Quote from AndRand :

just curious, how come? Aren't mods free?

First thing I found out feeding LFS with service manual suspension settings, was that it nose-dived as hell and suspension travel looked much too big as with current model most of shock absorbing is taken by tires. Therefore my idea of LFS' simulation is that relations between output and input data are not in fact correct but they are tweaked way around - to get roughly proper output data (for .raw files and forces). VWS made me quite sure that Scawen cannot leave it as it is because VWS is real and widely known car so it would be widely commented when real settings and simulated results would differ alot - which I gladly welcome due to better quality of the sim

as I know from my sources, in fact, tires are the part that is not completely modelled theoretically - in case of rain pattern cuts they are surveyed empirically, not designed from theory. But all the rest is very precisely modelled and surveyed.

You should be making second level mods tires types, suspension parts, engine types used then in mods

Well, I think a sim should have really good tested physics environment of the cars, presets for modding with restricted settings range (tires, suspension parts, engines, transmission parts... and certain calculations - ie. ccm vs. engine mass -> weight balance because of course everybody would make the car with biggest engine, smallest weight or tyre grip vs. durability and so on, so some realtions should also be included).
They could be distributed with game updates. The mods could be downloaded like skins - they shouldnt be much bigger than settings files. If someone disables CMX download (which is couple times bigger I think) he would see just game default body of the type.

Therefore cars could be fabricated at two levels - presets for parts and cars themselves - trying to get best results in class.

aaa to much for read

Quote from Hotdogxx60 :

I tried rFactor about a year ago, the biggest thing that put me off was trying to get my G force pro setup. Even with realfeel I couldn't get the same steering feel as in LFS.

As for everything else no complaints, plenty of variety, but the steering needed to be plug and play who wants to stuff around tweaking configs.

Yes its true its very tricky to get good results ! But its a funny Sim with real feel BETWEEN the real big patches of LFS. Its different as LFS thats true too, but its Playable as Sim and makes alot of fun. (singleplayer or lan with 32 ai :nod

Quote from lrdbsi :

at end of day, Live for speed is the most realistic driving simulation ever to have existed in terms of phyics

I think the key word here is "existed". Maybe at one point it was the most realistic driving simulation, but there are more realistic sims available in terms of how the cars react and behave. Some rFactor mods are better, by a long shot. Niels' Supra, Formula Armaroli, HistorX are three that spring to my mind which offer handling that is more realistic and provides a more realistic feel once set up properly. Netkar Pro delivers a more realistic feel and response aswell in my opinion, however pale the content fares in relation to LFS. Not forgetting of course iRacing, which appears to be pulling away from all of the other "hardcore" sims at quite a swift pace!

Quote :

Iracing: - the TOP, if only it had the varieties of tracks and cars of Rfactor there would be no better choice I think , even if it's a little expensive

iRacing is quality over quantity (or so they claim). There is plenty of variety to be had & plenty of new stuff on its way, when the mx5 & Oulton get released i doubt LFS or Nkpro will see the light of day on my PC for a very long time.
A "little expensive" has to be the understatement of the year imo.

Realistic and Real are two different things to compare when comparing racing simulators, and under my understanding, LFS is not realistic, but feels real.
I explain: realistic IMO means that it will simulate real things, like real cars and tracks, and will behave like real cars. LFS does not simulate real things and dont behave like real cars, at least it doesnt feel real.
In the other hand, LFS feels real, within its own world and laws. Once you are there, you are in, and you feel what is happening.
For a long time this real feeling was a privilege of LFS players, there was no other simulator to give the same feeling. After NKP and iRacing this true changed.
Today I can see only some good things that still give some advantages to LFS, and that is just price, easy to install, and user interface, because the physics is not better than NKP or iRacing, and in fact it is not at same level, and fictional cars and tracks cant compete with ultra detailed models from iRacing.
About rFactor, the subject of this thread, I think it advantages is only the great netcode and the price, because it has not a good feeling, the physics are not that good, and the "mods" thing is a mess like no other.
I gave up LFS for a long time, but I still keep some hope and wait for the day we will test Scirocco in Hampshire .

