Hello!

I am thinking of upgrading my current wheel (R440 by saitek), and Logitech DFGT seems like a reasonable choice, but the thing that i'm curious about are the sequential shift buttons instead of paddles.
Is it too different? Good/bad experiences?

(btw i know you can mod the wheel, but i'd rather not do that )

How much is this DFGT?

i'm looking at second hand market, they usually go for round 80 euros here, ideally i'd like to get a G27 i think, but can't justify paying 2 times more

What exactly do you want to know? DFGT has both paddles (allthough they're quite small and hardly usable when wheel is turned ~180°) and shifter,which I personally use as handbrake. Never tried to use shifter as gear shifter,but I suppose it's just something to get used with,as it's still a faster solution for shifting then H-shifter.

dfgt has more of a buttons than proper paddles, i just wanted to know how they feel to use :]

Ehmm,imagine driving real car with normal manual gearbox. And then imagine that you can do the shift by just pulling the stick. Should be explained... Probably the only disadvantage would be when you need to shift while keeping steering wheel at constant angle - taking hand away to shift might disturb then.
Can't help any further here,I still fight with button-paddles and use the shifter as handbrake,feels better to me.

I have DFGT and in lfs i was always using shifter instead of "paddles", for me it's much more comfortable. Beside that my paddles are dead, since i was raping them hard while playing F1 from codemaster . I can repair them, have new buttons already, they are cheap, just few cents. They're same buttons like in your mouse for right/left button.
Huge advantage for DFGT is that it has a lot of buttons, and most of them are really comfortable to use while driving. I had up to 7 or 8 binded msgs set on it, which i could use while driving easly + gears on shifter + handrake on "x" + ignition, restart race, return to pit, horn, cluch on up arrow (left side of wheel), change camera, f9 menu (tyres), and probably few more which i don't remember. All of them binded to wheel and easy to press while driving. I think it beats most of other wheels possibilities while comes to buttons, and how easy they are to find/press while driving. And i forgot to mention that it's rare situation that you have to change gear in the middle of a corner, and even if that happens, then for me it's not a big deal to drive using one hand for 1 or 2 secs. It even gives extra satisfaction and reality feeling

Some time ago i was searching for new wheel and i was confused, because g25 for me don't have enough buttons, and g27 have only h-shifter or paddles, not sequential shifter which i want to use. And i still don't know what to do sice my DFGT is slowly dying (that wheel is like 6 years with me already, and i bought used one ) But you can be sure DFGT is great wheel, and it gives you a lot of possibilities to configure in the way you like, with all that buttons it has. Paddles are small, and it may look like they're hard to use, but it isn't that bad. Ofc big paddles are better, but the ones that DFGT have are also good. And driving with shifter isn't hard too, it's just matter of getting used to it.

PS. If you will decide to buy it, it has like one well known issue. The pedals, they're good until they'll break And they usually break pretty fast, but you will find a lot of tutorials, on how to deal with it, on the web. Also suprisingly my pedals have over 6 years (maybe 6.5y or maybe 7.5y, dunno), and they work. Sure they have some glitter and other issues, and it's getting worse and worse, but im still able to race normally, and im not even noticing that something is wrong, sometimes cleaning the inside of them helps.

Cheers, Anici<3

@Rony, i meant shifting with the buttons, i know it has the seq shifter (and it would be really handy as a handbrake, i actually tried the wheel a few years back but i didnt play lfs back then and i think it was nfs with autogears anyway

the thing i'm concerned about is if they are reachable (which you said not really when turning ), if they click nicely, are they prone to double shift.... etc

@razor, that has me a bit worried that they might go pretty quick, i'm not exactly gentle when shifting ahem looking at the layout, are the two buttons on top of the center hub easily reached when turning? (for looking left/right), the lack of buttons wouldn't be that much of an issue given that i expertly modified (taped a cut up gamepad to it) my saitek which has 4 buttons i'll try to find a pic.

Thanks for the bit on pedals, nothing to compare with, but i quite like the saitek pedals, not sure if it'd be possible to use them with the dfgt tho, if it would i 'd definitely like to try and do that!


