there is something seriously wrong with your pc doodle
post your specs
post your specs
Last time I was running LFS on my old PC (8 year old hardware design, physically 7 years old - was mid-range when I bought it - I was getting minimum 30FPS at decent resolution (1440x900) and max graphics, just no AA.
I'd still be running that PC, had I not upgraded to cope with games and software released in the last 2-3 years or so, then mainly due to incompatibility (SSE2) rather than performance.
I can't see LFS ever needing expensive hardware for graphics - it just isn't necessary unless it's poorly optimised or excessively pretty and unrealistic looking. Luckily, Scawen seems to be incapable of releasing poorly optimised code and "LFS is not a screenshot generator".
CPU wise, LFS is more taxing, but my 3 year old - again mid-range - 1.6GHz laptop has enough grunt to handle a 32 car grid without breaking a sweat.
In fact, I recently bought a second hand computer for £100 that's perfectly capable of playing Crysis at high/very high settings. I for one don't buy into the expensive hardware excuse for one second.
It's remarkable how well LFS runs on old hardware considering how good the updated Blackwood and especially South City look. TBH, all LFS needs on the graphics front are some lighting and materials improvements, none of which should tax a vaguely modern graphics card that's above the bottom tier. Models with huge numbers of polys are just overkill for a racing sim IMO.
Oh, and newer DirectX versions usually mean that things run faster as the code has been optimised more.
I'd still be running that PC, had I not upgraded to cope with games and software released in the last 2-3 years or so, then mainly due to incompatibility (SSE2) rather than performance.
I can't see LFS ever needing expensive hardware for graphics - it just isn't necessary unless it's poorly optimised or excessively pretty and unrealistic looking. Luckily, Scawen seems to be incapable of releasing poorly optimised code and "LFS is not a screenshot generator".
CPU wise, LFS is more taxing, but my 3 year old - again mid-range - 1.6GHz laptop has enough grunt to handle a 32 car grid without breaking a sweat.
In fact, I recently bought a second hand computer for £100 that's perfectly capable of playing Crysis at high/very high settings. I for one don't buy into the expensive hardware excuse for one second.
It's remarkable how well LFS runs on old hardware considering how good the updated Blackwood and especially South City look. TBH, all LFS needs on the graphics front are some lighting and materials improvements, none of which should tax a vaguely modern graphics card that's above the bottom tier. Models with huge numbers of polys are just overkill for a racing sim IMO.
Oh, and newer DirectX versions usually mean that things run faster as the code has been optimised more.
If you buy a low end GPU card you would reach those results easily. Let me guess, you have a basic graphics chip capable of doing absolutely nothing?
I'm surprised so many youngsters still think that the CPU makes all the difference. What are they thinking? That the GPU market is just there for fun?
I have a funny question in my mind, i thought i'd share it...
How many Demo users have a wheel?
How many Demo users have a wheel?
I just went to random demo server and mouse:wheel ratio was somewhat near 50:50.
Lemme just quickly put in my 2 cents:
I've been a demo user for several years before I finally managed to buy the S2 license, and it's wonderful to be able to do that. Even now that I have the license, I don't have much time to play so I mostly run on the same circuit and the same cars I used to in the demo... familiarity goes a long way towards a pleasant experience.
So let's just keep it this way, I'm sure there's plenty of people out there willing but unable to buy the game, and allowing them to play the game keeps them interested in it.
I only got a wheel long after buying S2, but I did have a few chances to try the demo with one. But I mostly play on keyboard, as I don't really have room for a wheel on my desk.
As for the graphics... there's pretty big differences between versions, the V version runs quite smoothly on an old computer I have at work, but the Z can barely move on it.
I've been a demo user for several years before I finally managed to buy the S2 license, and it's wonderful to be able to do that. Even now that I have the license, I don't have much time to play so I mostly run on the same circuit and the same cars I used to in the demo... familiarity goes a long way towards a pleasant experience.
So let's just keep it this way, I'm sure there's plenty of people out there willing but unable to buy the game, and allowing them to play the game keeps them interested in it.
