Aluminum had done well enough, carbon fiber is very cool, but it's too expensive. And while you where at it, why didn't you offer some extra buttons, the wheel doesn't have too much on it by default. The lights don't seem that sophisticated either, that box looks very thick.

I agree with Blackout. Just make it out of the same brushed Aluminum that is on the wheel.

OK, then. I'll try to answer everyone's questions in one post:

Why Carbon - It's very light. To minimize the impact on the Force Feedback effects, you have to make it as light as possible. This is especially true the further you get away from the center of the rotational axis point of the wheel. The entire unit (including the coil cable) weighs just 110 grams.

We did investigate alternatives to carbon fiber. Aluminum certainly was an option, but to achieve the strength we were after, the plate would have to be near twice as thick. This would affect the overall weight as well as the cross section. In the beveled section for the lights, it would be twice as deep with a reflective silver finish from the machining. Also, when you look into the cost of an aluminum plate in that thickness, the cost difference is negligible. I stand firm that our choice of using real carbon fiber was the best possible option for performance, strength, looks and cost.


Buttons - Cost. This again would increase the cost is such low volumes. Not just in the cost of the buttons themselves, but everything from the size/cut of the plate, additional wiring, controller board modifications and additional assembly time. I know these things sound small on their own, but when thinking on a volume scale (even a small one), they can get very large.

That being said, we may look into making a "PRO" version with buttons in the future but it will come with a higher cost - something of a hot topic it seems


For what we cannot compromise in cost we try to make up for 10 fold in service and value. Every single unit is hand made and tested thoroughly. We include all tools needed for installation, an installation guide with 3d illustrations in 4 languages, and CD with a simple installer for all your plugins.


Chris Considine
CXC Simulations

I know Kev already mentioned this, but is that really designed for 900 degrees of turning? Or only for formula car type of angles?


But anyway, I wish you good luck...you need it because I can't believe that having that huge markets with that price, not to mention it voids the warranty.

Quote from CXC_Simulations :

by dismantling your G25, you void the warranty.

so basically what we have here is the opportunity to spend $120 on voiding a $300 wheel's warranty...

you lost me right here...

LFS is more of a hobby for me than a game so the price isn't the main detractor for me.

I rarely need to look at the gear indicator, but I do like the idea of having an external one. This is good because, depending on my chosen field of view in certain cars, the steering wheel covers the shift indicator on the dash and I need to turn off the visible wheel if I need to be able to consistently read it.

My issue with the design of the G-25 gear indicator is in the positioning. I have my monitor set up high...at head level. My wheel is mounted on my desktop. Things happen really fast when racing and it is impractical, for me at least, to look down, away from the screen, verify my gear, and then look up to see that I just ran wide or clipped someone.

I think the product might appeal more to racers who have custom cockpits. Either way, I'll follow up in the near future and see how people are liking it. If it turns out to be a hit, I'll buy one. I'm not too concerned about voiding my warranty. I've had my G-25 since the week they came out and now it's starting to make a burning smell after I use it hard for a few hours so I figure I'll end up buying another one before the year is up. If something costs under $500, I've found from past experience that it is more hassle than it is worth to fret over the warranty. I can't be without it for that long!

While this is a nice idea and quite a niche product, the cost it quite high.
I realize that the production cost is very high due to the small volume and hand crafting process, however with some very cheap alternatives (that can do more and are more customisable, you might have a hard time making a realistic profit.

As someone mentioned, a PSP can be had for about $150 these days and it sure can do a lot more then simply display revs and gear.

Regardless, good luck with you business venture.

TBH i think this is MUCH nicer than a PSP solution, and if i had the cash i'd get one (IF i'd already got three monitors etc, but while the unit probably is worth £68 material wise, it's a bit on the expensive side for what it does

I would buy one if I did have the money, the difference being is I wouldn't modify my G25 at all, I would slot my desk and install it into my desk.

