Sorry for being vaguely on topic but a quick review of this thread appears to prove a couple of points.

1; Stealing software is completely acceptable unless it's LFS in which case it's completely wrong and gets reported.

Hmmm - seem's like double standards to me but what do I know.

2; People have issues with signatures - Please START YOUR OWN THREAD !!!

So, why the double standards with stealing software ?

Is it fine stealing from corporates but not from independants ?

My post was originally about the CIA allegedly stealing software, yet according the US this is a major crime which requires the US to police the net to stop the very thing they're doing. OK, I'm now confused.

Any chance of a vaguely on topic discussion ?

Quote from Racer X NZ :

1; Stealing software is completely acceptable unless it's LFS in which case it's completely wrong and gets reported.

Hmmm - seem's like double standards to me but what do I know.


So, why the double standards with stealing software ?

Is it fine stealing from corporates but not from independants ?

Seeing as the corporate video game developers are filthy rich and are pumping out so many crappy games these days, that we would rather not pay for it unless we know it's good.

An independent game developer on the other hand, is generally making his game by himself(in some cases) and puts a lot of time and money into making his game good. And I'm sure that this independent developer could use the money a hell of a lot more than some corporate game developer.

This is a little like buying meat from the local butcher, rather than buying it from Wal-Mart. (I know there are differences, so don't point them out.)

Quote from SidiousX :

This is a little like buying meat from the local butcher, rather than buying it from Wal-Mart. (I know there are differences, so don't point them out.)

Sounds more like choosing between buying meat from the local butcher or stealing the meat from Walmart.

I wonder if the OP would feel the same about piracy if the CIA weren't involved?

Quote from 5haz :

I wonder if the OP would feel the same about piracy if the CIA weren't involved?

he would cause if it was the fbi they woulda planted a gun and the black guy

Piracy = WIN...

Saves me £1000's each year and its great being able to complete new Xbox 360 games weeks before release...

its exactly that. there are people who dont know how to pirate a game, or just dont want to, who buy it legally, and feed the money to the game developers. then there are people who try it, then if they like it buy it. or just use it for like a day then get rid of it. (which isnt worth buying).. then people who try it and buy it if they like it, or just feel bad and buy it.

with independant people like in LFS, its alot worse, because every sale lost is legitimate money in their pocket, and this can actually be very costly.

Quote from logitekg25 :

its exactly that. there are people who dont know how to pirate a game, or just dont want to, who buy it legally, and feed the money to the game developers.

Think you meant to say publishers :rolleyes:

not entirely sure tbh

i know the store buys it from i assume a magical game tree, and makes a bunch off it

but not as much as the tree

Quote from Racer X NZ :

So you support illegal use of software ?

Quote from Klutch :

Yes.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Yup

I`m late, but +1

and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgWVs4kslVw

Quote from SidiousX :

This is a little like buying meat from the local butcher, rather than buying it from Wal-Mart. (I know there are differences, so don't point them out.)

Quote from mrodgers :

Sounds more like choosing between buying meat from the local butcher or stealing the meat from Walmart.

.

Quote from logitekg25 :

(which isnt worth buying).. then people who try it and buy it if they like it, or just feel bad and buy it.

with independant people like in LFS, its alot worse, because every sale lost is legitimate money in their pocket, and this can actually be very costly.

Are you saying that it's OK to torrent S2 for a while, And play on it's stuff then think "Nahh.. to hardd" And that be that? And money is still lost, Big developers and publishers still loose money when people torrent their games, It's why DRM is getting harder and harder to crack, Soon they will just stop releasing games for PC.. And you will all get what you ask for

Quote from TehPaws3D :

... It's why DRM is getting harder and harder to crack, Soon they will just stop releasing games for PC.. And you will all get what you ask for

True, true ...

I would actually support all new games to be released on PS3. If the devs learn how to easily take advantage of its hardware (wich they dont know, so to code a game for it, it will be harder as u might think, thats why the high prices), then it would be very nice.

