Quote from TiJay :

So these: http://www.c1store.co.uk/store ... 2f0e00705ffe7f30e6305539c are a bad idea?

Also, would Greenstuff pads on a normal car improve braking, or would it suck until they got temperature?

EBC don't make brake pads. They made things the same size and shape as brake pads but they aren't good for braking.

Having said that, they don't require warming up, so 'work' on the road. But they'll be no better than a budget unbranded pad, except about 20 times the price.

Some motorcyclists like EBC pads. I assume they are either morons that haven't tried different pads, or that the requirments of a bike pad are sufficiently different from a car pad that they are acceptable.

Quote from tristancliffe :

EBC don't make brake pads. They made things the same size and shape as brake pads but they aren't good for braking.

Having said that, they don't require warming up, so 'work' on the road. But they'll be no better than a budget unbranded pad, except about 20 times the price.

Some motorcyclists like EBC pads. I assume they are either morons that haven't tried different pads, or that the requirments of a bike pad are sufficiently different from a car pad that they are acceptable.

lmfao mate EBC pads are very good on the road unless ur a tailgating type of driver, on the road i barely ever use my brakes i have tryed a few types of pads on my car and EBC are the best so far (to costly yes) but still better then the others i have tryed

btw im using RED's not greens and it works fine on the road can easly lock all 4 wheels on semi slicks 255x45x17 310mm rotors when cold

I haven't had any issues with the greenstuffs, apart from they are a bit wooden when cold, which i'd expect anyway. Might try some project mu or endless later tho, they're only about another $100 a set for road pads. What was your gripe with them tristan?

Anything that doesn't work better when it has warmed up is absolute trash.

OEM/Factory brake pads and cheap tyres then

Quote from TiJay :

So these: http://www.c1store.co.uk/store ... 2f0e00705ffe7f30e6305539c are a bad idea?

Also, would Greenstuff pads on a normal car improve braking, or would it suck until they got temperature?

If your mainly going to drive the car at normal road conditions, then i would recommend just replacing your disc and pads with normal OE stuff. It would work out cheaper, and the car will be running the right parts.

My comment about the disc's possibly cracking is true, but it only applies if your really really hard on them. For normal road driving, they will be fine.

As for the pads, it all depends on what type of material they use. I once had some Greenstuff pads on my Mondeo V6 before i put the AP Racing kit on there (Don't kill me Tristan! I got the Green's for free!) and i can confidently say they were the WORST pads i have ever felt when cold, and they felt no better than the standard pads i had in when warm. They were seriously scary when cold.

Anyhow, it's your choice as it's your car, but i would recommend just replacing them with OE parts. Oh, also put some higher grade brake fluid in there. That will improve the brake feel a little and won't cost much.

Thanks, I just saw the GS pads and drilled discs for a reasonable price and thought about fitting them to give more stopping power, but as they'll make very little difference and the discs will probably crack, I'll leave it.

Quote from Nathan_French_14 :

I once had some Greenstuff pads on my Mondeo V6 before i put the AP Racing kit on there (Don't kill me Tristan! I got the Green's for free!) and i can confidently say they were the WORST pads i have ever felt when cold, and they felt no better than the standard pads i had in when warm. They were seriously scary when cold.

lol the more i think about it, you're right, they're ****ing average when "warm" because it takes a little bit of application for them to heat up and work properly. I usually drive up the street when i first get in the car with my left foot resting on the brake to let them warm up. Pads are due for a changeout in the next couple months anyway, might be time to try something else....

Quote from tristancliffe :

EBC don't make brake pads. They made things the same size and shape as brake pads but they aren't good for braking.

Having said that, they don't require warming up, so 'work' on the road. But they'll be no better than a budget unbranded pad, except about 20 times the price.

Some motorcyclists like EBC pads. I assume they are either morons that haven't tried different pads, or that the requirments of a bike pad are sufficiently different from a car pad that they are acceptable.

I've heard much the same regarding EBC pads for bikes. Riders who really work their brakes hard won't touch them. Even the racers sponsored by EBC run pads from a different brand. The guys who don't work them as hard say EBC are fine.

Regarding catastrophic rotor failure, I've only heard of one case on a bike (all modern sportbikes have drilled rotors up front, one on each side of the front wheel). It was a very old rotor with way too much wear and it disintegrated. I'm not sure if it was OEM or aftermarket.

Quote :

Pads are due for a changeout in the next couple months anyway, might be time to try something else....

Let me know if you find some

Endless or Projuct Mu make pads for my car. Other people with the same car have said they are a better option than the EBC stuff. But it's about $500 for a full set.

http://www.project-mu.com.au/en/products/pad_bspec.php

or maybe the HC+, but i'd like to try the bspec first.

