I've seen plenty of modding arguments here for/against, thats not what i'm interested in here. What i want to know is, if it came out tomorrow that eric will accept some submitted material: who WOULD step up and start modeling fantasy stuff for LFS?

For example; I currently make tracks for iDT simulations. If eric said to me 'make a track to put into Live For Speed' i would be straight onto it.

Lets see who can do stuff, instead of how many well-wishers we have

Cool thread idea. Hopefully we can keep it on-topic and away from turning into a debate over the merits of opening LFS to modding.

I myself have no modding skills whatsoever, however.

I wish you all good luck with this.

Quote from GT VIRUS :

I've seen plenty of modding arguments here for/against, thats not what i'm interested in here. What i want to know is, if it came out tomorrow that eric will accept some submitted material: who WOULD step up and start modeling fantasy stuff for LFS?

For example; I currently make tracks for iDT simulations. If eric said to me 'make a track to put into Live For Speed' i would be straight onto it.

Lets see who can do stuff, instead of how many well-wishers we have

Really ? I think that ID&T is one of the best modding teams I know, also some great tracks.

Well I tried modelling a Television once, but it turned out to be a weird looking cube, so I can't help, but the expirienced modders modelling some more tracks would be fine for me

I wouldn't want this thread to turn to another flamewar. As I see it, you have 2 options:

1) Stop arguing about modding and wait until the DEVs give a resolution to this or;
2) Blackmail the DEVs by sending them lots of high quality contributions.

vote for second option ONLY if attempted...

greetz

You realize there are compatibility issues between each modeler. Each modeler has his own style, my style is different from Phonso's, Rmuchacha's is different from mine, and everyone's is different from Eric's. There are severe balance issues when you allow model editing or additions. Poly count goes a far way with LFS apparently, and if someone isn't so great at modeling and puts a ton of polys that aren't needed in a model, that becomes a heavy object. Eric's models are balanced because they are all his, and he has his own style, if you mix styles you get plenty of issues between any object.

Then there should be a committee, that will make rules. The high elders of this forum should form a group, that will create simple and comprehensible rules, that the modders will have to obey. Then there should be another lower committee formed by experienced modelers, who will give technical proposals to the high committee and also judge contributions (their quality and value). The mods, that pass might eventualy get implemented into the game in future patches.

*slap's himself and wakes up*

i can do a little modding, i do alot of mods for GTA:SA on PC.

I've made a couple of new land (made an island once with winding roads XD) and i've made some new textures, but i really enjoyed making cars. I made a mk1 Ford Fiesta, a ford escort RS Turbo S2, Ford mondeo, BMW M3 CSL, Mercedes CLK amg 55, BMW M convertible, honda accord type-r, eddie stobart lorry () and quite a few more. If one of the devs did open up modding to the community and i had the right tools, i would defo give it a shot :P

Quote from GT VIRUS :

I've seen plenty of modding arguments here for/against, thats not what i'm interested in here. What i want to know is, if it came out tomorrow that eric will accept some submitted material: who WOULD step up and start modeling fantasy stuff for LFS?

For example; I currently make tracks for iDT simulations. If eric said to me 'make a track to put into Live For Speed' i would be straight onto it.

Lets see who can do stuff, instead of how many well-wishers we have

I would if I thought there'd be a chance to have the content added and that I could use 3DS to build the content. I built 2 and a half fantasy tracks (all drivable, 3rd never had scenery etc) for rF and ported 2 of them to GTR2. Would definitely like to port them to LFS and continue building new ones... I only stopped the building as rF isn't for me anymore.

If LFS becomes moddable in any way like this in the future, I'll be right on the case too



Regards,

Ian

I could start modding if lfs would allow it. I can use 3ds max and I can model, unwrap and create textures. On the texture front I am still in the basic stage but i am still learning and developing my skills. Only problem I have now is that my camera is busted so I can't take any photos which make my texturing rather difficult. I prefer to model in low polys rather than high but if required i can do both.

I can also animate and setup character rigs.

I have done some basic track modelling in the past too but i am quite a newbie on that front but I will would learn if the time came.

I was already thinking of what mods I would like to make for lfs if it ever becomes open to mods.....

but sure I would give it a go....

I find modelling cars so much easier than people

mad

Well if you sort the vehicle 3D shells Pete, I'll work on the physical attributes for the handling.

Quote from XCNuse :

You realize there are compatibility issues between each modeler. Each modeler has his own style, my style is different from Phonso's, Rmuchacha's is different from mine, and everyone's is different from Eric's. There are severe balance issues when you allow model editing or additions. Poly count goes a far way with LFS apparently, and if someone isn't so great at modeling and puts a ton of polys that aren't needed in a model, that becomes a heavy object. Eric's models are balanced because they are all his, and he has his own style, if you mix styles you get plenty of issues between any object.

True, but theres also modeling guidelines and tech specs... anyways, have a few modelers is better then 50 modelers, it helps maintain continuity in the models, thus not making it seem like one car belongs in pgr3 and the other in test drive 3 :P.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Well if you sort the vehicle 3D shells Pete, I'll work on the physical attributes for the handling.

Ben, you're on. With your knowledge of car physics i think we could create something really good.

Lets hope one day we will get the chance.


by then I should be a pro

i'll be a beta tester

Before we even start modding, we need to start thinking about content delivery. The only game that has gotten that right is ... Half Life. If we have anything like that we will be in good shape for mods. Until that day when we don't depend on LFSWorld we need to take a step back. But it would be really, really really cool tho.

