Hi,

I wonder if anybody has taken the time to download and play with bob's track builder (http://www.bobstrackbuilder.net)? It's relatively new and still has a ways to go (as of right now it only lets you edit the track surface itself, not terrain or roadside objects yet - that is planned though), but it shows a lot of promise I think. It currently can export tracks compatible with RBR and rFactor. Does anybody else desire such a track builder for LFS? I've been a [very happy] LFS user for years, but one of the things I've really wanted is the ability to build tracks, primarily so that I could model local roads that I am familiar with - I think it would be a blast to drive around my town. I know the LFS team has stated they plan to release a track editor "after primary development is done", but they won't answer more specifically than that, and it could be many more years (if ever) before we actually see it. So I'm wondering what the odds might be that they would release enough details such that a third party (such as the aforementioned) could work on an editor, then we all would benefit and it wouldn't take the time of the LFS development team to prep their own builder for release. Seems like a win/win. Thoughts?

By the way I'm not affiliated in any way with this tool, I just think it is cool - having played with it, it's REAL easy to build tracks, and as I said it shows a lot of promise, and being a total LFS junkie it would be great to see it be compatible.

Jim

The track editor (along with any other dev tools) won't be released until most of the work is done, if at all, to prevent major issues with patches and all that junk. I doubt they'd allow a third party tool to do what they won't give you the tools they made to do :P

BTB is indeed a cool tool. I was thinking about getting into track making for rF because I have a lot of really cool ideas and things I'd like to drive on. Unfortunately I've been having issues with it running really really slow on both of my computers. Neither I nor Bob seemed to have been able to figure it out (although I have yet to try the newest version).

If I can't get it to work, I'll just wait for the LFS track tools, if we get them. I don't like rF anymore at all anyways...

There is a bit of interest judging by the webstats showing hits from this thread.

I rarely get to play any sim these days as making BTB consumes almost all of my spare time. I do still come back to LFS when I want to feel contact with the track again. It and RBR are my main sims of choice but rF is good for sheer volume of cars and tracks available and the netcode is still the best I've seen but admittedly I don't get online much these days.
As for support for LFS, I hope it can happen one day and there's a glimmer of hope on the horizon but the devs are naturally very busy making more improvements so it may be a while away before we get an answer either way.

@MAGGOT, I am still listening for your feedback in the RSC thread if ever you do decide to build again but seeing as no one else has had your problem, and because BTB was working on both of your machines at one stage with certain display drivers seems to indicate that this issue is particular to your setup. Finding a solution will be difficult but I will persist if you want to keep giving feedback. I am getting a new PC soon so I'll have both a nVidia and ATI card config so should be able to load up the same drivers as you.

If BTB can eventually offer LFS support then it will still be worth building those tracks in preparation. Exporting to one sim or another will be very simple.

Cheers,
Brendon.

I'll give it a go for sure Brendon I honestly don't know what the issue could have been; like I said on RSC nothing had changed on my system to make BTB stop working, it just slowed right down after the first time I added a background image and it's never worked properly since.

I'll give the new version a try tommorrow.

Any luck? I sent you a PM so we can test further without filling up the forum, but then the forum was offline for a while so I hope you received it.

Yep, I recieved it yesturday, but I was feeling the after-effects of the night before and went back to bed. I'll give it all a go today for sure, and email you my results.

I just want to say thank-you for pursuing this so much (even onto another forum! ). Really shows your character

Thanks again,
MAG

v0.3.1.0 has been released!!

http://www.bobstrackbuilder.net/news.aspx

Now with Richard burns Rally support. Watch this to see how easy it is to create a track.

Other additions:

• Sped up loading of track window.
  
• Implemented new iconic method of selecting materials / textures.
  
• Materials can now optionally used the Specular and Bump maps thus allowing better framerates.
  
• Specular colour and power now editable.
  
• Can set rFactor material name that is then matched to an entry in the TDF file.
  
• "Mat Packs" can be added to group materials and textures together for distribution, also allowing default values to be set via xml.
  
• New default shapes determined by cross-section xml files.
  
• Textures can be rotated any angle, not just 90 degree increments.
  
• Added a "Update Immediately" option that, when unchecked, will speed up the interface when modifying large tracks.
  
• Only loads/exports textures being used.
  
• Rewrote the Undo function to be more reliable and offers new method of retrieving work in case of a crash.
  
• Google Earth KML import.
  
• Support to import Longitude, Latitude, Height from CSV.
  
• Ability to ignore first row of CSV import.
  