I only got a wheel long after buying S2, but I did have a few chances to try the demo with one. But I mostly play on keyboard, as I don't really have room for a wheel on my desk.
As for the graphics... there's pretty big differences between versions, the V version runs quite smoothly on an old computer I have at work, but the Z can barely move on it.
It took me awhile but I read most of the posts in this thread.
I am probably the type of DEMO Racer some of you want to get rid of, I played the demo in single player for a year or so then moved to the multiplayer DEMO 4 years ago, which I'am still at.
You say the DEMO should be limited, but it would be one more reason to crackers to have a go at LFS and maybe even make a pirate server, therefore reducing the arrival of new players (as the pirate would become an interesting option to "test" the full content). By keeping the demo limited in terms of cars and tracks is an interesting compromise, you get an DEMO comunity, which may help bring new players in, but still keep a reason for people to pay for more features (cars/tracks/etc..) and therefore gives the Dev team money to work with/for.
The cost of LFS is not an large issue, yeah its not cheap (here at least), but the hardware to enjoy it fully is.
I have a pc that runs it smoothly (not that hard to get, as LFS is not GPU Heavy, even in my notebook with an IGP it runs well), but to get a reasonable wheel is quite expensive (and I dont mean top of the line wheel), for me its 2 months of my entire pay to get one, and that suposing I dont need the money for anything else, so its an large investment, one that i'm not able to do yet.
For that same reason i didn't buy an S2 license, as i'll not pay for something I don't have means to enjoy fully.
I've tried some cheap wheels (~$75) but they would either be too vague (non responsive?) or not work at all.
Many people say the comunity is not growing, thats might be true as the public of LFS is not the majority of players, its an small amount of people that has commitment with the game, enjoy the realism LFS brings, and are not afraid to take time to learn to play the game reasonably well.
I have a friend that has a S2 license, but don't play for over 2 years because an old server/system which did several organized races has closed (I forgot the name, all I know is that a woman was one of the leaders/creators of this server(s)) he says the other servers are not as fun to race, and several are imposing limits (PB, min laps with car X on the track) while in this old server it was unrestricted, you could join an race from day 1, but of corse, there were admins monitoring for racers that were crashers, would offend others, etc. If it were prooved you were this type of player you would be banned from returning.
This made a race have a great number of differently skilled drivers that wanted nothing more than race and have fun without worrying with bad players crashing on to them every turn.
every now and then he asks "if the sirocco was out", and no its still being developed (I really hope it is)
People who play the demo and like tend to show it to others who might like it (I know I did) but the time needed to become competitive (with the average comunity) is huge compared to other games. and this probably is the reason many give up and move on.
I will say this, be nice to new players, as they are the ones that the dev team rely to pay the cost of the game.
I am probably the type of DEMO Racer some of you want to get rid of, I played the demo in single player for a year or so then moved to the multiplayer DEMO 4 years ago, which I'am still at.
You say the DEMO should be limited, but it would be one more reason to crackers to have a go at LFS and maybe even make a pirate server, therefore reducing the arrival of new players (as the pirate would become an interesting option to "test" the full content). By keeping the demo limited in terms of cars and tracks is an interesting compromise, you get an DEMO comunity, which may help bring new players in, but still keep a reason for people to pay for more features (cars/tracks/etc..) and therefore gives the Dev team money to work with/for.
The cost of LFS is not an large issue, yeah its not cheap (here at least), but the hardware to enjoy it fully is.
I have a pc that runs it smoothly (not that hard to get, as LFS is not GPU Heavy, even in my notebook with an IGP it runs well), but to get a reasonable wheel is quite expensive (and I dont mean top of the line wheel), for me its 2 months of my entire pay to get one, and that suposing I dont need the money for anything else, so its an large investment, one that i'm not able to do yet.
For that same reason i didn't buy an S2 license, as i'll not pay for something I don't have means to enjoy fully.
I've tried some cheap wheels (~$75) but they would either be too vague (non responsive?) or not work at all.
