I didnt think Kubica made that kind of error.

Button: Did the job

Barrichello: Somebody likes the thrill of rollercoasters!

Good race, I enjoyed it, and it's nice to have an edge of seat grand finale at the end of a race.