I'm not 100% sure where to put this, so "general" seemed like the best place. I didn't put this in the improvement forum because I'm not sure that my analysis/gut feeling is actually correct. If I'm completely wrong please let me know.

I mostly drive the FOX so my argument really stems from my experience in that car (though I don't think anything but the FOX, FBM and MRT5 even have R1s). It seems to me like R1s are almost useless as tires in a race. It is *possible* to race with R1s on the longer and more open circuits but they heat up far too fast for most of the tighter circuits.

It seems like we have a tire compound that is good for 2 or 3 laps at 10/10ths and maybe good at a longer race if you baby the tires the first 5-10 laps. This doesn't seem entirely realistic. In F1 the softest compounds were hard enough to last for a good stint at Monaco, completely the opposite of a long and open track.

I feel that ALL available slick tires for the cars that they're available for should be able to do at least one stint in a race without going through a "holy crap it's all red I have to go slow" stage. I don't know of any real racing series that brings tires that are only useful for 2 or 3 laps (no, drag racers don't count) before they fall off into a horrible oblivion of redness.


As I don't do much with the GTRs, FO8 and BF1 I don't know if the R2s for them are the same way as R1s for the FOX, but I suspect that they are. If that is the case then my point should also apply to that situation.

Quote from pik_d :

I'm not 100% sure where to put this, so "general" seemed like the best place. I didn't put this in the improvement forum because I'm not sure that my analysis/gut feeling is actually correct. If I'm completely wrong please let me know.

I mostly drive the FOX so my argument really stems from my experience in that car (though I don't think anything but the FOX, FBM and MRT5 even have R1s). It seems to me like R1s are almost useless as tires in a race. It is *possible* to race with R1s on the longer and more open circuits but they heat up far too fast for most of the tighter circuits.

It seems like we have a tire compound that is good for 2 or 3 laps at 10/10ths and maybe good at a longer race if you baby the tires the first 5-10 laps. This doesn't seem entirely realistic. In F1 the softest compounds were hard enough to last for a good stint at Monaco, completely the opposite of a long and open track.

I feel that ALL available slick tires for the cars that they're available for should be able to do at least one stint in a race without going through a "holy crap it's all red I have to go slow" stage. I don't know of any real racing series that brings tires that are only useful for 2 or 3 laps (no, drag racers don't count) before they fall off into a horrible oblivion of redness.


As I don't do much with the GTRs, FO8 and BF1 I don't know if the R2s for them are the same way as R1s for the FOX, but I suspect that they are. If that is the case then my point should also apply to that situation.

You do realise that r1 equals the tyres U use for like this qualify shoots of 2 laps?

Quote from Chrisuu01 :

You do realise that r1 equals the tyres U use for like this qualify shoots of 2 laps?

Are you talking about patch U or do you mean "you" as in what people would use in real life racing?

If you mean "you" what racing series has tires that are meant only for 2 lap qualifying runs?

What´s wrong with the fact that the MRT5 has R1s? A better question would be why it has also R2s and R3s. You´d never ever be able to get them up to temperature.

Quote from pik_d :

if you mean "you" what racing series has tires that are meant only for 2 lap qualifying runs?

f1 1986

(:d)

Quote from pik_d :

Are you talking about patch U or do you mean "you" as in what people would use in real life racing?

If you mean "you" what racing series has tires that are meant only for 2 lap qualifying runs?

Non at the moment but F1 and Formula 3 used to have them

Quote from Chrisuu01 :

Non at the moment but F1 and Formula 3 used to have them

Back in patch X R1s and R2s were the business.

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

Back in patch X R1s and R2s were the business.

Are you drunk of to much Jack daniels by any chance( like I am right now)

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

What´s wrong with the fact that the MRT5 has R1s? A better question would be why it has also R2s and R3s. You´d never ever be able to get them up to temperature.

Yeah, but at least R2s and R3s don't allow for suicide runs.

Quote from boothy :

f1 1986

(:d)

That's older than I am. If a top level motorsport gave up on something like this 23 years ago why does LFS have it?

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

Back in patch X R1s and R2s were the business.

Yeah I was thinking about that as I made this. I think the R1s may have gone too far away from being a useful tire when they were changed.

Quote from pik_d :

Yeah I was thinking about that as I made this. I think the R1s may have gone too far away from being a useful tire when they were changed.

I didn´t have a S2 licence back then but I tried it last week, just for fun. Nearly all the setups had the softest available tyre compound and were very soft to make the tyres last. Was alot nicer to drive than with what we´ve got now. But the biggest problem for me is, in patch X I can keep the tyres in a sort of temperature window, which makes them usable for longer races. In patch Y and Z they just seem to get hotter and hotter and hotter, and it seems you can´t do anything about it.

Drive smoother. R2s on the FOX are perfect if you've got the right set, but with R1s yeah that's exactly what I'm talking about. The tires just don't seem to work in a race, especially on the tighter tracks like any Fern Bay or South City course.

Quote from pik_d :

Drive smoother.