Many people say the comunity is not growing, thats might be true as the public of LFS is not the majority of players, its an small amount of people that has commitment with the game, enjoy the realism LFS brings, and are not afraid to take time to learn to play the game reasonably well.
I have a friend that has a S2 license, but don't play for over 2 years because an old server/system which did several organized races has closed (I forgot the name, all I know is that a woman was one of the leaders/creators of this server(s)) he says the other servers are not as fun to race, and several are imposing limits (PB, min laps with car X on the track) while in this old server it was unrestricted, you could join an race from day 1, but of corse, there were admins monitoring for racers that were crashers, would offend others, etc. If it were prooved you were this type of player you would be banned from returning.
This made a race have a great number of differently skilled drivers that wanted nothing more than race and have fun without worrying with bad players crashing on to them every turn.
every now and then he asks "if the sirocco was out", and no its still being developed (I really hope it is)
People who play the demo and like tend to show it to others who might like it (I know I did) but the time needed to become competitive (with the average comunity) is huge compared to other games. and this probably is the reason many give up and move on.
I will say this, be nice to new players, as they are the ones that the dev team rely to pay the cost of the game.
Being nice to new players is not an issue , its a different story for someone that has been using the demo for what five years?
You cannot tell me that after using the demo for five years you have anyones best interest in mind apart from your own.
As for the pirate theory its a load of shit as well , most people that use pirated software do so no matter what the cost of the software or its trial limitations .
They steal it because can.
You cannot tell me that after using the demo for five years you have anyones best interest in mind apart from your own.
As for the pirate theory its a load of shit as well , most people that use pirated software do so no matter what the cost of the software or its trial limitations .
They steal it because can.
Dude, Sometimes you don't play enough or have the resources to buy the full game, yet you love it. He's not hurting anyone by playing the demo nor is he really affecting the devs much by not buying...As I always say, Real Life comes First. Also, why would it further the game or help others if he bought the game?
Have you ever done work experience? And if you have would you think it reasonable to be employed if you did a good job or is it ok to keep taking advantage of you and not paying you for your efforts?
Think about it.
Think about it.
I also would dislike having to put restrictions on demo - users on LFS. There are couple of reasons why I think that way. I think that primarily, LFS is really one of those only games that allow such a system of Demo (S0 xD) S1, S2, and possibly S3. Given that you have to only pay for the license once, that should remain true for Demo. Demo is a license. Even though you didn't have to pay for it, it should remain fee-free because it was free in the first place.
Secondly, I think that this will add more problems to the people dealing with the game than the people driving. Why? Sure, the dev's will get more income, but they will end up with more registrations. The people who have exceeded the set limitations (whether # Laps or set time limit) will return to get new accounts. Make an IP system people say; how about dynamic IP? How about computers running out of the same network, but different people? VPN? IP blockers? You will end up with a bloated database which will cause more hassle than good. Time better spent on other improvements such as our LFS!
Third, demo is a version, or stage, may it be, of itself. Making it like a trial will destroy its status as a stage in LFS. It is a license, just a restricted license like a learner's permit. Sure, in Canada at least, if you don't get your full driver's in 5 years after getting your learner's, you will have to re-apply again, but that includes the second stage. So in theory, S1s would need to have a time trial
Fourth, demo has its own community. Putting limitations on it would take away a big bulk of the whole LFS community. Leagues, servers will be empty. I will be missing many of the racing buddies in BL1 GTi.
And ofc, there are some people who just can't pay for it. Sure, you earn $100 000 US a year. Ofc you can pay for it. I for one, don't have income. Sure, maybe I am a lazy bum, but do you know my story. Maybe I can't find a job. Maybe my student schedule is way overbooked. And for some people, they don't have the means of paying for LFS. No credit card, no debit card, no visa, mastercard, no paypal, no money - order, and in some cases, no bank account.
I hope this doesn't happen, but if it does come true, I'll be missing a great majority of our population. I mean, "If it ain't broken, don't fix it!" It's great right now, works like a charm. And I think I love LFS so much is because it is unique like this; small number of developpers, the way it is developped (ing) -> the ideals of the developpers, the community!