Well, I'm happy to report that we have completely sold out of our first batch The next batch will be twice as large and will be ready for shipping in 7 days. Our site is still taking orders on a pre-order basis.

I just want to say thank you to all of our "early adopters" and I look forward to all of your pictures and reviews!

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

I would buy one if I did have the money, the difference being is I wouldn't modify my G25 at all, I would slot my desk and install it into my desk.

That's very interesting. I wonder how many people would be interested in a dash mount version? This version theoretically could be slightly cheaper (less material) and non-wheel specific. I always thought about making one, but there would have to be enough interest in it to warrant an entire run. Please feel free to comment.


Chris Considine
CXC Simulations

I would, simply because I for one, don't want to be tossing cords into my G25, no matter how much you say it is "safe" and "tested, becuase it may be tested, but there's always a variable in how different people turn the wheel.

This looks cool, and yes as some have stated already, the price is a bit high for something that just has LEDs and gear #.

Though about taking a G25 apart... yeah I wouldn't want to disassemble mine either in order to install it. I had a red MOMO before the G25, and I did take that apart to clean it up, but eventually the wheel felt a bit looser and notchier the more I did it. The G25 still feels nice, and I'm afraid to take it apart to be honest... because I have the risk I might move things around that don't need to be changed.

But instead you should really just have something that is USB or something, and make it completely separate to that of the wheel. Sure it is nice to have the lights on your wheel, but I'd much rather have a stationary set of signals mounted somewhere on top of the wheel's base (behind the wheel (where Logitech logo is)), and have it plugged in via USB. OR, also have something that can mount on the bottom of your monitor with a simple springy clip for flatscreens (not sure about CRTs).

A product like this should be easy to use, and a lot more people would buy it if it was just a plug-n-play sort of deal, so you avoid having to build something with tools and wiring. Granted that is fun if you like getting technical, still... it's not something most people want to do when looking for cool addons/gadgets for racing simulations.

LFS supplies a whole lot more extra data too, so making a much more detailed LCD display below the LEDs and Gear # would be really worth the price you have now. Having just the LEDs and Gear just makes me want to use what is already in the game and perfectly visible to be honest....

I guess these things are for some real serious sim-nutters that want to spend money on added enjoyment. It wont make you faster, none of these things do.

BTW: I am sure the carbon fibre is expensive and adds to the cost of the product... but honestly, such a piece of carbon fiber shouldn't increase the price THAT much. I mean R/C chassis parts made out of carbon fiber that are much bigger than that don't cost so much. Especially if the piece is a simple cut piece from a sheet and not molded or anything. I'd much rather have dark black anodized (or painted) aluminum, a lot cheaper. Carbon fibre just doesn't fit the look of the G25 imo.

Make one with buttons, pleeeeaaaassse!!!

Actually, a dashboard style (not wheel mount), with a few buttons on the sides would be nice.

Quote from shiny_red_cobra :

I honestly have never looked at my wheel when racing. Everything happens too quickly and there is no time to look down at the wheel then back up at the screen. If I do that, my race is probably over. Besides, all games have rpm and speed gauges, so what's the point of buying a $120 accessory which doesn't give my any new information? I suppoes some die hard fanatics might want this cause it looks like a real race car gauge...but it's not for the casual racer.

Exactly.

In my opinion, it does look a little basic and cheap, for that price.

Echo other's statements about your asking price for this add-on, especially for a product that you can buy without your carbon fiber plate. All you're basically doing, is installing this shift light into your plate and charging an extra $65 USD for the troubles (or is the light even installed in the plate or is this an end user install?)! Add to that, your mounting plate is $10 USD more than the shift light itself!! I find it hard to believe that your material cost's and so-called exhaustive testing warrants that.

This shift light was designed and built from a project that Todd Cannon and Leo Bodnar came up with earlier in the year. They offer these for $55 USD that you can get by visiting the RSC thread that started it all. As I have been following the progress of this collaboration (and subsequently bought one of these lights), at no time did I ever see your name mentioned in the design process of this unit. They did the work, all you're doing is offering an expensive plate and to top it off......not even giving them credit as the principal designers of this light! They would be the one's (more specifically, Leo B) to come up with a USB controller that additional buttons could be added, etc. It would be wise of you to be a little more forthcoming in your sales pitch.