TL:DR, thanks guys, from what i gather the dfgt is a decent wheel, but i'm still not 100% sold on the paddles

Meh,maybe I read it wrong,must be the extra hours I have to do latelly...
Yea,paddle-buttons not very comfy when turning,but otherwise they do their job,had few double shifts time to time during the 4 years I use it,but not too often. Had few pedal spikes after 2 years or so,but opening and cleaning them solved the problem. What I noticed during these 4 years - wheel center (and I mean the physical one,as sensor works still like new) was very solid when new,which was different from cheap wheels I had before,now it has quite a bit of movement. Not really distubing anything,but just a proof that the plastic tends to wear out,maybe proper greasing might reduce the wearing,I have done that only once...

Quote from johneysvk :

i quite like the saitek pedals, not sure if it'd be possible to use them with the dfgt tho, if it would i 'd definitely like to try and do that!

Sure you can - just plug in both wheels,you can calibrate any axis you like as pedals.

Quote from johneysvk :

@razor, that has me a bit worried that they might go pretty quick, i'm not exactly gentle when shifting ahem looking at the layout, are the two buttons on top of the center hub easily reached when turning? (for looking left/right), the lack of buttons wouldn't be that much of an issue given that i expertly modified (taped a cut up gamepad to it) my saitek which has 4 buttons i'll try to find a pic.

As someone else said, paddles arent great, but they are doing their job just fine. Also don't be worried, one of my paddle starter to do some double clicks after like 4 years of usage, and im not gentle too. Even if they will start double clicking, you can replace them with buttons same as in pc mouse. I have somewhere 2 of them, got them from my friend but you can find it on some online shops (they aren't related to dfgt, just regular cheap buttons). The price was like 50 groszy which is 0.5PLN which is like 12 euro cents for one . And the most comfortable buttons to click while turning are, heh funny, the paddles and shifter also, for me at least, but since i use both of them to something else, i've mapped circle for looking right and left Button on the cross, for looking left. That looking left isn't Perfect, because sometimes during battle while cornering it's easy to press up or down Button togrther with left, and it wont work i that case. But i think you can find a better Button for it. I think that if someone is using shifter for gears, then paddles are best for looking left/right

if you are gonna buy a wheel for around £100 buy a thrustmaster t150, it will be new so you get that and it is better than the DFGT

Well, I have the DFGT for two years now and shift buttons works without problem still. Wheel and the steering itself is quite OK. Had G25 previously, of course it had more power in FFB and feel of the wheel was more realistic overall but otherwise it's not that big of a difference. Biggest flaw in my opinion for DFGT is pedals, to be honest they are bad..especially can feel it when you have tried at least G25/27/29 pedals before. But then again - we can't expect much more for the price.
As a positive side - all the buttons on wheel are very handy, that's actually very important when the keyboard is not easily accessible while racing.

Quote from k_badam :

if you are gonna buy a wheel for around £100 buy a thrustmaster t150, it will be new so you get that and it is better than the DFGT

Well, i have to say you inspired me to do some research, and im seriously thinking about changing my DFGT for T150 from what i've read it's smoother and quieter than g27 and g29, not even talking about that screaming DFGT . Also paddles are real paddles, not just buttons, shame it doesn't have shifter, since im mostly using it. But how about pedals compared to DFGT? Did you use T150, or anyone else can tell something?

@johneysvk i think you should rly think about T150, it might be better than DFGT

yeah, i was reading up on that too, really tempting, just haven't heard much good aboug thrustmaster.
although if buying new therre's warranty...

might pull a trigger on it, the paddles themselves are a big plus for me

Quote from johneysvk :

yeah, i was reading up on that too, really tempting, just haven't heard much good aboug thrustmaster.
although if buying new therre's warranty...

might pull a trigger on it, the paddles themselves are a big plus for me

Yeah, i've read that pedals aren't really good in that thrustmaster t150, but DFGT ones are bad too. Just don't know if the ones t150 has are better or worse than the DFGT pedals. Im not sure about prices, but probably for about 80£ you can buy T3PA pedals for t150 which have a clutch, and from what i've read are same or better than g29 pedals, and for about 140£ you can buy T3PA PRO which are better and cooler version of regular ones

Well, more expensive thrustmaster stuff has a reputation for being really good quality, cheaper stuff, meh quality. This one looks to have a better wheel but rubbish pedals (if you get the T150 try getting better pedals). I used my old £50, crappy 90 degree thrustmaster wheel loads (each month saw about 30 hours of use) for a year, until the clamp broke, that is an easy fix but a few weeks later the pedals packed in... Then i got a G27 . These pedals look the same (might not be), they are really quite bad quality (plasticy, light weight and barely stayed still even on carpet), but, the wheel should be good quality as it is part of the 'txxx' range. Having said all of that, the DFGT pedals probably aren't that much better, i am sure you could ask someone that has owned/owns a DFGT to get their opinions.

so, my wheel is starting to fall apart pretty much decided on getting the T150 at this point

How is T150's central dead zone, compared to DFGT's annoying one?

