...... doesn't it seem suspicious that two years in a row they've started off with a semi-good-enough car for the first few races and then when they show up at their home track they've got a world-beater F1 machine all of a sudden?

as i remember last year their car wasn't that great after imola again as well. but maybe i'm remembering incorrectly.illepall

all i know is that this is the second year in a row they've made an incredible improvement for their home race. in fact, it's more of an improvement than most teams ever make with a car package update.

maybe it's just meillepall anyone else see it this way?

speedfreak227

Well its really funny...i really dont understand why sooo many ppl have sooo many problems with ferrari.....they are a good team..and they have showed that several times....schumacher is a brilliant driver...schumi and ferrari were just doing too good....but now things are different...and thats how it is meant to be.....u know rise and fall....if it wasnt that way....F1 wouldnt be interesting....

Now for ur answer....well i dont wanna sound rude here...but what evidence do u have that they are cheats ??? dont get me wrong...but here u sound just like many others who makes comments without any reason or logic behind them....

And ya...if u were by any chance talking about the front wing on the ferrari flexing at higher speeds....then let me make it very clear..its all bullshit...if we look at it that way....then every team has something different from the other in their cars...the cars only look similar...but only on very close observation u find that they all have i high level of detail distinguishing them from others to improve aerodynamics..and lots more....and besides if it were a genuine flaw..the why do u think the FIA aint doing nything about it despite the constant compalints by opponent teams...?????

Besides, it's Ferrari's home track. They have a lot of testing done here. The Ferrari chassis work very well there. It's Scumi's favourite track too, so naturally he'll perform good there. It's a combination of a million small factors. Besides, it's not like he beat the grid by 2 seconds.... Maybe he lucked out?

Ferrari allways puts lot of effort to homeraces, in both of them. Fans are important. And track was sligtly changed this year and I think they could have get some advantage from it because they must have tested there unlike other teams. But lets see the race, they could have used light fuel load. Its just hard to speculate because the fuelburnperiod in quali.

cough cough, wink wink

speedfreak227

i'd love to see them take a ferrari car and put it in a windtunnel for "active" testing.

speedfreak227

Ferrari wern't exactly the class of the field though were they? I mean they done great to win the race in the end with ALonso's pace but they kind of got handed it with the fact that he pitted earlier than scheduled illepall

I wouldn't mind seeing the outcome of this ferrari rear wing situation though, should be interesting.

But IMHO, calling them cheats is a bit..wrong?

Quote from Bawbag :

But IMHO, calling them cheats is a bit..wrong?

Fine...lets call them... bunch of h4x0rs!

Yea!!! ferrari ar3 t3h uber h4xorz!!oneone!!! th3y ar t3h pwnZor ube3r 1337zorzozZ!

Or just unlucky.

Quote from speedfreak227 :

...... doesn't it seem suspicious that two years in a row they've started off with a semi-good-enough car for the first few races and then when they show up at their home track they've got a world-beater F1 machine all of a sudden?

as i remember last year their car wasn't that great after imola again as well. but maybe i'm remembering incorrectly.illepall

all i know is that this is the second year in a row they've made an incredible improvement for their home race. in fact, it's more of an improvement than most teams ever make with a car package update.

maybe it's just meillepall anyone else see it this way?

speedfreak227

Anyone who followed F1 would know last year Michelin made a mistake in tyre choice at Imola, the Michelin runners had their rubbers long gone towards the end of the race, while Bridgestones performed brilliantly especially two thirds onward in the race. That's simply the reason why Schumacher could close up so quickly. And this year, their car is just fast enough to keep Renualt honest.

By the way, the race at Imola is called the San Marino GP, Ferrari sucked big time at last year's Italian GP.

Quote from Bawbag :

Yea!!! ferrari ar3 t3h uber h4xorz!!oneone!!! th3y ar t3h pwnZor ube3r 1337zorzozZ!

is there a website i can visit to learn what that means? some sort of english-web translator?

speedfreak227

canadian translation:
Yea!!! ferrari ar3 t3h uber h4xorz!!oneone!!! th3y ar t3h pwnZor ube3r 1337zorzozZ!, eh?

Quote from Gabkicks :

canadian translation:
Yea!!! ferrari ar3 t3h uber h4xorz!!oneone!!! th3y ar t3h pwnZor ube3r 1337zorzozZ!, eh?

:uglyhamme

Quote from Gabkicks :

canadian translation:
Yea!!! ferrari ar3 t3h uber h4xorz!!oneone!!! th3y ar t3h pwnZor ube3r 1337zorzozZ!, eh?

well why didn't Bawbag say that in the first place eh?illepall

i still don't lie ferrari though.

lemme try MacGuyvering this with my own style.....