I am new to lfs but I have been racing rfactor for almost 2 years. I also have spent some time with iracing and gtr2. My opinion is but one, but I think the cars in lfs just react more realistically than in the others. Specifically the ffb in lfs is just more subtle and gives you more information. With the others by the time the ffb is telling you something is wrong it is usually too late. Very impressed with how the cars feel in lfs. Graphics are also very nice in lfs, and e environments seem more alive to me. The cars also feel planted more on the track. With rfactor, for example, the cars feel more like they are on ice. But iracing feels the worst in this department. The user interface isn't as polished in lfs as the others but the cars themselves drive better. Also the ai are terrible in lfs, and they are not much better in rfactor. I still prefer the ai in f1c.

My 2 cents.

Try one think on rfaktor, Stand on the Curb and look how the Tyretemps go higher and higher (Standing not driving) . Timescaled tiretemps, is absolut not akzeptable. The best think in Rfaktor is the option to play with 32 KI in Multiplayer an Lan, and some nice mods. But for Semi Acarde its Funny.
But its not compareble, with a Simulator like Lfs. Lets see in wich way rfaktor2 will work..

now Amen

Quote from Whitmore :

Next time I race by standing still with my tyre on a curb I'll worry about this.

I see you accept an Illusion of Physiks or dont understand what a sim is

The tyre temp are a totaly nonsense in Rfactor, nothing to do with hard rubbing and sensible enter the curbs. Absolut the NFS theme.

Quote from Xenix74 :

I see you accept an Illusion of Physiks or dont understand what a sim is

LFS is more better than rFactor but i play both of games. LFS is more realistic and rFactor little bit arcade.

Quote from Xenix74 :

Try one think on rfaktor, Stand on the Curb and look how the Tyretemps go higher and higher (Standing not driving) . Timescaled tiretemps, is absolut not akzeptable. The best think in Rfaktor is the option to play with 32 KI in Multiplayer an Lan, and some nice mods. But for Semi Acarde its Funny.
But its not compareble, with a Simulator like Lfs. Lets see in wich way rfaktor2 will work..

now Amen

I tried this and it doesn't seem to happen as you say, the car had been sitting there for 5mins.

Are you are implying that the LFS tyre model is perfect?

Are you aware that over 50% of F1 teams use rFactor in their SIMULATORS?

Quote from southamptonfc :

Are you aware that over 50% of F1 teams use rFactor in their SIMULATORS?

Proof?

Quote from southamptonfc :

Are you aware that over 50% of F1 teams use rFactor in their SIMULATORS?

They use heavily modified versions of rFactor Pro, which has nothing in common with the retail rFactor whatsoever.

You have to modify rFactor pro because it is an API into the rFactor physics engine, it is not a game you can load up and play.

To say it has nothing in common with the retail rFactor is simply untrue.

Quote from zeugnimod :

Proof?

you do realise where he pulled that fact from? do you really want to see the proof?

Quote from Shotglass :

you do realise where he pulled that fact from? do you really want to see the proof?

oooh you are so clever and funny

http://www.rfactor-pro.com/

twat

Quote from southamptonfc :

twat

That kind of abuse is really unneeded and doesn't make your point stronger. If anything it makes your point weaker as you don't have any more substance and need to rely on personal attacks

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

That kind of abuse is really unneeded and doesn't make your point stronger. If anything it makes your point weaker as you don't have any more substance and need to rely on personal attacks

maybe shotglass should have worded his post different. rather than implying that the fact was pulled out of a not so pleasant place.

well he did... either that or hes really rubbish at math (which makes sense considering he actually appears to believe an f1 team would use the pysics code from rfactor even though their own page clearly states that most teams use their own physics engine and rfactor is only a convenient frameset and graphics engine)
he claimed over 50% use rfactor when in reality half the field uses rfactor
and again he wrongly believes that the game rfactor has anything whatsover to do with what you get in a f1 teams simulator

Quote from Shotglass :

he claimed over 50% use rfactor when in reality half the field uses rfactor

that would be 50%. half = 50%
he was asked to provide the link where he got his facts from. he provided it. job done. get over it. instead of flamebaiting.

is it really that hard to grasp that he said over 50%? over... OVER!!!

lol, shotglass doesnt want to back down. Never back down!

Quote from Shotglass :

is it really that hard to grasp that he said over 50%? over... OVER!!!

is it really hard to grasp that nobody gives a shit? a SHIT!. seriously dude. you're clutching at straws.
is there any real need to get your knickers in such a twist?

Clash of the know it alls.