Actually, having looked at this, it's a broken wing. Look where the guy with the new wing positions his hands. It's the same as the guy trying to lift the wing pff the car. He lifts the winglet and it's snapped, and then moves his hand. It's broken, nothing more.

Yes we know the winglets were broken, but the nose itself shouldn't have been damaged in either impact... unless you mean the TV camera?

Ever stop to think that there front wing assembly may require them to turn the Camera pods to get it off, if you look closely he turns the pods, then presses something underneath the nose and it comes off.

If there is Camera pod flex I don't think that would matter though because that's not exactly their design.

Considering the vast majority of camera pods are dummy pods, no I have a sneaking suspicion that isn't it.

Quote from IsaacPrice :

Well, you can tell by watching someone drive generally whether they are getting the absolute maximum out of it or not. If someone misses 3/4 apex's in a lap,

Funny you should mention that, because that is how I remember 60+% of Vettels pole laps.

Quote from CSF :

Yes we know the winglets were broken, but the nose itself shouldn't have been damaged in either impact... unless you mean the TV camera?

Sorry I mean cameras/winglet thigns, whatever the **** they are called.

Who knows how load/pressure is distributed through a wing when it ocntacts with something like a tyre or a distance board (how did he hit that? that's karma from when BUtton nearly hit him when he randomly stamped on the brakes behind a S/C a few races ago)

If this was 'normal' movement the mechanic would be thick as shit to try and lift it from that point and then revert to the centre of the nose to place his hand.

Quote from Mustafur :

That implies Massa is as good as was as Kimis team mate now, which i don't think is the case, also Hamilton Destroyed Alonso in Qualfiying in his Rookie year, what about that?

@ the first part of what you said: No? Kimi used to be team mates with Massa so comparing Alonso to Massa and Raikkonen to Massa in their comparative seasons will give some idea, not a perfect 1 but an idea. The fact Kimi's weaknesses remained the same continues that trend. There is never a definitive answer to the question, but you can get interesting insights.

@ second part: Well, he didn't actually "destroy" him in qualifying. That was a perception build up by the fact Hamilton was a rookie and shouldn't be able to walk in and do that. Hamilton did have the advantage by the end of the season in the head to head, but then compare that to Button who is a world champion who's been team mates with Hamilton, and his stats are far worse than Alonso. Its hard to say exactly how that would be different now after Hamilton has extra experience, but I think Hamilton was a very well prepared rookie entering F1 at an ideal time with the control bridgestone tyres coming in etc. Obviously not an advantage over Alonso, but made it easier to overcome the natural difficulties a rookie would have. But even Alonso himself has said he isn't the fastest in F1, looking at the very fractional differences between the top 3(Alonso, Vettel, Hamilton) qualifying is an area he lacks - yes. Alonso obviously didn't handle being beaten by a rookie very well and was destroyed in that sense, yes.

When two drivers of Equal reputation are in the same team it turns things on their head, Kimi and Montoya is a perfect example, For all we know Vettel could make Alonso look like Massa at Ferrari, those that Critque certain drivers tend to look at what they haven't done rather then what they have and thats hardly fair.

Look at Dindo Capello, the guy was in his 40's and still one of the quickest LMP1 drivers going and both Nigel Mansell AND Alain Prost were almost 40 when they win in 1992 and 1993 respectively. So to suggest people peak at 'x' age is stupid. You can't suggest that, every person is different mentally AND physically and both of these things are required to stay at the top of the game but Simon, jesus christ.

Let it go.

Quote from BlueFlame :

Look at Dindo Capello, the guy was in his 40's and still one of the quickest LMP1 drivers going and both Nigel Mansell AND Alain Prost were almost 40 when they win in 1992 and 1993 respectively. So to suggest people peak at 'x' age is stupid. You can't suggest that, every person is different mentally AND physically and both of these things are required to stay at the top of the game but Simon, jesus christ.

Let it go.

and both those years the car was seconds faster then anything else.

I would say given the physical nature of todays car the physical peak would be late 20s and mental peak early 30s, sure people are different thats why i didn't mention exact years.

Quote from Mustafur :

and both those years the car was seconds faster then anything else.

They still had to beat their team-mates.

Quote from BlueFlame :

They still had to beat their team-mates.

you don't have to be at your peak to beat your team mate.

Quote from Mustafur :

you don't have to be at your peak to beat your team mate.

Well, you do have to be better than them at least.

Quote from BlueFlame :

Well, you do have to be better than them at least.

One of which was older then Mansell, besides in those times teams put all there resources to the first car and the second driver got the scraps.

Also just because a driver may not be at their Peak doesn't mean they can't beat someone who is, there is still a thing called TALENT.

Blueflame why do you post before you think?

Or is this your actual thought out opinion?

Quote from SCA-F1 :

Complete tat

If we all read words and comprehended something else entirely like you the world would be a joyous place to be indeed.

Quote from SCA-F1 :

u just make urself look like an imbecile

Irony.

Quote from SCA-F1 :

Then take ur head out of the sand and look at the screen instead of resorting to such simplistic terms. Of course u can never be completely accurate with opinions, especially as a spectator but we're 18 races into this season now, and there's a lot u can pick out from trends and actually watching them drive as Isaac already mentioned. Don't be so dismissive now just cos it suits u.