Re: Cracking rotors. You know when you go to get a roadworthy certificate, and they measure the thickness of the disc, and if it's worn down too much it's unroadworthy? That's because they are scared of excessive heatsoak; less meat to spread the effect of the friction over - the theory is if that occurs pretty severely, the rotor will disintegrate

Speaking of rotor thickness & wear... hehehehe

Quote from MAD3.0LT :

lmfao mate EBC pads are very good on the road unless ur a tailgating type of driver, on the road i barely ever use my brakes i have tryed a few types of pads on my car and EBC are the best so far (to costly yes) but still better then the others i have tryed

btw im using RED's not greens and it works fine on the road can easly lock all 4 wheels on semi slicks 255x45x17 310mm rotors when cold

Sorry, what? Are you accusing me of tailgating? Are you accusing me of using my brakes too much?

If you try not to use your brakes, then shit pads will seem good to you. But when you need them, you'll find that most other pads are as good (but cheaper) or better (and maybe still cheaper). Maybe EBC don't sell EBC pads where you live - maybe they buy decent pads, pop them in an EBC box and pretend. But in Europe I'd question the sanity of anyone who chooses to fit EBC pads to their car - for road or track.

Quote from Hezath :

Speaking of rotor thickness & wear... hehehehe

If I recall, the supposed reason for the thing in the picture was a combination of left foot braking and stuck brakes.

didn't know anything about the history, just saw it a while ago on a forum that I frequent.

haha i'd guess burnout + no line locker + using foot brake to hold car in position. once they weld themselves, thats pretty much it.

Tristan - if you don't like EBC, how about telling us what YOU would choose given the choice, on a road car, that does the odd track/skidpan day.

From one of the following springs to mind. Mintex, Pagid, Ferodo, Endless (I believe these are an aquired taste; some people rave about them, others find them a bit odd - I've not tried them) or Carbon Metallic. I believe Brembo and, more recently, AP also make (or at least market) their own brand of pads, but I've not tried these.

Compound will also make a difference. A road pad (used at all on the road) MUST work from stone cold at at least 90% efficiency. A track pad will barely do anything for the first lap (and is thus totally stupid to use on the road). There are compounds that work from cold and can stand a bit of track use, but the exact compound will depend on your car, your braking style, and your modifications.

Slotted give the brake dust created somewhere to go giving you better performance,

Iv never ran a drillied rotor

Actually, no. The brake dust comes out of the back of the pad and blows away. The grooves are more to do with clearing the gases and 'flame front' (even though it's not a flame, but it was the best similar term I could think of), stopping the pad from 'hydroplaning'

Well, drilled rotors will decrease unsprung weight, which can have a big effect on the way the steering feels if enough weight is taken off, but I have no idea how much weight drilled actually takes off. Probably not that much. Should give a bit more bite too.

I've tried drilled, slotted and plain rotors on karts (all dual "vented" rotors) and honestly if I didn't know they were different I probably wouldn't be able to tell you which is which through pedal feel. Pads make a much bigger difference in pedal feel in my experience.

Remember we're talking some plain jane run of the mill plastic bubble here, he won't notice any difference in the unsprung weight (not denying that unsprung weight is important, but not in this instance).

I don't think cross-drilled rotors will give any more bite, I think in this scenario they would just be a big wank.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Actually, no. The brake dust comes out of the back of the pad and blows away. The grooves are more to do with clearing the gases and 'flame front' (even though it's not a flame, but it was the best similar term I could think of), stopping the pad from 'hydroplaning'

Well put

looks like brake dust in there after a race

Quote from Hezath :

Remember we're talking some plain jane run of the mill plastic bubble here, he won't notice any difference in the unsprung weight (not denying that unsprung weight is important, but not in this instance).

I don't think cross-drilled rotors will give any more bite, I think in this scenario they would just be a big wank.

I'm not in the least bit concerned about weight at all. In anyway. I had always thought that drilled was for heat, but it seems that that is mostly a myth, and that slotted are more effective on that front. Glad to have learned something.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Some motorcyclists like EBC pads. I assume they are either morons that haven't tried different pads, or that the requirments of a bike pad are sufficiently different from a car pad that they are acceptable.

To be fair, motorcycle brakes don't need to produce anywhere near the same levels of stopping power as car brakes, for obvious reasons.

EBC brakes are actually very popular amongst motorcyclists, (at least they used to be), and although not necessarily the best around are usually more than adequate for road use and actually cheaper than OEM replacement pads in most cases, (though that also may have changed over the last ten years since I rode :shrug.

Radial diameter and caliper/piston/pad area are the two most important factors re improving brakes, (all other things being equal that is). So generally speaking first "upgrade" is to put bigger discs in, (if possible), and bugger the extra weight.