R2s are useless for racing with the GTRs nowadays. It could work on AS3 but you´ll have to drive very careful and very smooth which I can´t.

i think its everything ok with R1's R2's and etc. I think we can expect some changes in new patch because as scawen said there is going realy seeible changes in phisics engine so tryres work will change too i think

Quote from oldnavy :

i think its everything ok with R1's R2's and etc. I think we can expect some changes in new patch because as scawen said there is going realy seeible changes in phisics engine so tryres work will change too i think

Or we will all have to drive around with R3s and R4s.

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

Or we will all have to drive around with R3s and R4s.

Actualy i dont think that anyone is using or hoping to use R1's in race its only for hotlaping, yea actualy i saw ppl driving 50 laps at BL1 with FBM +1sec of the wr no pit with R2 or R1 so i think its posible but you need to have talent and its like to ask please make driving easiyer i cant get close to wr, change your driving stile to more steady and r1 will be nice with you

R1s can certainly last longer on the FBM than the FOX. Try doing 50 laps at BL1 in the FOX on R1s doing consistant 1:08.7x, simply not gonna happen.

Quote from pik_d :

R1s can certainly last longer on the FBM than the FOX. Try doing 50 laps at BL1 in the FOX on R1s doing consistant 1:08.7x, simply not gonna happen.

R1s can work very well on the FOX. I once did a 1 hour drive on FE2 with R1s. Yes, they were cooking at some point, but I found a technique to get around this problem without losing too much pace.

you used to be able to do stints (1hr) with r2's (which is the softest tyre in gtr's). now it's tough to do it with r3's. i'm not sure why that is, but basically the r3's get too hot straight away, then cool down too much by the end of the stint. r1's (r2's for bigger cars) are too soft because you can't even get a lap out of them.. if you say that you can then you're not driving fast enough!

Quote from [DUcK] :

you used to be able to do stints (1hr) with r2's (which is the softest tyre in gtr's). now it's tough to do it with r3's. i'm not sure why that is, but basically the r3's get too hot straight away, then cool down too much by the end of the stint. r1's (r2's for bigger cars) are too soft because you can't even get a lap out of them.. if you say that you can then you're not driving fast enough!

I had that experience aswell on the new TDRT PE server last week on saturday on AS3. The tyres were nicely on temperature after a couple of laps. But as soon as they got a bit worn, they cooled down so quickly, I understeered threw every turn, trying to heat them up again. R2s are the other way round. They get hot very quickly, but you can´t cool them down again.

The softest tyres in LFS is by far too soft in my opinion. I know that some setups are looked as unrealistic due to various things, but red after 2-3 laps on blackwood for example, just doesn't seem right to me. And if you mean that you just need to take it slower we are talking cruising to not heat up the tyres. And who can affort driving 6-8 seconds slower lap times all the way just to avoid the tyres from going red and lose all it's grip. And it doesn't cool down either, it just heats more and more up til it eventually exploades.

Quote from The Very End :

The softest tyres in LFS is by far too soft in my opinion. I know that some setups are looked as unrealistic due to various things, but red after 2-3 laps on blackwood for example, just doesn't seem right to me. And if you mean that you just need to take it slower we are talking cruising to not heat up the tyres. And who can affort driving 6-8 seconds slower lap times all the way just to avoid the tyres from going red and lose all it's grip. And it doesn't cool down either, it just heats more and more up til it eventually exploades.

2-3 laps with FBM @ BL1? Man your driving style is even harder on the tyres than mine.Some cars can handle overheating tyres. I can handle them in the FOX. Just drive every corner in a higher gear and stear a bit smoother, that could help once your tyres started melting. Atleast it does for me.

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

2-3 laps with FBM @ BL1? Man your driving style is even harder on the tyres than mine.Some cars can handle overheating tyres. I can handle them in the FOX. Just drive every corner in a higher gear and stear a bit smoother, that could help once your tyres started melting. Atleast it does for me.

Mainly the FOX/BF1/GTR are the problem
My driving style is smooth, but very agressive, so I would understand if it overheated on lets say under 10 laps, but 2-3 laps is just overdoing it IMO

Why should R1s be used in a race? They are obviously too soft so no one is going to use them so everyone is in the same boat. Just use them for qualifying and don't complain!

The real problem is MRT R2 and FZR R2 being the same. Though tyres of different cars differ in size, the "compounds" are still the same. Simply unbelievable.

If we really want to gave the same compound on different cars the same name, we need more compound levels. Maybe R1-R7 ? MRT R1-R3 and FZR R4-R7.

LFS has many unrealistic setup options like 0.001 step gear ratio, 0.01 step parallel steer, and super wide-range customizable suspension, so a "hotlap tyre" is not a problem at all.

Quote from sil3ntwar :

Why should R1s be used in a race? They are obviously too soft so no one is going to use them so everyone is in the same boat. Just use them for qualifying and don't complain!

And the server runners can ban R1 if they think it's unrealistic.

I've just entered a FOX league where we have to use R1s and R2s so

Also the main point is why do we have a tire that is useless in a race? I think it's a bit silly to have quali-only tires when real racing series haven't used such a tire for 23 years. It is a sim afterall.