The online racing simulator
Quote from Intrepid :That's not what the rule book states. Brundle in commentary pretty much laid it out.

But as I said, nothing have ever been done about it. So obviously they think that's alright.

And from the rules (thanks for the link botthy):
Quote :In order to avoid the likelihood of accidents before the safety car returns to the pits, from the point at which the lights on the car are turned out drivers must proceed at a pace which involves no erratic acceleration or braking nor any other manoeuvre which is likely to endanger other drivers or impede the restart.

He didn't do any erratic acceleration or braking.
And as I said above, such manoeuvre was never deemed to be endangering other drivers or impeding a restart before...
Why should that suddenly be the case now~?
Quote from JCTK :But as I said, nothing have ever been done about it. So obviously they think that's alright.

And from the rules (thanks for the link botthy):


He didn't do any erratic acceleration or braking.
And as I said above, such manoeuvre was never deemed to be endangering other drivers or impeding a restart before...
Why should that suddenly be the case now~?

There was a clarification after 2007 with Hamilton. Button practically stopped his car nearly causing cars to rear end each other. That's erratic in my opinion. You can't just stop the car
Guys...stop asking for penalty we need to congratulate them because for one time there was some fight ! This is what we ike and what we want.

that was an awesome race with lot of move !

If you don't like the way Hamilton, Vettel or Button drive I think you need to see several videos from some formula one master like Gilles Villeneuve, René Arnoux (Dijon 1979 for example), Ayrton Senna vs Alain Prost...

Last time I saw a race so exiting it was at Francorchamps and FIA decided to give Hamilton some penalty whereas his fight with Raïkkonen was just one of the best of ever !
Quote from JCTK :Vettel was pushing Lewis on the inside at that too,

But he wasnt driving that stupid like Hamilton trying to pass on the inside, he was quite close to the wall.

imo this should be a penalty, but as they already said there will be an investigation by the stewards


btw: i am not against hamilton, it's just my objective opinion to this incident.
Quote from Intrepid :There was a clarification after 2007 with Hamilton. Button practically stopped his car nearly causing cars to rear end each other. That's erratic in my opinion. You can't just stop the car

Agree that it did look pretty slow on the TV.

But the race stewards obviously still think there're nothing wrong enough to justify a penalty for that.

PS. yeah the drivers love to gang up on Lewis. And Lewis definitly didn't make much friends over the years...
Other drivers gang up on Lewis so much that they think his weaving last time out should be penalised... When you said something harsh about anyone asking for DTs shouldn't be watching F1...
It wasn't erratic if you look purely at the definition though. He slowed consistently and predictibly, not erratically. You can also interpret the "causing danger to other drivers" bit in different ways; he didn't brake-test anyone and at such low speeds no one was in a real state of danger.

Mind you, I also think it wasn't nice and caused a situation that should be prevented by rules, but I don't think those rules are in place currently. If they are, then they are still not specific enough.
Quote from Timo1992 :But he wasnt driving that stupid like Hamilton trying to pass on the inside, he was quite close to the wall.

imo this should be a penalty, but as they already said there will be an investigation by the stewards


btw: i am not against hamilton, it's just my objective opinion to this incident.

That's why I said they were both a bit naughty.

Lewis shouldn't be there, Vettel shouldn't be pushing him towards the pit garages. But I don't have a clue what the stewards are going to do through...

Traditionally they penalise someone for going out right in front of someone else. But they havn't clarify what's the situation of pulling out right beside someone, and trying to go down the lane beside someone.
Having watched the video again I can see why he escaped punishment, despite causing carnage behind.
Penalties penalties penalties.....

Cracking race! Mclaren 1-2. Hell yes, slap in the face for RB.
Amazing drives from both Jenson and Lewis, that was some race.
My only comment on that kind of racing is: penalties after the race ? It happened in lap 5, make a decission based on the rules and get done with it. ****ing FIA / race marshalls, losing all their credibility like that with me. Plus the stuff in front of the pits is cool for me, the stuff inside pits with Vettel and Hamilton there is a big no - safety in the pitlane above racing, it's not like it was the last lap or something. The steering into last turn, going full over grind and white lane back into the pits of Hamilton there is also eyebrown frowning to me, should give him a penalty or warning at least (not sure what pit entry white line rules state exactly ?). For the rest I didn't saw anything penaliseable. Some heavy going to the outside pushing here and there but... that's the racers themselfs who cause it. Racer A pushed B out wide now, next race B won't be gentle for A anymore - they make their own reputation and consequences for their behavior, no need for rules to interfere (or even worse knowing FIA: to pick sides!). Reminds me to that NASCAR affaire not long ago (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/82267).

Petrov did nice, then again he had fresh rubber. Too bad Webber made an error, would prefer to have seen them racing for it to see Petrov's value (Webber had also new rubber). Then again, errors or not making errors is also part of the racing!