• New Licensing technology to allow Demo of latest version.

Looks like a nice tool.

Shame it has nothing to do with LFS (yet?), and is almost an advert (it being payware an all)

Awesome tool mate. I got a photo of some road where i used to live from google maps and am creating an RBR stage from there. Everything is going pretty good i just dont know how to do elevations properly. Is it done in the surfaces menu?

If drawing over an image then you would do the general elevation using the nodes, then fine tune smaller bumps and crests using the surfaces cross-section.

You could also create a path in Google Eart, export the kml file. In the public GE version height info seems to be missing but there are several ways to get it back. Best to ask AolBites in the BHM forum as I've not really pursued it myself. Some kml sources on the internet already have height data.

@danowat, I'd love to support LFS and have asked Scawen but I think he's been so busy with the latest release that he's not had the time to consider it yet.

Oh right im an idiot. Forgot there were two more views

This is just like Unreal Editor so simple and easy to use i love it.

I dont really see this tool being used with LFS though as you would have so many half arsed tracks released it would kinda ruin the game.

Quote from sil3ntwar :

I dont really see this tool being used with LFS though as you would have so many half arsed tracks released it would kinda ruin the game.

There is a way round that, all addon's would need to be sanctioned by the dev team first

Quote from danowat :

There is a way round that, all addon's would need to be sanctioned by the dev team first

yeah but the devs really wouldnt want to waste their time moderating it. It would work with a set of mods (like the forum mods) who dedicated their time to allowing tracks within game.

If someone could develop a Longer Wider track with 4 or 5 shorter Configs would be great as I believe since the release of patch X now with 32 on track LFS is crying out for suitable tracks as 70% of tracks are too short or narrow in design to accomodate such large packs.

I've been dying for a track editor for LFS

Just my 2... <insert noun here/>

As I bought BTB Pro recently, I have also been testing new beta which has terrain tools, those should be in next release too.

It is really nice feature, I have just been fooling around with program (that is called also testing ), but it has amazed me how easy one can get drivable track in rF and I believe to RBR too.

Tool makes it possible to make tracks for own pleasure to those who never could dream of making track.

I just found this tool today..
Searched aboud it and found this topic=]
The tool is awesome! I'm just waiting for tool like this in LFS, or lfs devs would share the technical details with Bob - it would be great too! =]
cant wait! aaaaaaaa.... !!!

Version 0.5.0.0 is out
http://forum.racesimcentral.com/showthread.php?t=331959
http://www.bobstrackbuilder.net/news.aspx

Making a good track requires so much more than just good tools. Good tools are also necessary, but alone they won't get you there.
Additionally, a "track" for a racing sim is actually not a "track" at all, but rather it is a whole 3D environment.

An understanding of topography is also very important, but is not so useful unless you understand how to engineer the track to make best use of the topography. Realistic topography is more complicated than a few hills and bumps here and there, as exciting as a few hills and bumps may still be .

Making a great track that is suitable for a sim like LFS means a lot of work and testing. Veterans of GPL will be able to tell you of the many hundreds of available community-made tracks, and how dozens were good, a few were great, and a very small selection were excellent.

Software that gives you the ability to bend and twist a black stripe over hills and bumps is fantastic, and a great step towards the goal, but a track editor for LFS (if it is even possible) would need to actually be a comprehensive 3D editing (or authoring) suite. I wonder how many people would truly have the patience, skill and understanding of race track engineering concepts to deliver a truly good result that remains in context with a sim like LFS.
At least with software like this, many intelligent minds will begin to ponder the true difficulties in producing something of good quality design and appearance, even if tools like this don't allow for it completely.

The new version is getting really useful. I think there is little (if anything) that a full 3D package can now add for the average track over BTB, especially since we know laserscanning input is in development for it.

One thing I'm not too sure about though, is it best to create terrain (and get the infield points connected) before applying elevation to the track?

Quote from ajp71 :

One thing I'm not too sure about though, is it best to create terrain (and get the infield points connected) before applying elevation to the track?

I'm no expert with btb but I would make the track as ready as possible with elevations and curves before starting to finetune the terrain. I'm not sure if things have changed in the most recent version but generally it can be lot of work to adjust the elevation of the terrain after you have changed the elevations of the road. That's because when you change the elevations of the track the terrain does not "follow". There are no problems making a simple dummy terrain and then when you have the track elevations pretty much set, delete the dummy terrain and make the better one from scratch.

I haven't tried with importing height data so I don't know anything about that

I know this is LFS forum, but how to use exported track in RBR?