I for one became S2 after a good 7 months of LFS, and one year after registration, and probably 1000 laps of BL1 Drifting. So, of course, with this and the above, I disagree 99.9% with this idea. The 0.1% is if this helps the developpers put out new physics and Scirocco next Friday, or if... I dunno, someone can get me a new computer that doesn't lag with 16 people on Grid
Secondly, I think that this will add more problems to the people dealing with the game than the people driving. Why? Sure, the dev's will get more income, but they will end up with more registrations. The people who have exceeded the set limitations (whether # Laps or set time limit) will return to get new accounts. Make an IP system people say; how about dynamic IP? How about computers running out of the same network, but different people? VPN? IP blockers? You will end up with a bloated database which will cause more hassle than good. Time better spent on other improvements such as our LFS!
Third, demo is a version, or stage, may it be, of itself. Making it like a trial will destroy its status as a stage in LFS. It is a license, just a restricted license like a learner's permit. Sure, in Canada at least, if you don't get your full driver's in 5 years after getting your learner's, you will have to re-apply again, but that includes the second stage. So in theory, S1s would need to have a time trial
Fourth, demo has its own community. Putting limitations on it would take away a big bulk of the whole LFS community. Leagues, servers will be empty. I will be missing many of the racing buddies in BL1 GTi.
And ofc, there are some people who just can't pay for it. Sure, you earn $100 000 US a year. Ofc you can pay for it. I for one, don't have income. Sure, maybe I am a lazy bum, but do you know my story. Maybe I can't find a job. Maybe my student schedule is way overbooked. And for some people, they don't have the means of paying for LFS. No credit card, no debit card, no visa, mastercard, no paypal, no money - order, and in some cases, no bank account.
I hope this doesn't happen, but if it does come true, I'll be missing a great majority of our population. I mean, "If it ain't broken, don't fix it!" It's great right now, works like a charm. And I think I love LFS so much is because it is unique like this; small number of developpers, the way it is developped (ing) -> the ideals of the developpers, the community!
I for one became S2 after a good 7 months of LFS, and one year after registration, and probably 1000 laps of BL1 Drifting. So, of course, with this and the above, I disagree 99.9% with this idea. The 0.1% is if this helps the developpers put out new physics and Scirocco next Friday, or if... I dunno, someone can get me a new computer that doesn't lag with 16 people on Grid
Well, yes, I have done work, and have been taken advantage of...but, if the devs feel that it is right to keep the demo the way it is, then it is none of our business. Surely you take advantage of just about every free thing you can...
And, if you want the devs to make the most of their program so very badly, why not buy some demo user an s2 license? All I'm saying is that you don't need to beat up on people who can't afford to pay for it.
I just post to post, no content and not really playing anymore, just checking the news once in a while and noticing a hell lot of demo players online :b
No one is beating up people that cant afford it , if you truly could not afford it i would doubt that a computer and ISP bills would be high on your priorities.
I cannot believe some of the responses i read in this thread....I played lfs for years on my brother sim rig but i made an account only recently so i can post here.Why ? Because i believe lfs can become incredible if only the stance of the developers against user help (by making models of cars and tracks) is changed.
Anyway lfs is a simulation.It SHOULD have an unrestricted demo.Most people here learn about a realistic simulation and decide to try it.Some will like it,some will find that it comes short on many things.In any case because it is unrestricted a lot of people play on the demo servers and after they realize how good and fun it is they decide to become licensed members.There are people that played lfs for years on demo servers until they decided to buy it.Some people didn't have good equipment to justify buying the game.(For example having a crappy wheel is not the same with having a g25/g27 or fanatec 911 turbo wheel were you get the best with its clutch and h shifter) .
If you restrict the demo than i quarantee you many future buyers will be lost.As it is there are thousands of people that have lfs installed on their computers and someday they may decide to buy it.Some because they feel the game was improved enough to justify buying it,some because they have some money to spare,some because they feel they are pro drivers and want to move to other faster cars and tracks.