Mclaren: rules don't count for them
Ferrari: failers, kick massa out
RedBull: fast, but tactic is failing
Renault: simple, but good
Force India: dropped a bit this race, but overall good
Mercedes GP: good, but just that bit not fast enough
Rest go home ffs and let me sleep with these lame Asian GPs.
A very entertaining race. No penalties should be given, however Hamilton was in the "wrong" exiting the pit box, Vettel simply held his line firmly. But It was damn fine racing, so let them race and stop whining on about penalties where there is no such need for any. Hamilton is damn stubborn, and its great, he is always good for excitement on track.
It was definitely an entertaining race, which is usually the case when rain is involved. On the topic of penalties and reckless driving I notice nobody has mentioned Alonso's move on Massa when entering the pits. In fact thinking about it there were a lot of dangerous moves made by people entering the pits.
And nothing about unsafe pit-enter?
What the hell did Vettel do that was dangerous? He had been ahead and was already in the fast lane of the pits whilst Hamilton was not. . . Still retarded it wasn't sorted during the race.
Poor Truli Hydraulics problem appears again (to lotus team :chair: FIX THAT CAR)
Quote from blackbird04217 :What the hell did Vettel do that was dangerous? He had been ahead and was already in the fast lane of the pits whilst Hamilton was not. . . Still retarded it wasn't sorted during the race.

Vettel was squeezing Hamilton uneccesarily in the pitlane, he was right over to the right of the fast lane. He even moved further over to the right, there was no need for that, if he'd of just driven the pitlane normally Hamilton would've got a penalty and he would've got off lightly.

Hamilton drove outside the pit entrance and then cut infront of Vettel, that is what he probrably got his penalty for (aside from the fact that he is Lewis Hamilton). :rolleyes:

Bah, safety rules have gone over the top, to the point where excitement is seen as dangerous.
Quote from ekze :And nothing about unsafe pit-enter?

Unsafe pit-enter~?
Never heard of it before...

Nothing is unsafe regarding that as long as they braked in time for the speed limiter, and don't breach it on the gravel on the entrance~
As has been said here, and in autosport, we've all been asking for some excitement and racing and then, when drivers start challenging each other hard, people get all stroppy and start asking for penalties, no one ever moaned about weaving durring the 70's or forcing people over the curbs and back then you could race down a generally much narrower pitlane at race speeds whils there were far more journalists etc standing there.

whilst we obviously don't want to go back to some of the wild driving from back then, we shouldn't go over the top when we get two drivers who actually want to challenge each other, same as webber in australia when he hit hamilton, he thought there might have been a chance of grabbing a place whilst the other two got tangled up and got sucked in, if he had held back and the others had been very slow out of the corner he'd have been slaughtered for not getting close enough to take advantage. if you do decide to restart penalising rather than warning then where do you draw the line, could alonso have caused a crash by passing in the pit entrance before the limit line ? if so then what if he did it at a circuit where the pit entrance doesn't give you the space and you run the risk of cars making contact and loosing control and hitting marshalls etc?

at china alonso's move was safe, similarly hamilton and vettel was safe enough, they were released almost at the same time and the "fast lane" in china is wide enough for 2 cars, vettel should have given hamilton room but his reason to hold towards the right was understandable as hamilton wanted to be in a position to take the inside lane into turn 1, hamilton should have given up on his move earlier but hey they, and alonso, were racing and trying on a circuit with room. if they or alonso had tried the same things at monaco then they would have deserved severe penalties, button's move with the safety car could have caused chaos at monaco and i'd expect a penalty if it was done there. as it was he needed to make space before the run to the final bend as the safety car line was before the bend and he could have been vulnerable, as it was, vettel moved on hamilton which resulted in webber being pushed wide but once again they were racing and if people try to pass then you will get contact etc, just watch any of the 70's races and see how often contact resulted in races, anyone else remember the hunt - andretti incident and the " we don't pass on the outside in F1" comment ?

personally i think that this season with an exdriver sitting with the stewards has seen a welcome change in attitude with drivers being given the equivilent of football's yellow card rather than the over zealous showing of the red card equivilent of stop and goes, drive throughs, grid penalties etc. keep the penalties for when a drivers actions results in another driver's race being damaged, when a driver cuts a corner repeatedly, jumps a start or speeds in the pitlane or when becuse of the nature of where an incident takes place there is a risk of injurry to marshalls, mechanics spectators etc.
I agree on the whole, although I do think the McLaren/RBR pit exit was dangerous. What if they had touched and spun into the pit-equipment or mechanics? It looks slow on the TV, but they're still going at about 60 mph or whatever. As a pedestrian if you get hit at 60 mph you chance of survival in about 0.1% (non-scientific). Young hot-headed guys shouldn't be messing around challenging each other in those sorts of situations. Sure, maybe the lollipop guy was in the wrong, but either of them could have gotten out of it and happily resolved the situation. Anyway, it was a racing incident, and I wouldn't have expected much different from a couple of twenty-year-olds.

Another great race and another smart drive by Button. I was sceptical at first, but the non-refuelling has put strategy much more into the driver's hands, and I think we're seeing far more tactical driving (as opposed to team tactics) than we were before. So far it's all good and I'm happy to have been silenced.
Highlight of the race for me was Alonso's opportunistic move on Massa coming into the pitlane - that just epitomises what Ferrari have been missing the last few years.

re: penalties, I think the discussion should be less about the pit release, that's pretty common and is a mixed bag as to whether it gets punished, but that fact the Hamilton turned around and drove pretty much drove the wrong way to get into the pitlane.. how the hell he didn't get penalised for that i'll never know

I liked the general lenience of penalties this race - racing incidents should be racing incidents, let the drivers sort things out among themselves. But that was just reckless and dangerous.
Quote from DarkTimes :I agree on the whole, although I do think the McLaren/RBR pit exit was dangerous.

Motor racing is dangerous.
Quote from 5haz :Motor racing is dangerous.

So it's OK to be reckless if what you are doing is inherently dangerous? If you're doing something risky, you should go out of your way to ensure the safety of others.

FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG