I took a look at your FOX replay too.
What you need to do is to use the whole width of the track. You entried pretty much every corner too much in the inside. Which made you slow down a lot. You need to come in at the outside then cut to the apex and then power out to the outside again. Also you had a lot of fuel there, sure if it is an endurance race you need a lot of fuel, but on short races too much fuel costs you valuable seconds.

Then two things I do differently than you (faster guys might do it different): I go down to second in the first and last corner, to get more engine braking and better acceleration out of the corner. Second thing is the first chicane, I usually tap on the brakes and lift off slightly to make the car turn. you really shouldn't lift much there, I think that the faster guys go flat out there (?).

I got a setup from redlines CptKirk and its grips very well, But i can't hold the revs through the frisrt chicane and bit before the last chicane cause i don't wann run off i turn a little more and this brings the revs down, CptKirk also mentioned change my wheel lock to lock deg to 400ish even though its a 180 deg wheel, And its has helped turning in if made things a alittle twitchy, I mangage to get 1:03.4something but other than the two place where my revs drop there isn't many more places to go faster

Im still 3 second slow, Not only that i got baned from Racing Redline 2 cause i get past by everyone off the line and i clipped somes back wheel, Not that i got a chance to say sorry, I have more rear down force all thats done is giving me more understeer I just can not make the car drive like you are and stay on the track, It just dosen't wanna feel like a real car and i know your gunna say its as close as, But i've been looking at NetkarPRO and its all based on real single seater cars driven by real pro drivers, Its looks really good, But all i could do was turn the car on, I couldn't get into gear and try it, I just wanted to see if it would help me in LFS but nothing seem to work without really bad side affects, Twitchy steering, Understeer on flatout turns and granraly nothing to leave the corner faster, Braking later and harder stores momentom and makes the car wanna go to the outside aswell as making my turn in point to late, This wouldn't be to bad if a knew how to tweak a setup to minamlise this, But i am just a driver, NOT a mechanic

Now im having trouble turning enough into the chicane cause it floats through and makes it hard to turn right out, I've watched a bunch of replays but without feeling it through the wheel its pretty much useless to me, Im using the eaxcat same line and entree speed, But where everyones grips turning right on the exit, Mineundersteer throught slightly leftand then floats the rest only just missing the tyres and the outside wall like a clipped a patch of oil or something, Using CptKirks setup i dobbled it and reduced the brakes by 50 and add .300 to the final drive helping some, Lighter brakes so it dosen't lunge forwards when i let off and the accell up slightly is keeping the revs higher but the 400ish lock to lock deg shakes the wheel at high speeds its mainly that chicane and the line into the the last turn i don't quite get

I am really at a loss with these slick tyres, I've been doing what everyone has said and yet the car still will not drive like i see in replays and online, I am using the same lines and same speeds that i see in replays, But the outcome for me is always loss of grip on slow turns and rev drops on faster turns [Cause i've been told to stay away from the curbs and the grass i need to turn tight and that pulls down my top speed] As for these slick tyre being real, You should look at the tyres for NetKarPRO, They modled it so the tyre pick up dirt and you can see the tyre wear on the rubber, Altho i could get into gear and test the physics but the look real enough saying tha they are real race cars, Whitch i think is the problem, Cause LFS cars aren't real, The wheel base or something must be afftecting the way im reading the slick tyre or the tyres are affecting the way i read the car, But i have no idea what dose what, I just drive and i can't on'y do that with a setup tuens for me, But i don't have no one who can help me with this, People have started and i thank them all for it, I just need alittle more to get the car to handle like i see it doing for everyone else

Quote from Koshi_Eternium :

Cause i've been told to stay away from the curbs and the grass i need to turn tight and that pulls down my top speed

No no. You need to do the exact opposite. Ride the curbs, use all the road available. Well, usually staying off the grass is usually a good idea, but for example in AS Club (the one you have been driving) you can even ride the grass on the first chicane's exit pretty safely.

PS. Stop blaming LFS' physics for your slowness.

If i touch the curbs the tyre loses grip causing the other tyres to follow suit, Its not like i dunno how to drive, the car just will not handle like i see in replays even though its the same setup same speed and lines, If its not the phisics is how everyone is drving the way they are and not letting me know what exactly it is that im missing so i can drive like it?

Will do another replay but its really starting to bug the snot out of me cause i can't see where i am going wrong, I try to keep in high revs but turning even on high speen turns make them drop

I just tried about 50 time to take that first chicane in 5th 120mph, Like i've been told and i've seen on replays, But my front tyres don't do enough anything i can do to help this? I was think about take the final drive from 4.500 it about 3.500 and taking the chicane is 4th but would that make me slower, I have no idea or comparson apart from the replays the i can't drive like

And when i use the grass on the exit of that chicane it flicks my tail out and loses me and 15-20 MPH

Kirk tried to show me it on line but even with Shift-F8 it was still too jumpy to follow, I see the line, But the car dosen't want to turn enough to dodge the tyres without me having to back off the power

1. Your tyres are much too cold.
   
2. For whatever reason you now use R2 slicks? That's not going to make it easier.
   
3. You don't go far enough right before the chicane, heck you almost start in the middle, no wonder that doesn't work.

The only decent try was the last one, but there you went too wide to the right, clipping the grass and thus making your tyres dirty. Then it seemed you gave up and just bolted straight over the grass on the left, which obviously ended by you barging into the tyrestacks. Please stop blaming the tyres or the car or whatever else - your driving style, while probably lasting the tyres forever, is simply too slow.

I did an analysis of your driving compared to mine and to the 2nd of the hotlap chart (wr owner did his on lap 44, so it would have taken very long to get a telemetry there ). My line is in blue, fast guys is in red and your is in green. This was your 2nd lap of the latest replay.


First of all, you started the lap at a bit slower speed than me and even more slower than the fast guy. Due to not being very fast on the previous lap you had somewhat less speed coming to T1. Still, you started braking first from the three of us. You also started to turn pretty late. Look how the fast guy started to brake later and turned in very early. He used all the road while making a very smooth turn. While on the other hand you did a steep turn. You got on the throttle a bit earlier, but you also slowed down more in the corner.

What I found odd on the little strecth of straight before the chicane was that you lifted quite a bit on gearchanges there. You lost some time there also.


Then came the chicane. In there you turned in too steep again. Which is why you had to lift the throttle while me and the fast guy went flatout. Also you turned the wheel over twice the amount.


After the chicane you avoided the wall too much and tried to turn too steeply again.



On the second chicane you turned again too much. Some time lost there also.


When coming to the last corners you had a less speed compared. it was due to you going slow on the 1st chicane, turning too much after it and turning too much on the 2nd chicane.
Then you braked early, but only with half the force. It also took you a long time to get back on the throttle. The fast guy was only off thottle a very short time while I had some throttle on all through.


Then the exit of the last turn you avoided the kerbs, which both me and the fast guy didn't. Which you also corrected by turning too steep again.


I think your problem is that you try to avoid the kerbs too much and drive too cautiosly. You seem to miss turn ins too. Less steering action is the goal, that way you can keep the speed up.

Hopefully this helps you.

PS. sorry about the too wide images.

^ Very nice analysis

It would be nice if i knew how to read them graphs [But too poor quality] as i said im just a driver and make use of them, But its the same as replays i just can't match them with getting side effect that no one else seems to get, Geeman i've tried putting what everyone has told me together, I was told to brake harder and later, Thats whats making my turn in bad and if a braked any later i wouldn't make T1 at all if a do not turn that much i can not turn enough I have to turn more or it dosen't stay on the track, I just don't get how the cars hold for everyone else but not me, Its not like i have no driving experance witch is why its bugging me so bad no matter what i do, Its pushing me to the point where im gunna smash my wheel and uninstall the game but i don't wanna do that, i just wanna join some leagus and stuff

So how do i get the front wheel to grip into the chicane cause they just side forwards? And if i life off the front tyres still don't grip and turn the car i being a as smooth with the wheel I just can't win I do something, Its wrong I do something else its still wrong Like T1 Kirk siad just as that curb starts any later and the won't turn in and gose wide So i ether need someone to teamspeak me round so they can tell me the exact point or that chicane need flaterning slight, And since the track will neven change im stuck with a game i want to play but theres no point in cause i can't drive the car i see everyone do, No matter on setup or driving style

Hmm... Let me ask you this then. How much time have you put into whatever combo it is that's giving you trouble? You see, you come across as a bit too impatient, and as if you want results immediately. In your replays you didn't even do enough laps to get your tires warm.

Getting to a level where you can compete for the podium on most LFS servers can take a lot of practice (as in driving lap upon lap until your head spins). Heck, I've played LFS semi-seriously for close to 4 years now and I'm still thoroughly mid-pack.

Just be patient and keep practicing. Set youself small but achievable goals (for instance dropping 2 tenths off your laptime) and shoot for them instead of chasing the aliens you find on most LFS servers.

alto gether i must of gone round that track atleat 500 times in a row and i must of entered that chicane about 5000 times and everytime the front dosen't grip unless a turn more or slow down, Its noit that im that impatant, I know how to take the lines and everyting, But the car just will not hold at them speeds, Theres no way i can go flat through that chicane cause i hit the tyres everytime, All i want to do is go online and have a couple of good races but i can't even do that, I seem to get this in all my games, Albtross18, I can hit shots really well and they get really close but never in and Anarchy Online By the time i got new stuff for my chara its all useless and i have to get more, But i've always been better at driving game altho i just can't grip where everyone else is flatout

Quote from Koshi_Eternium :

But i've always been better at driving game altho i just can't grip where everyone else is flatout

Then don't take it flat out. Drive within you limits first. Get comfortable, and most importantly consistent, then start to push. Try taking a different line, turn in earlier, turn in later, lift a little less, try applying brakes while still on the throttle. There's no other way to do it. We can't give you exact instructions on how to take the corner, we can only tell you if you're doing something blatantly wrong. You need to do the fine tuning yourself.

If you can't team speak could i meet someone online and follow them as they build the speeds up slowy and show me some other lines cause i can't find one through the chicane that works

Your braking and initial turn in seems to be alot of it. You're to cautious onto the brakes at speed, when you have the most available braking because of downforce, and to aggressive on them when you're starting to turn in. Also, you're just not using much track, and the narrower path you're using is longer than everyone else's. Which is taking you more time, and you're scrubbing off more speed. Out of the corner, you're not getting onto the gas soon enough, nor unwinding the wheel soon enough and letting your momentum carry you to the outside edge of the track. This is killing your speed on the straights.

Last thing, are you letting off the gas and shifting? Because your shifting seems way slower than even with cut on.

Im just doind what i have been told and that was to brake later and harder and thats what im doing so how am i still being cautious when if i leave it another meter it'll overrun the corner aswell as not turning in?

Yeah i let go to shift, cause i use an auto cluch without the thortal blip/cut on shift, Is that why everyone passes me from a standing start?

Quote from Koshi_Eternium :

Im just doind what i have been told and that was to brake later and harder and thats what im doing so how am i still being cautious when if i leave it another meter it'll overrun the corner aswell as not turning in?

The braking is not your biggest problem. It's like the effect of your bad lines. You really need to work on your lines, that analysis I did showed that your lines are way off.

Turn 1 brake on just on the side of the kurb, left tyre almost on it. Then after the apex gently release the steering and almost hit the kurb on the outside.

The chicane is hard, I know because I have struggled with it before. The thing is that you need to turn really early in to it, even before you really even see the apex. Get your left front tyre on the kerb, it will help you with turning but if you have good setup you shouldn't have to worry about spinning (it may feel like the car is going out of control when it isn't). After the chicane gently wander to near the wall. Use the least amount of steering you can without hitting the wall.

On the second chicane you need to hit the kurbs on both sides (left tyre over the left kerb and right tyre over the right kerb).

On the last turn go the outside, brake turn in and almost hit the kurb on the inside. Then throttle out over the kerb on the left (go straigth over it) so that you get almost a straigth line from then on to the straigth.

Quote :

Yeah i let go to shift, cause i use an auto cluch without the thortal blip/cut on shift, Is that why everyone passes me from a standing start?

LFS currently doesn't model gearbox damage etc. so you can flatshift all the time. Even if you want to be realistic and not flatshift, you shouldn't lift the throttle too much, really quick lift and only a little bit. Without the throttle blip you need to manually blip the throttle on downshifts so that the car won't go out of shape!

If this doesn't help, I am out of ideas.

Could you post a reaplay of about 3/4 speed then a full speed lap please so i can try and find that turn in point for the chicane, But from what your say i need to turn less sooner, is that right? Also would a little bit more front downforce help me with the chicane?

Thanks for everyones time, I know i can get alittle hot headed at times, Thats just cause i know i can do this and its getting to me thats its not working, If i can do even under 1:03.00 I'll be happy anymore will be bonus

And sorry again to the guy i hit in Racing Redline2 who ever he is[I know that one side of his car was black and the other yellow] that got me baned for the day, I wasn't used to the extra steering lock CptKirk surgested and it jumped left and i countered to much and shot rightm Into his back wheel, I dropped the steer lock from 400ish it 360 and it seems to be pretty stable

I would like to try this NetKarPRO out, Cause its what im trying to do here just think a slightly differnt perseptive may give me what im missing in LFS, But all i can do is get the car to turn on i can't engage a gear and go, Its also teams with a real lift telematry program i think thats why i can't do anything on it, If someone has a go and thinks it would help me can they tell what that did to get the car to move? And if it'll help me find what i am missing here?
http://www.netkar-pro.com/
Thanks

I won't get into troble for posting another game like that will i?, Just it seem like theres just as much effort on realisim in NetKar has as been but into LFS, Sorry if this is bad tell me and i'll won't do it again and delete this post

I've done what geeman said with another 100 or so gos at the chicane and i still don't have any front wheel grip to make the frist section, I've tried more down force softer tyres and surspention but nothing with get the car to turn like im seeing it turn and i can't read the analisis so its not gunna help

Do you know if the ghostcar mod works with PatchW? cause having something to drive with might help me find the right line

maybe it's the way you turn in?

You are not smooth enough in the transition between straight line and cornering, maybe you are trying to force the car in? But that in return create sudden loadings to the front that they can't keep up with.

I think you are somehow expecting understeer tendency and want to compensate it with more rapid steering before the apex. Trying smoothing the turn in and don't be afraid with the understeer, since this car is pretty steerable mid corner, generally more flowing and less agressive.