Also another note.People that moan about lfs is too hardware demanding are forgeting that lfs is still dx8 based and it runs incredibly fast on everything that is around the last 4 years and was bought for at least $ 1000.A $1000 pc is a dirt cheap and you can use it for pretty much anything(movies,world,imaging,internet,mirc,phoning and yes playing with older games)
If you complain why you get below 30 or below 60 frames on your $400 pc you bought from the grocery store than you must get a job.
My 3 and a half years old pc (E6700 2.66 C2Duo Oc at 3Ghz,4gb xms pc6400,gf 8800 ultra and a msi diamond mb ) runs the game at 1920x1200 with aa and af with a 16 car grid at over 100-120 fps !!!!!
You can find from many powersellers on Ebay for 1000-1200 ready builded gaming i7 or even quad cores that would run lfs at max graphics at 300 + frames...
The game is already too graphically dated and probably this is the primary reason why many people do not buy it.I have many friends that their initial impression of lfs was bad but when they played it on my brothers sim rig they absolutely loved it.( because they got passed the graphics ....)
Anyway lfs is a simulation.It SHOULD have an unrestricted demo.Most people here learn about a realistic simulation and decide to try it.Some will like it,some will find that it comes short on many things.In any case because it is unrestricted a lot of people play on the demo servers and after they realize how good and fun it is they decide to become licensed members.There are people that played lfs for years on demo servers until they decided to buy it.Some people didn't have good equipment to justify buying the game.(For example having a crappy wheel is not the same with having a g25/g27 or fanatec 911 turbo wheel were you get the best with its clutch and h shifter) .
If you restrict the demo than i quarantee you many future buyers will be lost.As it is there are thousands of people that have lfs installed on their computers and someday they may decide to buy it.Some because they feel the game was improved enough to justify buying it,some because they have some money to spare,some because they feel they are pro drivers and want to move to other faster cars and tracks.
Also another note.People that moan about lfs is too hardware demanding are forgeting that lfs is still dx8 based and it runs incredibly fast on everything that is around the last 4 years and was bought for at least $ 1000.A $1000 pc is a dirt cheap and you can use it for pretty much anything(movies,world,imaging,internet,mirc,phoning and yes playing with older games)
If you complain why you get below 30 or below 60 frames on your $400 pc you bought from the grocery store than you must get a job.
My 3 and a half years old pc (E6700 2.66 C2Duo Oc at 3Ghz,4gb xms pc6400,gf 8800 ultra and a msi diamond mb ) runs the game at 1920x1200 with aa and af with a 16 car grid at over 100-120 fps !!!!!
You can find from many powersellers on Ebay for 1000-1200 ready builded gaming i7 or even quad cores that would run lfs at max graphics at 300 + frames...
The game is already too graphically dated and probably this is the primary reason why many people do not buy it.I have many friends that their initial impression of lfs was bad but when they played it on my brothers sim rig they absolutely loved it.( because they got passed the graphics ....)
1+ I think you pretty much closed this thread.
You guys are simply messing things up.
Did any of you thought about what is the Devs idea about the Demo?
A Demo is a Demo. Something that is a little part of something, being a game, a piece of tissue or food.
What are the consequences to YOU that a couple of other guys keep amusing themselves in a demo server?
When a guy is fed up of BL and the 3 cars, he has two choices:
- Leave LFS Demo;
- Buy S2;
The third choice is keep using the Demo, which is something perfectly legal and perfectly acceptable. After all, he's the one who is fed up, not me.
That aproach that "buy it, you darn thief, you don't know what you're missing in S2" is completely wrong, since he knows perfectly well what he's missing: HE ONLY HAS 3 OUT OF 20 CARS AND 2 OUT OF 48 LAYOUTS! The questions is if that fulfills his needs and for how long it will...
Can you demand a guy to buy a house, when he prefers a camping tent REMAX (sorry for the advertisement) gave him in a propaganda campaign in the garden? No, they gave it to him with no conditions, but he cant argue about it being very cold in the winter. "Well, if you want a cosy place to live, buy one of our houses!".
