Quote from Vain :

I really dislike street courses. I want to see touring cars at Spa, Hockenheim, Dijon, Nürburgring, etc.

I agree, to a point. Street circuits are ok, but they are more and more becoming dominant, which is a shame when we have tracks with so much history to race on. But... I guess that if people wont come to the races, the races will have to come to the people...

Quote from Bean0 :

I think it was John Cleland on Eurosport yesterday discussing it with the other commentator who summed it up perfectly...Diesels just don't stir the soul like a high revving NA engine. It is this effect on people that draws them to motorsport in the first place - the noise, the smell. With the diesel cars it's all a bit 'Meh'.

.

Personally I don't give a monkeys.. I'm for the action on the track.. It could all be played out in silence for all I care. IMO, if diesels are an advantage then the other teams should just get their act together and go the same way.

I just don't see what the big deal is about personally..

Both are internal combustion engines.
Both are Hydrocarbon based fuels.

Anyone would have thought people were complaining about the addition of a completely different form of advanced propulsion and energy production system, (introduced by some advanced alien race), the way some people are going on about this thing. When in fact we're talking about a minor difference in the fuel and the way it's combusted.

Quote from gezmoor :

I just don't see what the big deal is about personally..

Both are internal combustion engines.
Both are Hydrocarbon based fuels.

And both use turbo...oh wait.

Quote from Blackout :

And both use turbo...oh wait.

Oh yes and the turbo give a power advantage to the diesels.... oh wait

The argument about Turbo use is disingenous and you know it. The diesel engines have a power disadvantage when not turbo'd. The only way that they can be on equitable terms with petrol engines is to be turbo charged.

Plus they are given a weight penalty.

Simple fact of the matter is that diesel engines have a better torque curve for racing on a lot of circuits. Any manufacturer that wants to stick their heads in the sand over "loyalty" or such other facile reasons for sticking with petrol engines as have been stated in this forum deserve to loose. In racing, to win you have to be pragmatic and go with what wins irrespective of how you "feel" about it.

Same thing happened in motorcycle racing with the introduction of the Ducatis and their V twins. They made slightly less power than the Japanese bikes with their inline fours and were even heavier yet they dominated the racing for a long time because their power delivery gave them an advantage on a typical race circuit. Lots of teams just swapped manufacturers to remain competitive. Then the rules were adjusted slightly and the inline fours regained competitiveness and now bike racing is very balanced despite using completely different engine configurations. Same will happen with car racing. Eventually they will get the overall competitive balance right through regulation changes.

Quote from Whitmore :

LOL - do you not know the racing history of Porto and Pau?

Of course I do. I also know the history of Monaco and Surfers Paradise and the likes. I'm not saying Street Circuits are without history, I'm saying that enough is enough, time to use some proper road courses for what they where intended for, namely good racing

Quote from gezmoor :

Simple fact of the matter is that turbo engines have a better torque curve for racing on a lot of circuits.

Fixed that for you...

Quote from gezmoor :

Personally I don't give a monkeys.. I'm for the action on the track.. It could all be played out in silence for all I care. IMO, if diesels are an advantage then the other teams should just get their act together and go the same way.

I just don't see what the big deal is about personally..

Both are internal combustion engines.
Both are Hydrocarbon based fuels.

Anyone would have thought people were complaining about the addition of a completely different form of advanced propulsion and energy production system, (introduced by some advanced alien race), the way some people are going on about this thing. When in fact we're talking about a minor difference in the fuel and the way it's combusted.

This is true, but if they had more high to mid speed races it would be pretty close.

The other teams can't complain though, if this was F1 everyone would be using deisel by now, just like with the double defusers and such.

Quote from bbman :

Fixed that for you...

No you didn't fix anything. Turbo'd engines do generally have wider torque curves, but a diesel engine has an inherent low rpm torque advange over a petrol engine of the same capacity. Plus the turbo can be configured in such a way as to have no affect on the torque curve at low rpms so as not to give any "added" advatage over and above that which diesel would inherently have. So the advantage is not purely down to the turbo, it's predominantly down to the inherent nature of the way a diesel makes torque. The turbo is used to balance the disadvantage of the lower high rpm torque/power output vs a petrol engine.

Or at least that is how they could be implemented. Not knowing the exact details of the implimentation on the actual cars we can't do anything more than speculate.

haha those TDI suckers now cry cause they have to use the legal turbo pressure.

Its just not possible to let turbocharged and naturally aspirated engines racing aginst each other, they will always been unbalanced.

Ban the Diesel from Motorsport, they have nothing to do there, motorsport needs screaming petrol engines.

SC crash.

Quote from zeugnimod :

SC crash.

What a noob SC driver.

What the Hell was the SC Driver doing there?

rofl your joking right gotta see a video of this.

i hope that safety car driver gets sent the bill for Engstlers BMW because he was definately on for the win.

Unbelieveable! :doh:

A couple of years ago at Croft, the BTCC medical car went off right in front of me. Not quite as spectacular as this one, but it took quite a trip through the gravel, only just getting itself out!

Higher quality vid, thanks to TBK's Echti

Quote from Timdpr :

Unbelieveable! :doh:

A couple of years ago at Croft, the BTCC medical car went off right in front of me. Not quite as spectacular as this one, but it took quite a trip through the gravel, only just getting itself out!

Higher quality vid, thanks to TBK's Echti

What you don't see in that video is that the guy who is standing at the end of the pit lane waves the safety car out with a "GO" type gesture.

Still, it's a ridiculous thing to have happen regardless of whose fault it is.

Quote from Töki (HUN) :

What a noob SC driver.

Who knew Joe Ellis drove the WTCC Safety Car?

Contrary to popular belief, I was not driving the Safety Car



Even I'm not that bad...

Quote from J@tko :

Who knew Joe Ellis drove the WTCC Safety Car?

I know Joe owns a failboat himself, but he's nowhere as tard as the WTCC SC driver

EDIT: Joe's developing his SC skillz: Online at: [TC] CityDriving Montana

Hilarious!

Seriously... what the hell. WTCC has still some surprises in that chaos of first lap which is quite usual for this series. ad that sc driver, I think it wasn't only his fault, but what was his fault was defiinitely not respecting the leaving pit line, going straight into the racing line was just very very stupid...

Quote from Mysho :

but what was his fault was defiinitely not respecting the leaving pit line, going straight into the racing line was just very very stupid...

Indeed.

He stays on the right off the racing line, Engstler sees him, brakes and stays behind the SC. I wonder what he thought. :/

EDIT: Not working.

(Quite large size. Thanks to TBK's Mattzel89 this time.)

Quote from Timdpr :

Speaking of the first lap, here's a vid of it.

(Quite large size. Thanks to TBK's Mattzel89 this time.)

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