Hello

LFS is a great game. I love it.
However, some bad players are destroying the race.
It is happening every day and every server.

[History]
One player starts to join the race normally.
When he almost lost the race, crash other players car malignantly.
He is the crusher now, and then ruined the race.

If he get BAN, and he does same thing on other servers.
Or he make another DEMO account, does same thing.

This is not desirable.

The LFS have user-master and managing racers.
This is great.
But more effective use to the master server.

[Proposal]
If some bad player got ban, he become can not play all servers.
He got master-ban 12 hours, can not play.
BZFLAG game uses this system.
http://my.bzflag.org/w/Master_Ban

- All servers should Use MasterBanList in default.
- USERNAME and IP address to use system.
- The default is 12 hours (cool down time)
However got 365day ban at one srerver.
MasterBanList should be 12 hours ban.
(Because of a Bad player ban another good player)
- NoMasterBanList can also be set. (Optional)

Sorry, I am not good for english.
But I hope many people thiking same problem.
How to solve the problem...

Who is the CRASHER ?
Where he goes?
Can I believe other racers?


[Another problem]
I have a S2 account.
But when UNLOCK S2 account, I must keep using it.

For the test of making server, I want use another account.
If I unlock another DEMO acount, S2 account can not use 1 week.
3h_unlkused : Unlocks for this week all

The error that is not available S2 until Friday moning.
For person who most love with FBM BL1, S2 is against account.

There is already a global ban system. If you get banned from multiple servers in a short period you will get a global ban for a short while. It does work on username instead IP though, so there is nothing stopping the user from making a new account.

I don't really think this is a big problem though. Usually crashers will get vote banned quite soon, if vote banning is enabled. Also most crashers are not serial crashers, they only do it when they get frustrated. Those kind of people usually stop after they get kicked of a server or two. People who crash all the time (ie. they don't even try to race properly) get usually banned from all major servers too quite quickly.

With licensed servers the problem is reduced even more since, not many people are willing to pay just for crashing. Cleaner racing is one of the services that comes with a license.

a) There is already a master ban system in place, which happens automatically if you get banned from x amount of servers in y amount of days. I can't remember the exact threshold values off hand.

b) There is never a need to lock LFS for testing, IMO. If you really must use a locked copy of LFS for some reason, have a second install that you never unlock.

It's 30 servers in 30 days Bob, which is pretty good going really

Thank you for peply!!

I try to find that system's explaining page... But not find yet.

Quote from Bob Smith :

b) There is never a need to lock LFS for testing, IMO. If you really must use a locked copy of LFS for some reason, have a second install that you never unlock.

Does it meaning 2 separated folder innstallation?

example...

C:\LFS-S2 <-- S2 account (Normally use)
C:\LFS-demo <-- DEMO account(Test use)

Quote from Bob Smith :

a) There is already a master ban system in place, which happens automatically if you get banned from x amount of servers in y amount of days. I can't remember the exact threshold values off hand.

Actually i don't know how effective this system and hopefully will not learn bout it first hand
But i am interested is it work only when admin ban you or users ban enough.
Why I asking cuz when i started to play online my first track was S.C. chicane R so at first turn i hit some guy and get user ban for whole day they vote so fast i didn't have time to apologize the thing that surprise me is i hit one guy accidentally there where no one else all users where far ahead so they didn't see who fault is but they just follow this guy vote without asking bout details, just mindless reaction.
It happens a few more times on different track even when ppl doesn't seen the situation they just brainlessly vote to ban not even a kick.

A lot of times there where situation where i unintentionally hit someone or he ram me and then start to vote or asking others to vote and some observant guys say its not my fault cuz he seen the situation or just someone notice that it wasn't intentionally and simple apologize should be enough but its rather rare situation.
Most times its like brainless reaction ppl just vote without asking question even if they didn't seen the situation
Hope "vote ban" will be available only for admins or only when player where kicked already 3 times from the server.

I was wondering...are there any (even if unofficial) statistics about the number of crashers online? Or at least crasher incidents? I would like to see if the trend is increasing or not.

I don't think you need those statistics just assume this.
On every Demo server there is 80% crash on first corner and 100% at least one crash somewhere else on track
On license servers 40% crash on first corner and 90% somewhere else on track
On Kyoto Oval usually two crashes during race but usually takes the whole pack only few racers on first positions survives
So its pretty much like this :gandalf:

PS. if someone reply something like "can you provide any proof" just kill me :rolleyes:

Quote from Chupacabras84 :

Hope "vote ban" will be available only for admins or only when player where kicked already 3 times from the server.