Edit: Im also pointing out that PS3 is very future pruuf, CPU-Wise. Not sure about the GPU and its 256mb of ram. But a fast HDD and using all cores would compensate that, no?

There's piracy on PS3 now too, so...

Quote from TehPaws3D :

Are you saying that it's OK to torrent S2 for a while, And play on it's stuff then think "Nahh.. to hardd" And that be that? And money is still lost, Big developers and publishers still loose money when people torrent their games, It's why DRM is getting harder and harder to crack, Soon they will just stop releasing games for PC.. And you will all get what you ask for

im not saying that, that falls under the small group of people making a game, and it just isnt right, because that is a direct loss. idk how clear my point was, and i forget how i worded it.

but tbh, this is meant to be an online game, and all the fun IS online, so you really dont have much of a choice. i legitamately never cracked this game. i was honestly demo for like 4 months

Quote from logitekg25 :

but tbh, this is meant to be an online game, and all the fun IS online, so you really dont have much of a choice. i legitamately never cracked this game. i was honestly demo for like 4 months

Not really, You can test setups and get WR's off online mode, And the majority of the fun is also ruined, In mutliplayer, Because people crash you and use unfair tactics... All and all the fun levels are relativity the same.


And also, Nobody ever said anything about cracking singleplayer.. what you said just lead me to believe you are lying about the fact that you did.. Run and hide, Before the mods come out at night.

Quote from TehPaws3D :

It's why DRM is getting harder and harder to crack, Soon they will just stop releasing games for PC.. And you will all get what you ask for

DRM is not making games software harder to crack. Games are usually available within a few days of release and often are available before official release in a given territory.

PC gaming will not die completely, but the landscape is changing with consoles being pushed more aggressively at the consumer market. Windows is too complex for it's own good in this regard, and the move to 'media centres' even has my parents watching TV through their PS3 - and i'm not even sure if they have a single PS3 game.

But PC's are a part of the home now - particularly laptops with poor 3D capabilities - so there is a shift toward indi gaming away from the big luscious 3D titles but whilst PC's are in the home somebody will be making money making games for them.

PC gaming won't die on the PC until the PC dies. Until then it will simply evolve.

The big companies will always moan about piracy on the PC but if they only released games on say the PS3 then you would see a massive increase in piracy for the PS3.

Piracy is not lost sales, nobody looses money to people who wheren't going to buy the games anyway. Somebody above posted they saved £1000 in software last year, but did they actually earn a spare £1000 from their car jacking to spent extra on feeding their crack habbit that could have been used for gaming? (sorry, i'm running the assumption the FAST adverts at the start of films are true and that you're a mafia terrorist paedophile).

Piracy has been a significant part of gaming since Sinclair unveiled the ZX Spectrum. The rate of piracy has remained constant, and no DRM or other anti-piracy measure has ever effected the pirates (although plenty of adversely effected genuine consumers).

The closest there has ever been to a sucessful anti-piracy measure is online gaming - but even then all the big games have pirate server networks you can connect too, or 3rd party server software that you can download and set up as you please. Do you want to do a raid in World of Warcraft at a LAN party without ever buying the game? It can be done...

Quote from Becky Rose :

The closest there has ever been to a sucessful anti-piracy measure is online gaming

True.. and PS3.. it literally witstand pirates till like a month ago, and it was released late 2006. And it would last longer if someone hasn't leaked some dev kit or something..

Quote from TehPaws3D :

And money is still lost

Please explain how money is lost.

Torrent available:
Joe Shmo torrents latest release of software.
Joe Shmo uses software.

Torrent not available:
Joe Shmo looks for torrent.
Joe Shmo can't find torrent.
Joe Shmo doesn't use software.

Where is the money lost? Can't lose something you wouldn't have had in the first place.

Quote from mrodgers :

Torrent not available:
Joe Shmo looks for torrent.
Joe Shmo can't find torrent.
Joe Shmo doesn't use software..

