Quote from Cornys :

A quick note on attendance at Kentucky Speedway in what would become the final round of the season:

I was there, and most of the people who I talked to had gotten their tickets from the ticket exchange reguardeding the traffic disaster that happened there when the Sprint Cup Series came there for the first time. Those who failed to make the race in time to see the green flag like myself received a free ticket to another Cup series race, and your choice of that Indy Car series ticket or a truck series ticket. I chose the Indy Car series ticket, because I'd never seen them race before.

If there werre 107,000 people there for the Cup race, then the Indy Car race might have made it to 25,000... maybe. Truly, the attendance was attrocious, and less than half of those tickets were actually bought in the first place.

Race its self? Well, it wasn't the most exciting until the last 15 laps, and it just came down to stratagy play between the two with their push to pass button. Close, exciting finish aside, the rest of rht race was all pit strategy single file pace laps (at 215 mph).

So, does that mean that the IRL is not in good health? 25,000 at a track like kentucky does not sound good. Remember, they have dropped tracks for not selling out before.

Quote from DieKolkrabe :

So, does that mean that the IRL is not in good health? 25,000 at a track like kentucky does not sound good. Remember, they have dropped tracks for not selling out before.

I was meaning it poorly. That is a terrable attendance number.

The other 2 drivers have been ... being permanetly scared.

Quote from lizardfolk :

I mean isn't IndyCar building a new oval in China just for the series? I feel like IndyCar can find a new home in foreign ovals although I'm not so sure Eurospeedway would be that much of a better choice in terms of safety since that is another superspeedway

Eurospeedway has a banking of less then 10° and, compared to most American ovals relatively sharp corners. However SAFER-Barriers are missing, as the oval has only been used for ASCAR, V8Star and a one-off International German Formula 3 race in the oval since the departure of CART/CCWS. (less then 20 races in total)

Also, that Chinese oval... It sounds like the South Korean ChampCar Grand Prix as it is pushed back year after year after year...

The key is for Indy to limit them selves to 1.5 mile ovals that way you get all the action without the speed, Iowa for example

Indus popularity Right now is low for a number of factors, 1 because Tony George signed them to a rubbish versus deal which is killing the sport of it's fan base.
2. It's a hard time to grow in a market struggling economicly, even NASCAR can't get the Audiences it was getting 3-5 years ago.
And 3. The dallara is useless for road course which is the market it's mainly getting.

Indys current grid is of much higher quality then champcar ever had, so with purpose built chassis next year better racing will be possible(instead of using a modified oval chassis for road course).

Quote from Mustafur :

The key is for Indy to limit them selves to 1.5 mile ovals that way you get all the action without the speed, Iowa for example

Ehm... Las Vegas was a 1.5mi oval... Iowa is a 0.875mi one.

Quote from TFalke55 :

Ehm... Las Vegas was a 1.5mi oval... Iowa is a 0.875mi one.

Whoops ment 1.5km

Also PMD the reason Cart was spread out more was due to the fact the teams modified there aero and with 4 or more different suppliers and just as much different engine suppliers there was plenty of different suited cars to a track.

Which is the precise opposite of what TG did with the IRL, remember, 96, they used CART equipment, 97, went to spec engines/chassis (Dallara/G-Force and Infiniti/Olds)

I think the risk posed by wire debris fencing at ovals needs to be discussed. While it does its job very well, the mass of poles and metal wire effectively acts as a cheese greater to any car that touches it at speed. It dates from a time when speeds and aerodynamics meant cars were far less likely to become airborne than they are now and as such its outdated to the point of being excessively dangerous.

Large reinforced glass/transparent plastic paneling (secured from behind by heavy duty steel posts) could be an alternative, presenting a smooth impact surface to any flying cars but its likely to be prohibitively expensive and I don't know how well either material could stand up to such an onslaught. I'm sure there are many fans who would object to what is effectively a window pane isolating them from the sound and action too. Perhaps the more likely route from here will be making the cars slower and or less likely to fly.