Glad too see there are a few guys willing and ready to make mods

On the skills side, good modders should be able to adapt to the platform. GTR2 is a different platform to rfactor, as much as many people pretend its not. Its all about using the platform's features to create good tracks (Y)

I am all in for modding But...

There should be some sort of certification. You have to pass this certification to be allowed to mod. All new content should be tested and accepted by a small group before it was released for LFS. But if this is realistic before we have a final release of S2 (or S3) is a different story.

The competition LFS has from other sims today is tough but I believe it will be even more competition 1 or 2 years from now. Allowing modding will be important in the future. Even getting real tracks will be important in future.

I guess there are tons of people that are willing to work for free to make LFS even better... so why not let them do it ??

Although it is way off, I am totally for modding LFS ( in the future ) Maybe a way in the future, would be for modders to send content to the Devs for Vetting purposes. If the Mod is upto scratch, this could be loaded to LFSWorld, and then presented to the community in a centralised way.

That way you have "Official" LFS mods and you know they are upto the LFS Standards.

Obviously people will release thier own mods, but it will be down the individual to choose whether they want a half hearted bodged together mod, or a upto standard LFS mod.

Personally, I think this would be the only way LFS Mods could progress forward

Well this way you could build in a certificate that LFS checks.
You could go the netkar way with the tracks... also some semi official mods.

Quote from LFSn00b :

I have nooby modding skills, but i think i could do it if i was given the car/track modding tool.

If you get given the modding tool before anyone else, I'll quit LFS forever and find a nearby bridge.

I've been modeling and texturing cars for a few years, so I'd like to do that given the plugins.

I think it'd be cool if car models and physics parameters were uploaded to LFSW and then downloaded when you joined a server that had that mod. The car model file would not feasibly be any bigger than the average skin file, and the physics parameters would probably be a very small file, so download times would not be an issue. The only problem could be being forced to download crappy mods (although I guess you could just not join the server and delete them)

Quote from dude56 :

I've been modeling and texturing cars for a few years, so I'd like to do that given the plugins.

I think it'd be cool if car models and physics parameters were uploaded to LFSW and then downloaded when you joined a server that had that mod. The car model file would not feasibly be any bigger than the average skin file, and the physics parameters would probably be a very small file, so download times would not be an issue. The only problem could be being forced to download crappy mods (although I guess you could just not join the server and delete them)

I don't think downloading models when joining a server would be a good idea personally, using rF / GTR2 as an example of filesizes (never played any 'run about n shoot everything' games). The last download I grabbed for GTR2 was 52Mb download, 112Mb unpacked (car mod) the last for rF was ~30Mb download, 70Mb unpacked (single track). Even with 20Mbit downstream (obviously that's variable to a point), it's not a 2 min job.. which IMO, would cause a lot of annoyance to people.

Models can be fairly small in filesize, but I think we're still talking larger than the average skin file (although maybe not now using DDS textures), but it's the textures that take up the most size in this respect, especially if LFS supports multiple DX versions in the future as DX8 seems to give very different results than both DX7 and DX9.. some places where I had to use 2 separate textures both for the same thing.. except the one for DX8 was a slightly different shade / brightness (vertex colouring can help for some things).

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for modding (was the main reason I moved over to rF when it was released) and I much prefer to install mods manually as I can then do as I please with them (ie: the first thing I did with all rF mods was to remove any crappy UI stuff that they added and any music / movies.. then I'd end up fixing most of the mods I downloaded to run properly within the original game structure amongst other things). Some of this could be sorted I guess if there was an "official distribution structure".. it's quite worrying to see how many people seem to be able to create some mods yet have absolutely no idea how to use an archiver or have common sense about dir structure




Regards,

Ian

I've said it before, and I'll say it again........

Modding, by modding I mean new cars and track, will dilute an already diluted online racing community within LFS.

People DO NOT use everything we have in LFS to it's full potential as it is, and all adding third party content will do is water down the online experiance.

I TRUELY hope that LFS is NEVER opened up to public modding.

However, all that said, I DO believe that Scawen should "employ" some of the talented modders around to assist in the LFS development.

Quote from Ian.H :

I don't think downloading models when joining a server would be a good idea personally, using rF / GTR2 as an example of filesizes (never played any 'run about n shoot everything' games). The last download I grabbed for GTR2 was 52Mb download, 112Mb unpacked (car mod) the last for rF was ~30Mb download, 70Mb unpacked (single track). Even with 20Mbit downstream (obviously that's variable to a point), it's not a 2 min job.. which IMO, would cause a lot of annoyance to people.

Models can be fairly small in filesize, but I think we're still talking larger than the average skin file (although maybe not now using DDS textures), but it's the textures that take up the most size in this respect, especially if LFS supports multiple DX versions in the future as DX8 seems to give very different results than both DX7 and DX9.. some places where I had to use 2 separate textures both for the same thing.. except the one for DX8 was a slightly different shade / brightness (vertex colouring can help for some things).

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for modding (was the main reason I moved over to rF when it was released) and I much prefer to install mods manually as I can then do as I please with them (ie: the first thing I did with all rF mods was to remove any crappy UI stuff that they added and any music / movies.. then I'd end up fixing most of the mods I downloaded to run properly within the original game structure amongst other things). Some of this could be sorted I guess if there was an "official distribution structure".. it's quite worrying to see how many people seem to be able to create some mods yet have absolutely no idea how to use an archiver or have common sense about dir structure




Regards,

Ian

Well, LFSW could enforce a size limit, or force a total mod size on a server (so that you wouldn't be forced to download tons of crap)

Or it could even point you to a list of mirrors to download it from while in-game, much the same way the ingame updater works.