1 s+177 d0n`+ 71k3 f3rr4r1 +h0u9h

how's that?

speedfreak227

last year's imola was a fluke because of the notably low track temperture. (if you read this month's F1 racing.)

as for this year, ferrari has been on pace in bahrain as well.

okay, I have to throw my 2 cents into this circle.

First: I don't like ferrari at all. And please don't ask me for the real reason (let's say I don't like the ferrari image)

But the fia rules of 05 said that the rear wing may not deform under the weight of 100kg. I'm not into this aerodynamic stuff but maybe the wind resistance on such a wing gets higher than 100kg, therefor it would be allowed to build a somewhat flexible wing.

Or not?

Quote from der butz :

okay, I have to throw my 2 cents into this circle.

First: I don't like ferrari at all. And please don't ask me for the real reason (let's say I don't like the ferrari image)

But the fia rules of 05 said that the rear wing may not deform under the weight of 100kg. I'm not into this aerodynamic stuff but maybe the wind resistance on such a wing gets higher than 100kg, therefor it would be allowed to build a somewhat flexible wing.

Or not?

I'm pretty sure the test load is more than 100kg. The wings on an F1 car generate a good tonne and a bit of downforce at speed. The rules state that the wing should not move at all as doing so reduces drag whilst maintaining downforce.

At the end of the day, all the teams bend (no pun intended) the rules one way or another as fundamentally that is part of the engineering skill in F1, but the thing that pisses me of is the way that Ferrari so often seem to get away with it.

You get the feeling though (true or not I don't know) that there's a bit of an agreement between Mosely and Ferrari. Look at the way Ferrari were all chummy with the FIA at Indy last year when every single other team (including the other Bridgestone runners) agreed not to race unless something was done to the track. Mosely flat out refused to let Minardi run with older wings at the first race in 2005 threatening that if they did they'd 'never go back to Australia for a race again' and yet here are Ferrari blatently running 'flexi wings' in the first 2 GPs and the FIA are all 'well come on lads.....it's not really right so please be so kind as to just change them a bit if you can in your own time'.

I personally don't like Ferrari. They always side with the FIA and they always get away with stuff. I'd also like Schumacher a bit more if he was actually enthusiastic......I mean come on! You beat Sennas pole record and all you can say it 'Ah...I'm not really bothered about records. They're just numbers. I'm here for the team and the teeeeefooowsi.'

The force applied to the wings in flex testing is 500N (roughly 50kg).

It's pretty simple though, as soon as Ferrari really gets accused of cheating, they'll just return the favor (and rightly so) and we'll have another "multiple-team-wing-upgrading-session", like the one we saw after the first (two?) race(s) of this season.
It's indeed the pott-kettle-black thing going on here.

By changing the used force in testing, to one that's a bit more realistic, they could probably narrow down the opportunities to "cheat legally", at least in this particular area.

more on that topic

speedfreak227

Quote from Lex77 :

The force applied to the wings in flex testing is 500N (roughly 50kg).

It's pretty simple though, as soon as Ferrari really gets accused of cheating, they'll just return the favor (and rightly so) and we'll have another "multiple-team-wing-upgrading-session", like the one we saw after the first (two?) race(s) of this season.
It's indeed the pott-kettle-black thing going on here.

By changing the used force in testing, to one that's a bit more realistic, they could probably narrow down the opportunities to "cheat legally", at least in this particular area.

F1 has always been about which team can bend (pun intended) the rules the best way without getting caught by scrutineering.

That was the case with the Brabham car mentioned in your link, with the lead in the tank used by Tyrell (okay, that was a pretty dumb try ), the wonderbrake by McLaren in 1998 or most recently Renault's launch control which was linked to the jumpstart-control frequencies in 2003 (or was it 2002?), the too wide Michelin tires in 2003 and the double tank used by BAR last year.

Last year, Ferrari was not once accused of cheating. Why? Because they didn't perform. As soon as they start performing again it's the old "nasty Ferrari, they got the FIA in their boat and who can't see that must be blind" routine again. For a Ferrari fan, that is a good thing. It shows that they are a force to be reckoned with again.

They got accused of it in the first few GPs though where they were doing rubbish! People just noticed the flexing from the onboard cams. You could see daylight appearing between the wing elements and the nose!

Quote from ArosaMike :

They got accused of it in the first few GPs though where they were doing rubbish! People just noticed the flexing from the onboard cams. You could see daylight appearing between the wing elements and the nose!

yeah, they have had it all season and it was easy to see.

when ITV showed the front wing cam, you could see the element coming away from the nose, thus the wing was flexing.

i australia at one point you could clearly see the renaults front wing flexing, ALOT, but no-one from the commentry team picked up on it.. maybe i can find a vid.

http://img2.imagepile.net/images/11581054.gif

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/8926/sinttulo16ua.gif


Watch them!

thats the one man!!