Yes, but also if you look, you can't really buy the PCB's and stuff, becuase they are being used in these displays, even though personally I'd rather have one that form-fits onto my G25 a la dashboard style, or even a simple /-lights-\ style that can clear most wheels so then it can be used on all wheels, without mods.

The point is........he doesn't assemble this shift light. He buys these shift lights from Todd and Leo (the same model you and I can get) and spiffs it up with his mounting plate. The only thing he supplies that is of his creation, is the mounting plate.

Quote from Kegetys :

With that price I'd expect you to be able to buy some real ads instead of using public discussion boards as free advertising space... :bewarespa

Or if this was approved by the devs/moderators then sorry

+1

@ CXC Simulations:

What you have done here is kill your product in two way's:
1). introducing it to potential customers on the fly/cheap in a public forum doesn't say a whole lot for your teams marketing knowhow(lack of)

2). Introducing a product a top notch prices creates expectaions of supreme build quality and backup support/community discussions on said product(neither).

Imo if you had of thought how you where going to introduce a product to sim racing community's for five minutes you would have quickly learned that putting aside the first batch of a dozen or so could have been used as freebies to intorduce your product FIRST and get feedback/oppinions FIRST.

But, you jumped on the band wagon boasting a price tag too expensive in the tooth for many, and ended up getting flamed. All your doing my friend.

The whole thing smells of poor planning and marketing.

Quote from WickedShot :

Echo other's statements about your asking price for this add-on, especially for a product that you can buy without your carbon fiber plate. All you're basically doing, is installing this shift light into your plate and charging an extra $65 USD for the troubles (or is the light even installed in the plate or is this an end user install?)! Add to that, your mounting plate is $10 USD more than the shift light itself!! I find it hard to believe that your material cost's and so-called exhaustive testing warrants that.

The unit it's self is fully assembled and ready to install. To risk sounding like a broken record: There are more components that lead to the overall costs in this product other than the carbon plate. Please see earlier posts for a more detailed description.

Quote from WickedShot :

This shift light was designed and built from a project that Todd Cannon and Leo Bodnar came up with earlier in the year. They offer these for $55 USD that you can get by visiting the RSC thread that started it all. As I have been following the progress of this collaboration (and subsequently bought one of these lights), at no time did I ever see your name mentioned in the design process of this unit. They did the work, all you're doing is offering an expensive plate and to top it off......not even giving them credit as the principal designers of this light! They would be the one's (more specifically, Leo B) to come up with a USB controller that additional buttons could be added, etc. It would be wise of you to be a little more forthcoming in your sales pitch.

Yes it was. I never said it wasn't. Nor do I think crediting every vendor we use for this product. Would you prefer I credit the person who layed up the carbon fiber, the person who made the molds for the composite enclosure, the person who makes the retractile cable etc.? Leo is an OEM supplier. Companies like ours purchase components from him and other vendors to add to our own products.

People can indeed purchase the bare gauge board separately. In fact, we well be selling them that way shortly on our website very soon (at $55). As I have said before, this product was meant for the kind of person who doesn't want to hassle with fabricating an enclosure or wiring it. For those who do, we will offer the board bare. It's up to you.

Quote from CSU1 :

What you have done here is kill your product in two way's:
1). introducing it to potential customers on the fly/cheap in a public forum doesn't say a whole lot for your teams marketing knowhow(lack of)

This is certainly not the only place we announced this product.