In resume of all this, if you put some limitation in time usage, people will use it and put it aside... Most of nowadays S1/S2 users bought it when they wanted to. If you imposed a 6 months limitation period, 60% of licenced users wouldn't have bought it. That's my opinion...
Leave the Demo as it is. It's Demoers' problem if it fills their needs or not. LFS Demo is not other game or a simplified version: it's an ONLINE DEMO!!!
Did any of you thought about what is the Devs idea about the Demo?
A Demo is a Demo. Something that is a little part of something, being a game, a piece of tissue or food.
What are the consequences to YOU that a couple of other guys keep amusing themselves in a demo server?
When a guy is fed up of BL and the 3 cars, he has two choices:
- Leave LFS Demo;
- Buy S2;
The third choice is keep using the Demo, which is something perfectly legal and perfectly acceptable. After all, he's the one who is fed up, not me.
That aproach that "buy it, you darn thief, you don't know what you're missing in S2" is completely wrong, since he knows perfectly well what he's missing: HE ONLY HAS 3 OUT OF 20 CARS AND 2 OUT OF 48 LAYOUTS! The questions is if that fulfills his needs and for how long it will...
Can you demand a guy to buy a house, when he prefers a camping tent REMAX (sorry for the advertisement) gave him in a propaganda campaign in the garden? No, they gave it to him with no conditions, but he cant argue about it being very cold in the winter. "Well, if you want a cosy place to live, buy one of our houses!".
In resume of all this, if you put some limitation in time usage, people will use it and put it aside... Most of nowadays S1/S2 users bought it when they wanted to. If you imposed a 6 months limitation period, 60% of licenced users wouldn't have bought it. That's my opinion...
Leave the Demo as it is. It's Demoers' problem if it fills their needs or not. LFS Demo is not other game or a simplified version: it's an ONLINE DEMO!!!
nobody has called anyone a theif. nor have they demanded demo users buy the game.
again, a demo is a demonstration of a full product. if you're still playing the demop after 12 months then imo, the demo didn't work as it was intended. a demo is a limited bit of a product designed to intice a person to buy the full product.
a demo user only become beneficial to LFS once they have purchased the full content. why? because they have made the most important contribution to LFS, supporting the development.
a demo user is using the restricted software for free. this cost them nothing. the users who have no intention of purchasing the full content will never add to the development to LFS so you can't even think of them as potential customers because they do not plan on buying the game at all. adding a time restriction will weed out the potental buyers from the non buyers. stay or go, a non buyer is a non buyer.
if you go into a cafe and don't buy anything, it will not be long before you're asked to leave. why? because you (as a customer) are not contributing to the business.
again, a demo is a demonstration of a full product. if you're still playing the demop after 12 months then imo, the demo didn't work as it was intended. a demo is a limited bit of a product designed to intice a person to buy the full product.
a demo user only become beneficial to LFS once they have purchased the full content. why? because they have made the most important contribution to LFS, supporting the development.
a demo user is using the restricted software for free. this cost them nothing. the users who have no intention of purchasing the full content will never add to the development to LFS so you can't even think of them as potential customers because they do not plan on buying the game at all. adding a time restriction will weed out the potental buyers from the non buyers. stay or go, a non buyer is a non buyer.
if you go into a cafe and don't buy anything, it will not be long before you're asked to leave. why? because you (as a customer) are not contributing to the business.
I think you are getting way cooped up in the financial aspects of helping the game. Money isn't everything. And in many cases, more money after a point isn't going help the developers develop faster, nor better.
Demos can definitely benefit LFS without buying a license. If they are good sports in the LFS servers, and set a good example for other drivers, the servers will become better. That will encourage less people to leave, and continue playing LFS, and potentially bring in more people with license. (Of course, this is given from the fact that more money is always better). In addition, any LFS driver can always become potential advertisers. They can always be nice in the LFS forum community. That would increase the drivers. This cycle would continue.