Quote from Ripley :

central dead zone [...] DFGT's annoying one?

Hmm,I'm using DFGT for 4.5 years already,I still haven't noticed any dead zone...

Lucky you!
Maybe "dead" zone isn't completely correct.
It's more a mechanical issue than a software one.
I guess I already posted about this problem long time ago.

Anyway, I'm driving on a straight, gently zig-zagging: there is a mechanical point at the wheel rotation center where the belt inside the wheel inverts from right to left (and viceversa) and in that moment it's as if I don't have control of the wheels.

It's just a small amount of "play", but it sure annoys me.

Quote from Ripley :

...I guess I already posted about this problem long time ago...

Here it is
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/86217

I've had a DFGT for a couple of years too, and can confirm awesome amount and positioning of buttons, and good strength FFB (I like my cars to fight back, 200% strength FTW!).

The shift buttons on the wheel are good, but can be a little awkward if you're steering to the point where you have to take a hand off the wheel when you want to change gear. It's a racing problem as far as I'm concerned - I just get it in the gear I want before I crank the steering in any problem corners - no worse than getting a little one-hand-wobble going on when you reach for the sequential or h-shift, just something that comes from only having two hands If I can cope with it in banger racing where I'm face-in to a wall in 2nd and steering hard over every other 15-second lap, then you're good

The pedals feel a little fragile, but I'm happy with them. I've not used anything hardier to compare with, but you don't stamp them like you would in an IRL car. My pedal pots are a little crackly and cause the throttle to jitter a little sometimes, but I haven't got around to cleaning them as the problem isn't great enough for me to risk a DIY clean yet. Common problem apparently, but another DFGT racer I know has done the clean and fixed it with no hassle (Hi Loon!).

I have no deadzone whatsoever, but I do get a little self-correction FFB jitter sometimes. Nothing bad, just a slightly annoying noise that is fixed with a gentle touch, or giving LFS focus. I'm guessing this is the opposite of having a deadzone - that even the tiniest little movement causes a detectable change and from there the corrections oscillate - I've seen other people mention this jitter, so I imagine that a deadzone isn't common.

Quote from Racon :

I have no deadzone whatsoever, but I do get a little self-correction FFB jitter sometimes. Nothing bad, just a slightly annoying noise that is fixed with a gentle touch, or giving LFS focus. I'm guessing this is the opposite of having a deadzone - that even the tiniest little movement causes a detectable change and from there the corrections oscillate - I've seen other people mention this jitter, so I imagine that a deadzone isn't common.

Yup,well known stuff for me too - usually got the same effect after self calibration of the wheel.

About pedals - I have opened them twice,first time to grease,as they were sqeeking slightly,second time to clean,as throttle was a bit unsteady and jittery,cleaned the potis and works like new again for a year now.

What I have noticed is the wear of center - brand new it was tight without slightest wobble,now I can move the wheel about 5mm up from normal position. Still - it does not affect steering sensors,so it's not a big deal.

Quote from Eclipsed :

...What I have noticed is the wear of center - brand new it was tight without slightest wobble,now I can move the wheel about 5mm up from normal position. Still - it does not affect steering sensors,so it's not a big deal.

So, that's it. This is what I meant.

I don't think so - I never need to gently zig-zag,I can still drive perfectly straight,where every slight wheel movement leads to exactly same car movement.
I did not ment the wear of center of the steering wheel's connection to any gears or sensors,which causes the dead center,I ment just physical attachment to housing.

dfgt is a lot more reliable than t150 (atleast by my experience), had dfgt for years with no problems, last year switched to brand new t150 (dfgt finally gave in), pedals broke after 2 months, returned it and got replacement, 2 months and wheels internals gave in, returned it and got used g27 instead and haven't had any problems since. But when t150 actually works its hands down way better than dfgt