Admins can kick normally. Only regular users need the vote ban option. And I think all servers should have the vote banning option enabled (except for league races etc). Especially on demo servers it's essential, so that one person can't stop the whole server from racing. Otherwise you can't do anything when one person starts crashing on purpose.
Of course sometimes people abuse the system and start votes without reason and people vote without thinking. But in my opinion it's better to ban few innocent people here and there than have crashers running rampant. The vote ban is only 24 hours anyway.

after 30 seconds of racing i crashed into some dude and get banned for whole day the funny thing that i get banned by ppl who even didn't saw the whole situation and they vote faster than i could type sorry
I was a little bit disappointed cuz i where banned from rather good server there where 30 racers so i wanted to have some action (and by the action i don't mean ramming ppl)

So i think it should be something like after 3 kick vote ban become available or crasher get auto ban if he gets 3 times kicked.

Quote from breadfan :

I was wondering...are there any (even if unofficial) statistics about the number of crashers online? Or at least crasher incidents? I would like to see if the trend is increasing or not.

official, no. inofficial, i dont think so, because if he wants to record all crashes online, he would have to be on every server . inofficiol, maybe yes, but still i don´t think so.

But it would be damn awsome to see how the demo racers would get owned

Actually I don't think they get somehow owned by rammers or something there is a lot of demo servers where drive cool ppl and all arsehole get ban very quick.
But honestly when played Demo it was so annoying that i was seriously thinking is it worth to spend cash on game where is no rules.
Good thing some dude tell me that with license its look different.
So I think its better for license players not to discourage demo users or ban mindlessly cuz this game wont last long like that.
Which will be rather pity if everyone will be banned everywhere and no new players cuz they will be just annoyed by lack of rules or just bitchy attitude.

Quote from Chupacabras84 :

after 30 seconds of racing i crashed into some dude and get banned for whole day the funny thing that i get banned by ppl who even didn't saw the whole situation and they vote faster than i could type sorry

It's unfortunate when it happens to you. But can you honestly say that this happens all the time? I don't think so, infact it's sometimes hard to get people to vote for kicking a real crasher. I think it's quite rare that someone gets banned without a real reason, especially on licensed servers where you need a lot of people to vote for it.

If a driver only gets a kick when more than 50% see what he did

and vote it will never happen. So I can tell you my way to do this:

After I saw a driver crashing/ramming a couple of times I will just

join when someone else starts kick vote later. This means he will

may be not kicked for what he did right in that moment but for his

driving overall. Greets P V L

Quote from geeman1 :

It's unfortunate when it happens to you. But can you honestly say that this happens all the time?

Nope Cuz this would mean that my drive style is really to blame
But I see often behavior like this and since i remember my first experience with voting I usually ask why should i vote to kick/ban someone, funny thing if i ask usually it stop the voting in half
Dont know is this make ppl think or something

Also from time to time when i hit someone accidently usually the voting initiating instantly even if i say sorry its usually in half of voting or ppl who get ramed dont care bout apologize
So even if it was one accident i lose acces to this server for whole day only cuz some arshole have a bad day.

Quote from geeman1 :

I think it's quite rare that someone gets banned without a real reason, especially on licensed servers where you need a lot of people to vote for it.

Well there was a reason to initiate a vote (The rest was like an avalanche) unfortunately it was quite unfair since ppl just mashed 1 and 30 ppl made it almost simultaneously the speed votes fill the whole screen was really awesome
I wish would i still have replay.

In any case ban is important means to fight with idiots unfortunattely idiots sometimes using it.

So good thing would be to disable ban for users and make that player who gets kicked for 3 times get banned automatically.

I think this is fair and prevent banning ppl for one mistake.
People who initiate voting for some reason usually dont use kick button and dont wait for apologize or explanation in fact they dont wait cuz they dont care bout it cuz they have bad mood or something so even if it wasnt your fault you my get banned anyway.
Actually eysterday i have a accident when dude smash me against the wall and initiate voting agaisnt me, ppl ignore him anyway but often its not end like this.

So I think that disabling ban and make auto-ban with third kick could prevent banning someone only cuz some emo kid had a bad day and now just lookin for occasion to unstress himself.

PVL I see you usually on crash servers didn't expect you would have a dilemma ban someone for crashing or not

You really have to be a jerk to get banned on 30 servers in 30 days. Most people don't play nearly on that many servers, so one would really have to get banned everywhere he goes to reach that number. It's one ban per day, which really isn't that many hours of play to get the ban.