You can never rule out that anyone has no intention of buying the game. Anything is possible. And if you can say that, that is just pure ignorance. I've seen people buying a license after years of just DEMO-ing.
The fact is that once the developers have created the game, they no longer need to contribute. The servers themselves are owned privately. So, in theory, the developers don't need compensation after the one time license. The developers can leave right now (ofc, that would be unfavorable for the community), but the racing and the servers would probably continue (unless the master server is down).
EDIT: LFS is not a café. People are told to leave for not buying something is because they are hindering potential business. This is not the case with LFS. There are n number of licenses, and having more DEMO doesn't mean less S1/2; and thus would not be hindering potential customers from buying the game.
Demos can definitely benefit LFS without buying a license. If they are good sports in the LFS servers, and set a good example for other drivers, the servers will become better. That will encourage less people to leave, and continue playing LFS, and potentially bring in more people with license. (Of course, this is given from the fact that more money is always better). In addition, any LFS driver can always become potential advertisers. They can always be nice in the LFS forum community. That would increase the drivers. This cycle would continue.
You can never rule out that anyone has no intention of buying the game. Anything is possible. And if you can say that, that is just pure ignorance. I've seen people buying a license after years of just DEMO-ing.
The fact is that once the developers have created the game, they no longer need to contribute. The servers themselves are owned privately. So, in theory, the developers don't need compensation after the one time license. The developers can leave right now (ofc, that would be unfavorable for the community), but the racing and the servers would probably continue (unless the master server is down).
EDIT: LFS is not a café. People are told to leave for not buying something is because they are hindering potential business. This is not the case with LFS. There are n number of licenses, and having more DEMO doesn't mean less S1/2; and thus would not be hindering potential customers from buying the game.
it has nothing to do with being cooped up on one ascpet of a full product. LFS is a product. this product is for sale. if we like the product, we purchase this product. it's the way a business works. there is no middle ground when it comes to business.
you may think that i'm being too cooped up on the financial side of LFS but at the end of the day, the demo was made to increase revenue. this doesn't happen when a demo user has no intention buying the full product.
potential business is only that when there is a potential customer base. if Mr x has no plans on buying the product, then he is not a potential customer. and therefore, the demo has failed to do what it was designed to do.
to say "Mr x is not harming anyone so let him be" is also wrong. he is harming the potential customer base by showing that you do not need to buy a license because you can play the demo for an unlimited time.
even calling S2 license holders (and demo users) "the community" is wrong. this is a fanbase. nothing more.
you may think that i'm being too cooped up on the financial side of LFS but at the end of the day, the demo was made to increase revenue. this doesn't happen when a demo user has no intention buying the full product.
potential business is only that when there is a potential customer base. if Mr x has no plans on buying the product, then he is not a potential customer. and therefore, the demo has failed to do what it was designed to do.
to say "Mr x is not harming anyone so let him be" is also wrong. he is harming the potential customer base by showing that you do not need to buy a license because you can play the demo for an unlimited time.
even calling S2 license holders (and demo users) "the community" is wrong. this is a fanbase. nothing more.
Sorry for reviving this conversation but what the hell are you smoking man ?
Are you out of your #%$#% mind ? A demo is a demo.If people buy it then that would help the developers.If they keep it on their hard drives and race from time to time they will have the game on their mind and may speak about it in forums or to their friends.The advertisement they do brings more people to test and talk about lfs and that is a good thing.Also some people eventually if they feel the game has improved enough or they buy expensive equipment they may decide to buy the game.
What the hell is your problem if people play the demo on their private servers they PAY TO MAINTAIN ??
And on another matter lfs is being programmed by 3 people.How much money do they need to keep developing ? There are at least 20.000 subscribers with each having paid around $ 20-40 .So common now stop this bullshiting##%@ or do you get commisions from suscribers ?
Are you out of your #%$#% mind ? A demo is a demo.If people buy it then that would help the developers.If they keep it on their hard drives and race from time to time they will have the game on their mind and may speak about it in forums or to their friends.The advertisement they do brings more people to test and talk about lfs and that is a good thing.Also some people eventually if they feel the game has improved enough or they buy expensive equipment they may decide to buy the game.