If u want to be really picky: just before R14, Grosjean had outqualified Räikkönen 9-5, whilst Alonso was 14-0 ahead of Massa in the qualifying comparisons. Go to 2008/9, and Massa often outqualified Kimi when they were team-mates, so what does that tell u... I know that's a bit of an ambitious claim seenas a lot has changed since 3 years ago, but qualifying is still very important nowadays and a good indicator of outright pace - even if it doesn't decide the race. What makes it more difficult to understand is Kimi - a world champion, losing out to rookie Grosjean in pressure qualifying situation.. why should he get outqualified so often by a rookie if he's such a great and deserving champion? Things like this are what separate him from Alonso and Hamilton. This leads onto..:

You are correct that Kimi has never been the fastest qualifying driver. The reason he's so great is his race pace. Another thing is that to me it seemed in 2008 and start of 2009 like Ferrari actually did everything like Massa wanted. Once Massa was injured Kimi won with acar that hadn't received any upgrades in months and was supposed to be 1.5 seconds slower than the top teams.

Also try to understand that Kimim ade mistakes in the beginning of season simply because he hadn't driven a car like this in 2 years and it took time to get him comfortable with the car. There is a reason why almost every single driver fail after having a year or two break from driving F1.

I would also like to note that Grosjean is actually a really fast driver in terms of qualifying speed. He's just not as good driver in the races. Kovalainen kicked Hamilton's ass in qualis and Mclaren had to put him to lousy pit strategies to keep him behind Hamilton, still no one sees Hamilton as slow driver. There are countless examples like this you don't use as they affected to some drivers whose personalities you like.

Quote from Juzaa :

Once Massa was injured Kimi won with acar that hadn't received any upgrades in months and was supposed to be 1.5 seconds slower than the top teams.

0.5s behind Brawn and Red Bull at Turkey - which is as good as reference track as any.

Also, Kimi's debut year at Sauber had him in the 4th or 5th best car, not a Caterham which races in a sub-class of F1. Much more like a Mercedes or (LOL) a Sauber.

Kimi is a good driver, very quick when he has clear air. There's nothing wrong with him per se and he's a World Champion. What I don't understand is where this mystique that surrounds him has come from. Why do so many people cream themselves whenever his name is mentioned? That's nothing to do with stats or comparing him with other drivers, that's an emotional response and I don't see anything in him that would drive that.

Kevin Magnussen fastest in this mornings Formula 1 test at Abu Dhabi.
Lunchtime: Magnussen (1:42.651), da Costa (1:42.717), Prost (1:45.318), Frijns (1:45.878), Razia (1:46.793), van der Garde (1:48.193).


Unreal.
Go on cousin!

Quote from Storm_Cloud :

0.5s behind Brawn and Red Bull at Turkey - which is as good as reference track as any.

Also, Kimi's debut year at Sauber had him in the 4th or 5th best car, not a Caterham which races in a sub-class of F1. Much more like a Mercedes or (LOL) a Sauber.

Kimi is a good driver, very quick when he has clear air. There's nothing wrong with him per se and he's a World Champion. What I don't understand is where this mystique that surrounds him has come from. Why do so many people cream themselves whenever his name is mentioned? That's nothing to do with stats or comparing him with other drivers, that's an emotional response and I don't see anything in him that would drive that.

True, but in Germany more than 2 seconds off the pace in qualifying (in both Q2 and Q3). It still remains a fact that Räikkönen won at Spa with a car that had received no modifications since the dawn of time and at the moment if I remember right the car was supposed to be over a second slower than the rest as they had implemented new parts and Ferrari had not 1.5 seconds may have been slightly too much. Remember that Turkey was 2 months before Spa. And it's not about Spa either as he was 3rd in Monza and 4th in Suzuka with the same car that was 0.5 seconds off the pace in Turkey and two seconds off the pace in Germany.

Why there are so many Kimi fans is probably explainable by his attitude. He doesn't care about anything else than driving and almost never made mistakes due to pressure (Iceman). Besides who wouldn't like his comments in the last race? The team was distracting him so he said what he thought. There's no act in anything he does. You either like it or don't but you can't deny his skill.

Also to note at that time 4th or 5th best team meant something completely different than it means now as the gaps between teams was huge. This year both Sauber and Mercedes could be classified as capable of winning cars (even though technically Sauber hasn't won a race). Sauber in 2001 was nowhere near that.

Quote from Intrepid :

Sorry I mean cameras/winglet thigns, whatever the **** they are called.

Who knows how load/pressure is distributed through a wing when it ocntacts with something like a tyre or a distance board (how did he hit that? that's karma from when BUtton nearly hit him when he randomly stamped on the brakes behind a S/C a few races ago)

If this was 'normal' movement the mechanic would be thick as shit to try and lift it from that point and then revert to the centre of the nose to place his hand.

Could be, lets see what comes of it. ScarbsF1 certainly thinks its interesting!

E: Actually, there could be something in the fact that the supports could be broken, but I don't think the nose should move like that, especially with the ripples in the carbon?

Quote from CSF :

Could be, lets see what comes of it. ScarbsF1 certainly thinks its interesting!

E: Actually, there could be something in the fact that the supports could be broken, but I don't think the nose should move like that, especially with the ripples in the carbon?

true, carbon is not soft in any ways.

must contain some plastic, so much for Non-movable aero.....

Exactly, it shouldn't move like that.

Someone also posted this:



Could it be that Red Bull have found away to use the nose to move the un-aerodynamic camera pods while at high speed?

The nose-cone is just a piece of thin carbon-fibre bodywork which floats a long way out from the front end of the crash structure. It's not rigid, so it will inevitably flex. There isn't really any trickery involved and Red Bull is certainly not the only team with that sort of setup. I'm not surprised to see flexing around, especially when the car is bouncing on the kerbs.

Look at the McLaren, for example. You can visibly see the dip in both the nose-cone and the front wing (put a ruler across the screen when the nose is highest and compare its position when it dips). The nose-cone begins to flex quite steeply about a foot forward of the antennae.

(Taken from autosport.com)