Solutions could include flaps atop the side pods with vanes forcing them open when the car spins (as found in NASCAR), or perhaps a device that rapidly tips the rear wing to stalling when the car rotates above a certain rate, thereby helping reduce the amount of lift generated by the wayward car to some extent. There's always the chance of accidental triggering of such a relatively complex device through, which could really wreck someone's race (or worse).

As mentioned above, a move towards mechanical grip the the expense of excessive aerodynamic grip would be a good move.

Its tragic that it has come to this to highlight such a problem, there are other issues of course some of which Jody Scheckter has explained, such as cars having excessive downforce as well as running on tracks considered by many to be too fast, but hopefully the debris fencing issue will be addressed.

Rest in peace Dan.

Quote from Mustafur :

Also PMD the reason Cart was spread out more was due to the fact the teams modified there aero and with 4 or more different suppliers and just as much different engine suppliers there was plenty of different suited cars to a track.

I posted that bit fast so I skipped over stuff like that. Modified aero is true and thanks to the multiple engine suppliers. I was just wanting to get the point across the less aero created "aero wars" and limited this pack drafting that we have today. Updating the car as they did, created too much of this type racing which led to these crashes. Some could say that led to suppliers falling out, not wanting to see their product wasted in crashes.

Quote from 5haz :

I think the risk posed by wire debris fencing at ovals needs to be discussed. While it does its job very well, the mass of poles and metal wire effectively acts as a cheese greater to any car that touches it at speed. It dates from a time when speeds and aerodynamics meant cars were far less likely to become airborne than they are now and as such its outdated to the point of being excessively dangerous.

Large reinforced glass/transparent plastic paneling could be an alternative, presenting a smooth impact surface to any flying cars but its likely to be prohibitively expensive and I don't know how well either material could stand up to such an onslaught. I'm sure there are many fans who would object to what is effectively a window pane isolating them from the sound and action too. Perhaps the more likely route from here will be making the cars slower and or less likely to fly.

Almost posted this last night, but don't know how to explain it. The stuff would also have to stop a 3500lb NASCAR from flying through it as well.

Quote from DieKolkrabe :

Not totally true there Lizard, New Hampshire 1993. Look up that race, that is one of THE best oval races ever. IRL this year didn't come close at all to capturing the magic of that race. Or Phoenix 1995, another flat track with a great race.

Phoenix got repaved so might be interesting.

Quote from Mustangman759 :

Phoenix got repaved so might be interesting.

Phoenix is probably the best oval for Indy but I don't think they have the money to host an event.

Quote from DieKolkrabe :

Which is the precise opposite of what TG did with the IRL, remember, 96, they used CART equipment, 97, went to spec engines/chassis (Dallara/G-Force and Infiniti/Olds)

2013 seeks to rectify that, though with modifyable aero kits and multi engine suppliers.

Quote from 5haz :

I think the risk posed by wire debris fencing at ovals needs to be discussed. While it does its job very well, the mass of poles and metal wire effectively acts as a cheese greater to any car that touches it at speed. It dates from a time when speeds and aerodynamics meant cars were far less likely to become airborne than they are now and as such its outdated to the point of being excessively dangerous.

Large reinforced glass/transparent plastic paneling (secured from behind by heavy duty steel posts) could be an alternative, presenting a smooth impact surface to any flying cars but its likely to be prohibitively expensive and I don't know how well either material could stand up to such an onslaught. I'm sure there are many fans who would object to what is effectively a window pane isolating them from the sound and action too. Perhaps the more likely route from here will be making the cars slower and or less likely to fly.

I think the best solution would be a combination of bullet proof glass and the current catch fencing. Catch fence stops the car, bullet proof glass stops debris.

Look at how Kentucky's lower stands are configured as well. I like this idea. Stands start more than half way up the catch fence where debris is a little less of a hazard.

TMS

Turbos?

Asking for trouble, if they go 220 at LVMS, how fast will they go at Texas with the turbos?

Quote from Bmxtwins :

Also, this looks like a similar incident. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v ... LVM6s&feature=related

No, it doesn't.

Quote from Cornys :

I was meaning it poorly. That is a terrable attendance number.

The other 2 drivers have been ... being permanetly scared.

lol, permanently scared.

Quote from DieKolkrabe :

TMS

Turbos?