How about:

Torrent not available:
Joe Shmo looks for torrent.
Joe Shmo can't find torrent.
Joe Shmo decides to buy a game since there's no torrent.

Quote from Becky Rose :

DRM is not making games software harder to crack. Games are usually available within a few days of release and often are available before official release in a given territory.

Really? I thought DRM Meant to check to see if your version was " True " It would connect to a online server, And run the CD-key or serial number against it's database and see if there is a match. Something like that makes it almost impossible to crack.. At least from my point of view, I tried to play Splinter cell conviction on my friends computer and it kept crashing the second it tried to connect to the server.. that's basically a bad crack/runaround/hack/whateva .. Or so i think.

Quote from Becky Rose :

PC gaming will not die completely, but the landscape is changing with consoles being pushed more aggressively at the consumer market. Windows is too complex for it's own good in this regard, and the move to 'media centres' even has my parents watching TV through their PS3 - and i'm not even sure if they have a single PS3 game.

I can't disagree.. To many people just get confused when they look at a command prompt, Freeze up, And then a brilliant console with a lovely interface comes along and makes it all seem so smooth, I don't think it would take you long to guess who would win that.. But the more you pirate games, The more developers and publishers will think "Err.... Well maybe.." And that's not good.. at all.

Quote from Becky Rose :

PC gaming won't die on the PC until the PC dies. Until then it will simply evolve.

Honestly, Windows 7 and Mac, Was already the death, What are you talking about.. You typing this from that nifty phone?

Quote from Becky Rose :

The big companies will always moan about piracy on the PC but if they only released games on say the PS3 then you would see a massive increase in piracy for the PS3.

I guess it's safe to say you're ****ed either way you want to slice it there..

Quote from Becky Rose :

Piracy is not lost sales, nobody looses money to people who wheren't going to buy the games anyway. Somebody above posted they saved £1000 in software last year, but did they actually earn a spare £1000 from their car jacking to spent extra on feeding their crack habbit that could have been used for gaming?

I didn't understand the last part of this, But 50 dollars to 24 dollars, Every bit helps I believe.

Quote from Becky Rose :

Piracy has been a significant part of gaming since Sinclair unveiled the ZX Spectrum. The rate of piracy has remained constant, and no DRM or other anti-piracy measure has ever effected the pirates (although plenty of adversely effected genuine consumers).

Yeah, That's the bad part, They make it so you HAVE to have a internet connection and you HAVE to have it constant.. You HAVE to register on their website, By the time you get to registering most of the time you're like **** it and just go do something else, So yeah i can understand this.

Quote from Boris Lozac :

Joe Shmo decides to buy a game since there's no torrent.

Doesn't happen. People who pirate, pirate.

The balancing effect of Pirate users buying the original is far greater anyway, for citation see record sales when Napster launched.

Quote :

Really? I thought DRM Meant to check to see if your version was " True " It would connect to a online server, And run the CD-key or serial number against it's database and see if there is a match. Something like that makes it almost impossible to crack.. At least from my point of view, I tried to play Splinter cell conviction on my friends computer and it kept crashing the second it tried to connect to the server.. that's basically a bad crack/runaround/hack/whateva .. Or so i think.

The first thing I do when I buy a music album is strip the DRM off, it takes 5 minutes...

Quote from Becky Rose :

The first thing I do when I buy a music album is strip the DRM off, it takes 5 minutes...

....... Do tell..... In a PM. I'm interested to see if i could "Reverse it" To put DRM on something.. It'd be cool.

Quote from Becky Rose :

Doesn't happen. People who pirate, pirate.

The balancing effect of Pirate users buying the original is far greater anyway, for citation see record sales when Napster launched.

Oh, it does happen.. in my country people who bought a PS3 simply had no other choice then to buy the games, now half of them gave up online gaming for pirated games. That half will no longer buy games.