To me, you shouldn't need to be banned on 30 servers to get the master ban. Personally, I can't remember being banned a single time. Most people who'll get the ban probably get it unfairly, and only once (stupid admins, misunderstood situation, etc) because those situations will usually not happen twice. With very much bad luck, somebody might get banned 2 or 3 times unfairly from different servers. More than that, you're probably doing something wrong, and deserve the ban. To me, even 5 bans would be enough to generate a master ban.

Why not have increasing ban durations depending on the number of bans received? For instance, if you get banned 5 times, you get a week. If you get banned 10 times, you get a month, and so forth.

Sry dude stupid idea i was banned twice if i am not in mistake, first time i hit the dude accidentally and get ban and the second time i have a crash with some dude and he vote me i said sorry and all but ppl just voting wonder why he press ban if he could just press kick maybe cuz he have bad mood or something still dont know why ppl also vote i am pretty sure that only few cars could see the situation and it obviously it wasnt intentionnaly simple accident.
There where a few more try to ban me on different servs good thing not all players are no brainers but still the thought of geting banned easily only cuz someone had bad mood, just feel to unsecure about the fact i have to relay on someone mood.

Quote from boosterfire :

Most people who'll get the ban probably get it unfairly, and only once (stupid admins, misunderstood situation, etc)

and that´s why i don´t like banning at all. i think only some (expirienced) racer should be allowed to sart a vote.

Quote from geeman1 :

...especially on licensed servers where you need a lot of people to vote for it.

if i remember correctly its like that, if 15 ppl are on a demo server, 8 need to vote, if 47 ppl are on a s2 server 8 ppl need to vote.

Quote from Chupacabras84 :

PVL I see you usually on crash servers didn't expect you would have a dilemma ban someone for crashing or not

usually he was crusing xxxx hours and some hours racing. but since some time he is just "crashing" (its "crashing" because isnt´s even that mauch crashing than i thougt.... it´s like demo racing, you give someone a push to get in front of him. hard crashes don´t help you anyways)

Quote from John5200 :

ausually he was crusing xxxx hours and some hours racing. but since some time he is just "crashing" (its "crashing" because isnt´s even that mauch crashing than i thougt.... it´s like demo racing, you give someone a push to get in front of him. hard crashes don´t help you anyways)

Dude my English is lam3 I do understand the sentence after reading it a few(more like 10) times but it hurt my brain
Use simpler construction in future

I think MASTER-BAN system should be include IP-Address.

- Still many bad racer and crashers playing now.
- Maybe they have already some DEMO-Account.
- However they got ban, change account and can keep playing.

In fact, when BZFlag implement Master-Ban system, many bad player gone.
http://my.bzflag.org/w/Master_Ban
http://bzflag.org/master-bans.txt

It works good.

Quote from jolzen :

I think MASTER-BAN system should be include IP-Address.

we've had that discussion before, it's not hard to change your ip address... but then if you go for the entire cidr block, you could end up banning people unintentionally, so is a double no-win.

If in CIDR block, Responsibility of the network administrator.
Network admin should establish local rule.
(For example, anti-social acts are prohibited)
In the network user must obey the rule.

{User-name + IP-Address} is not perfect, but can most prevent.

Quote from bunder9999 :

it's not hard to change your ip address...

However, Player can change ip address, but there are limited.
In case of under DHCP, while lease-time, reconnect client gets same IP.

Quote from jolzen :

{User-name + IP-Address} is not perfect, but can most prevent.

Normall user from playing LFS it can prevent.

Quote from jolzen :

However, Player can change ip address
, but there are limited.
In case of under DHCP, while lease-time, reconnect client gets same IP.

Dude don't forget that when player with dynamic IP disconnect someone else my get that IP.
And if crasher with Dynamic IP reconnect he will get new one so its no use. Cuz you don't know is it new user connects or old with new account.
Now ppl being baned on mac address but considering the fact your identity as a player is well known (username) there is no need in anything else

Quote from jolzen :

If in CIDR block, Responsibility of the network administrator.
Network admin should establish local rule.
(For example, anti-social acts are prohibited)
In the network user must obey the rule.

Ok now is it my knowledge to lam3 forgive me i have computer only for 2 years but this sentence doesn't make any sense
Because I don't know what network admin have to do with the game, how he supose to block your adress in game but nowhere else, or what with this anty-social I mean they have this rulle in case of really serious stuff not games....