Asking for trouble, if they go 220 at LVMS, how fast will they go at Texas with the turbos?

Lucky most the power comes from the turbo, so they can limit the boost.

Eventhough I hate to, I gotta agree with Jimmie.

Quote from Mustafur :

Lucky most the power comes from the turbo, so they can limit the boost.

i'm guessing there will be some serious (and frantic) re writing of the regs for next season, as i posted before it was only last week that radio lemans commented that dan had told them that the new car will be touching 400 kph / 250 mph at the faster ovals as it's so efficient through the air

Quote from tinvek :

i'm guessing there will be some serious (and frantic) re writing of the regs for next season, as i posted before it was only last week that radio lemans commented that dan had told them that the new car will be touching 400 kph / 250 mph at the faster ovals as it's so efficient through the air

I think maybe rules on attacking moves might be important, limit them to 2 wide or somthing along the lines, they have spotters so it shouldn't be hard.

sorry, but that'll never work Mustafar. Too many factors, what would happen if one car slowed as two were racing side by side? Penalize everyone?

And you can't possibly expect racing drivers to not go for gaps that are physically possible for them to fit in and make stick. No, this is a technical issue, not rules of the road issue.

Really? IndyCar is THAT dangerous on ovals that it needs to stop going to ovals in general? So IndyCar at Phoenix would be a deathtrap? Or Milwaukee Mile? Or New Hampshire Speedway? Or Richmond? Yes lets condemn all of Dan Wheldon's favorite type of racing just because two categories (speedways and superspeedways) can lead to dangerous situations? Because IndyCar unacceptably dangerous on Texas and Las Vegas must mean that IndyCar is equally as dangerous on Richmond or Martinsville right?

Honest, this type of overreation is what kills motorsports at times. Yes, something must be done so Dan Wheldon incidents don't repeat. But must we really make IndyCar the American GP2 just for that? Would IndyCar at Richmond or Iowa be so infinitely more dangerous than IndyCar at Sonoma? Wasn't someone seriously injured at Sonoma too? Oh hey, lets ban road courses with blind corners now. Cause that's not an overreaction at all. No sir.

Well, summing up the reactions that were read-/seeable here in Germany:

Nigel Mansell: One mistake and you instantly end up in a wall. Formula 1 made an incredible job by giving the drivers chances to reduce speeds as there are large paved areas. I understand Jody. The smallest mistake can cause a catastrophe. When 34 cars drive around a 1.5mi oval with 300+kph, the track is overcrowded.

Jackie Stewart: It is a big warning. Some accidents have been declared only small incidents. There must be more and harder penalties for dangerous driving.

Derik Warwick: Looking at the quality of the grid, drivers need to work their way through Formula 3 and GP2 to get a superlicense. The overall quality of the IndyCar grid is questionable.

Mark Blundell: It's a Senna moment for the IndyCar community. In the time, where F1 has not suffered any driver's death, there have been 5 in the American OpenWheel racing. The series needs to sit down and analyse cars, tracks and their art of racing and and draws its consequences. On ovals, where most of the cars drive side by side with 300+kph, there is no room left for error.

Michael Schumacher: We all say that our sport has become so incredibly safe noone has to loose his life, but sadly, once again we have to realise, it is just a dream.

Niki Lauda: Dan knew about the risks driving 300+kph in these American pasta pots. It is a sad reminder that motorsport is a sport where you can risk your life.

Christian Menzel (Asian Porsche Carrera Cup Champion, driver of the Haribo Porsche in endurance races): Too many drivers think that motorsport is safe. When I raced on the Nordschleife saturday, everyone thought they would be invincible, although there have been several drivers suffering injuries and the ambulance was on track multiple times. It is a sad news. I have to say, I'm not a fan of this, targeting for the highest speeds and reduce the racing to keeping top speeds throughout a lap. When we tried it in DTM, it had really bad results, so I can immagine what has happened, but I seriously don't want to see the footage, it is too far away from what is right to me.

Reiner Braun (German commentator legend): It was an apocalypse. With speeds much faster. then F1 can do nowadays, speeds of 360kph, you can sit in the world's safest car and get injured.