What the hell is your problem if people play the demo on their private servers they PAY TO MAINTAIN ??
And on another matter lfs is being programmed by 3 people.How much money do they need to keep developing ? There are at least 20.000 subscribers with each having paid around $ 20-40 .So common now stop this bullshiting##%@ or do you get commisions from suscribers ?
My story:
I ve been playing the demo since .... 2004 afair ( check my signature). That time i couldnt afford to buy full ver. Now i can but content seems to be little outdated.
And remember that almost each game with pass of time gets cheaper. Its obvious - u get something old - you pay less. But for LFS you ve to pay 20E even tho the game is like (?) 5 years old. This is for me quite ununderstandable
I ve been playing the demo since .... 2004 afair ( check my signature). That time i couldnt afford to buy full ver. Now i can but content seems to be little outdated.
And remember that almost each game with pass of time gets cheaper. Its obvious - u get something old - you pay less. But for LFS you ve to pay 20E even tho the game is like (?) 5 years old. This is for me quite ununderstandable
the plan is to offer opinions. so what, you don't agree. it's what a discussion is. you think i'm bullshitting, good for you. but all my points are valid and i didn't even have to insult anybody in the process.
you don't really know how business work do you? i don't have a problem with demo users playing the game on private servers. THIS IS ONLY A DISCUSSION! now how's about you go outside and take some fecking air onboard before you pass out.
how much money does it take to develope a game by 3 people? are we taking cost of living into this equation? what about the poor economy? what about travel expenses too? promotional events? what about equiptment to run these promotional events?
try taking off your blinkers and see the bigger picture.
so, i would ask you. what the **** are you smoking?
was it just me or was that a bit of a pork pie? you say "pay to maintain". who pays? the demo holders? who do they pay? i know they don't pay the devs because the servers are private (like 500 servers for example). the money paid for servers go to those who run the servers. last i checked, the devs don't run the servers. so, pay to maintain what exactly?
They can do that even if the demo has a trial period that expires in 30 days.
This is already the best, if not one of the best racing sims on the market, and doesn't require a monthly subscription. You know, when people like a game, they normally tend to BUY the game that they like. Now I know there are a few lowlife idiots out there who like to torrent games off the internet as apposed to paying for them, but for the most part, people pay for games they want. Just saying.
soooooo... Demo users have to pay to maintain servers, but the developers don't have to get paid to for developing this game?
You know, I was one of those people supporting a demo without more restrictions, but your comment kinda pissed me off. :gnasher:
I am one of the people who thinks that the demo shouldn't be restricted, but as a software developer, I believe that the 3 developers have every right in the world to make as much money from their investment as they want. What the f*** does how much money they "need" have to do with anything??? THIS IS A F***ING BUSINESS!!! This isn't Government assistance for sh!t sake! What these people do with their own money is their business!
I find it reprehensible of you to even to say something like "And on another matter lfs is being programmed by 3 people.How much money do they need to keep developing?" AS MUCH MONEY AS THEY WANT!!!! We aren't buying the game so the developers can hurry up and make S3, we're buying the game because WE LIKE THE GAME WE BOUGHT!! The developers have no obligation to KISS YOUR ASS, either you like the game or you dont! If you don't like the game, DON'T BUY IT! What the hell do you mean "how much money do they "need" to continue developing? What the hell do you care?
The licenses aren't annual subscriptions, and you only have to pay for them one time.
Big companies like EA and Activision can afford to go down on the price due to merchandising. Big companies actually have copies of their games on store shelves, therefore, It becomes essential for distributors to lower the prices to the store they are selling to after a while, in order to increase the demand for their product. Indie developers typically can't afford, or have no Idea how to do that.
I hope one day there will be box copies of this game available in stores. Seems like a good idea to me.
You see the master server and the forums run on love, pixie dust and virgin farts...
This thread is closed
LFS "demo" users
(171 posts, closed, started )
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