I know that some form of downforce is modelled, both from the wings and the undertray, but what else is there? If I take damage to my body, does my coefficient of drag increase? Does my downforce decrease? What about the rake and frontal area effects on the drag? I'm curious, and there is no mention of this in the manual.

I know GTR includes some of this, and the effects are obvious. But I can't really see any effect on my top speed or grip from damage in LFS. Also, I can't see that varying the front/rear ride heights affect my top speed or downforce.

Thanks!

At the moment body damage has no effect on downforce or drag. The downforce is applied perpendicular to the cars body, so running 'nose-up' means that there is an element of downforce in the fore-aft plane, meaning higher speeds (though sometimes at the expense of stability and handling prowess).

damage and downforce are very work in progress, although the entire game is very work in progress until s3

Current damage model is limited to suspension/tracking, etc., nothing aerodynamic yet.
I can't wait for engine blow-ups, that'll do in all the FO8 k-oval racers!

There must be some form of body aerodynamics in LFS, Example; the UF 1000 in topless form is about 5k's slower than it's heavier roofed version. I don't think damage has any effect though.

Quote from Rotary :

There must be some form of body aerodynamics in LFS, Example; the UF 1000 in topless form is about 5k's slower than it's heavier roofed version. I don't think damage has any effect though.

That's just purely weight difference for now.

Quote from snewham :

That's just purely weight difference for now.

No it isnt. Weight difference doesnt effect top speed. The UF without the roof has quicker acceleration but lower top speed.

Body drag is modelled therefore. However, as far as I know it doesnt change with body damage.

A bit of slipstream is also implemented.

Quote from loopingz :

A bit of slipstream is also implemented.

actually the draft was in S1 as well, just not as noticible with the slower cars.


and for the "I wish" of the post, I wish the regular cars had the downforce modeled in the forces view..just to help with setups.

I don't think the road cars have any lift atm.

Quote from colcob :

Body drag is modelled therefore. However, as far as I know it doesnt change with body damage.

AFAIK it isn't, like you said, "Body drag", if it was then damage would affect it. Toying with LFSTweak revealed that it is (in S1, don't think it has changed?) just a drag coefficient - as in a given number how much drag the car has, and not "modelled body drag" as such.

Quote from Krane :

AFAIK it isn't, like you said, "Body drag", if it was then damage would affect it. Toying with LFSTweak revealed that it is (in S1, don't think it has changed?) just a drag coefficient - as in a given number how much drag the car has, and not "modelled body drag" as such.

I really dont understand what you are trying to say. The body has a drag coefficient, therefore body drag is modelled. Thats how sims work, its the same for the wings, there's just a drag and lift coefficient and a very simple bit of maths. Real-time computational fluid dynamics is just a tad beyond the reach of desktop computers for the next few years.

Even if body damage did effect it, it would just be a statement that checked to see roughly how borked the body was, and adjusted the coefficient accordingly.

I think the idea is that the number is just assigned to a car, rather than modelled as such. In that respect, I'd guess that changing from closed to open roof in the UF1 just changes the number.

Quote from colcob :

Even if body damage did effect it, it would just be a statement that checked to see roughly how borked the body was, and adjusted the coefficient accordingly.

The most important word is accordingly... In case of wings, a damaged wing may be may be nore disturbing that no wing at all... Moreover, the new force might be not symetric any more. Instead of thinking in 2D, you could have more downforce on the left than on the right, creating a bias and altering stability.
Another example : damage the bottom of your car and you'll have no more drag but a much lower downforce (due to flat bottom destruction)

I hope I was clear, I'm not such a good english speaker and these technical explanations are far beyond my usual skills...

Bye,

Bruce

imho the most important aero features that affect handling, and should be implemented in lfs are:

- car body generating lift
- downforce/drag affected by distance of wing/diffusors from ground

for damage affecting aero, i guess we'll have to wait for the new damage model first..

Quote from colcob :

Even if body damage did effect it, it would just be a statement that checked to see roughly how borked the body was, and adjusted the coefficient accordingly.

exactly

At some point I would like to see drag and aero cacluated on the fly for the entire car. A car sliding sideways has a different profile to the wind then a car driving straight ahead in to the wind. Simbin said they modeled thin in to the GTR2002 mod and asume it also made it in to GTR but its was still built on an less then stelar physics engine.

Quote from Gimpster :

At some point I would like to see drag and aero cacluated on the fly for the entire car. A car sliding sideways has a different profile to the wind then a car driving straight ahead in to the wind.

yupp, that'd be cool.

I also found myself wondering the other day, if it made sense to have dynamic wings in real life racing. They could turn slightly to the left/right depend on what kind of corner is being driven.
Like a front wing that is directly connected to steering inputs and turns accordingly.

Quote from tpa :

yupp, that'd be cool.

I also found myself wondering the other day, if it made sense to have dynamic wings in real life racing. They could turn slightly to the left/right depend on what kind of corner is being driven.
Like a front wing that is directly connected to steering inputs and turns accordingly.

That would definately make sense. Engineers would love it. But since this would create some sort of car/plane hybrid, movable aerodynamic devices are banned in racing.