Quote from CSU1 :

2). Introducing a product a top notch prices creates expectaions of supreme build quality and backup support/community discussions on said product(neither).
Imo if you had of thought how you where going to introduce a product to sim racing community's for five minutes you would have quickly learned that putting aside the first batch of a dozen or so could have been used as freebies to intorduce your product FIRST and get feedback/oppinions FIRST.
But, you jumped on the band wagon boasting a price tag too expensive in the tooth for many, and ended up getting flamed. All your doing my friend.
The whole thing smells of poor planning and marketing.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. You wanted us to make the first batch free? This certainly does not seem to make good business sense to me.

If you wanted opinions, here's one from a customer that just received his:

"Well, I got my G25 SLI about 11:10, and after mounting it to the G25 and dropping the drivers in the right rfactor folder, I was cruising around Road America at 11:24, a whole 14 minutes from the time it came through my door. It was actually an easier install than the G25 itself! Thanks for taking already one of the best, and most accessible hardware add ons (for those of us with lives) the G25, and taking it to a whole new level. It is with your ingenuity and work that some day, even a guy like me who has no idea how to even approach wiring, and rigging a home cockpit, can one day dream of actually having a completely immersive "plug-and-play" simulator."

We may be getting flamed here, but it seems only the negative are vocal. The fact is, we sold out our first batch (which is great) and our customers are happy with their purchases (the most important thing). Besides, I don't mind a little constructive criticism. It helps us create better products. For instance: We are now looking into versions with buttons and cockpit mount versions based on comments gleaned on this very forum. So it's really a positive for us

Quote from CXC_Simulations :

" Thanks for taking already one of the best, and most accessible hardware add ons (for those of us with lives) the G25, and taking it to a whole new level. It is with your ingenuity and work that some day, even a guy like me who has no idea how to even approach wiring, and rigging a home cockpit, can one day dream of actually having a completely immersive "plug-and-play" simulator."

LOL...do people really talk like that?
You cant beat a good testimonial from a 'real' customer.

Quote from CXC_Simulations :

The unit it's self is fully assembled and ready to install. To risk sounding like a broken record: There are more components that lead to the overall costs in this product other than the carbon plate. Please see earlier posts for a more detailed description.

Ahh yes.....the flexible cord, zip ties and anchor, CD and guide . Good point .

Speaking of the CD; there is no drivers involved in using this product, it is a 'plug and play' device! How you get it to work, is by using plug-in's written by Leo and the RSC DIY community for each sim. Again, this does not fall under the "We at CXC" umbrella of OEM suppliers!

Quote from CXC_Simulations :

Yes it was. I never said it wasn't. Nor do I think crediting every vendor we use for this product.

You're right, you do not come right out and say it. The problem is, your pitch creates the illusion that you somehow had creative control in the making of this shift light. In addition, to what functions can be added or that you have had a hand in the testing that was involved. We both know this is not the case. This is my reason for taking you to task.....give credit where credit it due!! That, and the fact that I still don't buy your reasoning for the exceedingly high cost.

Quote from CXC_Simulations :

Would you prefer I credit the person who layed up the carbon fiber, the person who made the molds for the composite enclosure, the person who makes the retractile cable etc.? Leo is an OEM supplier. Companies like ours purchase components from him and other vendors to add to our own products.

The rest of your statement is being a bit overly dramatic. It's a slick way of spouting pure nonsense to confuse the issue. The two integral parts of this "SLI" are the plate and the light. You only had a hand in creating the plate. Refer to the above answers for questioning whom should be credited for what, regardless of the fact that you consider Leo as an OEM supplier! It is assumed that when you purchase a product from Leo, he gets the credit for the hardware controller.....in whatever it may be used for. Perhaps he should consider a licensing fee on his products, for companies like CXC.

The G25 SLI has been reviewed in this month's AutoSimSport Magazine!

I'm pleased to report it got a 9 out of 10! The small issues mentioned about warnings in the instructions have been noted and fixed already

Check it out here.

I'd like to extend my thanks to the AutoSimSport staff for the opportunity. It was a fantastic issue!

Any interest in a G25 SLI Special Edition?

Only difference would be the silver carbon plate. It would cost $10 more though as the silver carbon is more expensive.

That special edition aint so special...