no sorry, your post went further than simply describing your preference.
in this post you lumped drifting with Fast and the Furious and donuts and burnouts. what can i say but that donuts are as much a part of racing as drift, watch nascar, hell watch F1, what do they do after they win an event? they do a donut? mm well thats about the same resemblance a donut has to racing as a donut has to drifting, i hardly think drifting around a corner at 100kmh's+ is similar to turning the steering wheel full lock and dropping the clutch in a circle.
fast and the furious? i could be wrong but i beleive the first movie was based around drag racing, and the 2nd was was based around street circuit racing, it was only until the 3rd one until they even touched on drifting. mm so fast and the furious focused on drag racing and grip racing before drift, yet somehow F&F is only associated with drift? mm strange...
dont want drift to affect the serious aspects of the game as a simulator? correct me if im wrong but it simulates driving, drift is one aspect of driving, just like race is another.
also, i think at this point, i should point out that this refusal to go watch a drift event displays the close mindedness that people like yourself are renown for. it comes down to "you will never know if you never go", if you are not willing to go and see drift, you will never know what its all about. until that time you struggle to hold any credibility in my mind.
I finally have it. The reason that drifters are disliked more than anything.
In the world of motorcycle riders there are a few groups, of course the harley guys are one of them and living 200 miles from Milwaukee, yeah, the old harley plant is there, I see plenty of them.
There is what we called Bikers, as described before under harley rider. And the professional attitude of the lifestyle, the Motorcyclist. I am of the latter and lately have been dealing with an influx of clowns with little to no riding ability or talent what-so-ever. These idiots call themselfs "stunters".
They wreck nice bikes, dont wear proper gear, talk all kinds of garbage, and generally give riding a worse name than any harley rider could or would.
It seems our friend here considers drifters to be about the equal to stunters. A bunch of one trick clowns that belong under a circus tent rather than on the local track or back road. I see why.
My arguement to it is that the guys that call themselfs Pro in the stunt world, they are damn good, because they moved to stunt riding from racing for more of a personal best rather than battle the pack. Of course Mat Mladin is not gonna go stunting because he is getting bored with the SBK. But the guy we know as Ghost Rider started out on the track too. Patrick Furstenhoff was quite the racer before the films he made and you see a little stunting in some of those too.
More reason to my chosen name on here is the fact that Tsuchiya himself was a very avid racer before he retired some years back and has involved himself more in the drifting scene.
Ueo, the guy from D1 with a Groupe A derived engine in his AE86 dropped from the roster a few years back because he was loosing his ability to use his peripheral vision in the competition aspect of drifting, so, he went back to clubman racing for a season to brush up on his skill. Went back to the D1 and took the whole championship with the mighty Corolla.
Drifting is a lateral move for professionals that have it all. I fully understand your disinterest in attending a track day, but, if you ever get a chance to talk to a professional racer, that also drifts, you may get the reason for drifting that your looking for.
In IDC Yokohama Drift Fest in november at Hockenheim while I was recording on camera a talk beetwen Tomasz Kozlowski and proffesional racer from NL - Remmo Niezen, Remmo Niezen said that he tried it once and became a drift addict instantly.
Yeah, wings on their cars are insanely huge, they are so big you could literally take a nap on them
I'm actually suprised that some of us try to convince people, who don't like drifting to like it, while their opinion is based on purely on lfsforum posts, movies or other things(like sthereotypes) that have not much to do with real life. Maybe it's better to not convince that crowd, will be better if they never experience drifting first hand and stay in their closed-minded world.
yeh, ford typhoon (based off the falcon) 4.0ltr straight 6 turbo, awesome performing car, a little bit faster all round than the V8 models.
the car was actually created specially by a division within FPV for drifting, due to some bs it never really got to do much drifting, and now it spends most of its time at shows etc.
@KamkorPL
Not offended. You do realise that you and K. Tsuchiya are making me see drifters in a different light. You guys are the first ones ever to try to explain the meaning and motivation behind drifting.
Thanks to you I burned my rear tyres on the CTRA Race 2 yesterday.
Yes, it also described why I have that preference. What's the big deal?
So? Like it or lump it, that kind of "street racer kid" is the type of person attracted to drifting. Sure I believe there are other types of people that like drifting too, and I'm sure they're nice blokes. But the stereotype exists for a reason.
Be aware it's not "drifting" that I dislike. I love WRC Rally etc. and in a way you could say they do a lot of "drifting". The two things I don't like are the culture that comes with drifting (and yes, that is a bling bling 19yo fast'n'furious culture whether you like it or not) and also that it's just pointless. To me, my personal view, it's just some guys who have made an art form out of driving like an idiot in a street car (sideways around every corner on tarmac). Thus the burnout comparison. It's just glorified, institutionalised auto-hooliganism. I can understand why they get a rush out of it, but I don't like it personally.
This type of shit is just moronic. Firstly, it's only public streets. Secondly, can you imagine people having their stereo blasting during any other "serious" motorsport? Thirdly, are you honestly trying to tell me the street racer culture is not part of drifting? They actually seem proud to have ruined their tyres. LOL.
You're not seriously trying to suggest that this kind of culture has not attached itself to the "drifting" scene or visa versa? ... as compared to say, F1 racing, NASCAR, WRC or even high octane drag racing. Seriously? For better or worse, whether you like it or not, the fact is that silly type of street racer culture is part of drifting (or visa versa).
Type in "drift racing" in YouTube. This is the No.1 hit. No sign of the fast'n'furious culture, right?
I don't mind drifting being in the game as far as "real cars can drift, so if it's a real simulator, these cars should be able to drift too", but leave it at that. I hope they don't do anything to encourage it. My hope is that this will be a pure, unadulterated racing simulator. "Drifting" is a fringe motor-sport, if you can even call it a "sport".
Some of the users here posted plenty of YouTube videos that I gladly watched. That's enough. I got the idea. Just like I don't have to buy a model train set and spend five hours watching them drive around on a model set to know that's not my cup of tea, I don't have to go and watch a bunch of guys slowly drive around a track sideways to know that's not my scene either. Thanks for the offer.
Seriously, each to their own. If you like it then great, and I don't hold that against you at all unless you try and do it on public roads. After giving it genuine consideration, I just don't like it and there's many valid reasons I have come to that personal conclusion.
I was answering another poster. Is that not allowed?
You're clearly just offended by my opinion which is the silly type of behaviour that makes people dislike "drifters".
People ask why I or others don't like drifting, complain about us not liking drifting, claim we don't understanding it or not giving it a chance. So I make an effort to validate my reasons and tell you the reasons behind my opinions. You should not get offended and defensive about it! Just accept it. It's not a personal insult to you.
If you engaged in a discussion about open-wheel circuit racing and told me you didn't like it much and validated your reasoning I wouldn't hold it against you. Each to their own.
I'm just exasperated. I'm not even a drifter! Its fine to express your opinion, but just to say over and over again that you think something is silly, is just.... weird... obsessive... frankly, uncomfortable to sit and read without making an intervention.
I'm sorry to be saying this to someone new to the forum... I'm usually quite tolerant, but fellah, you are really in a rut.
You're not being fair at all. Go back the last few pages and read my posts. The big long one on this page is just directly responding to one person's post. Other than that I've made only 3 or 4 posts in the last four pages and haven't said anything of consequence apart from encouraging people to accept that everyone likes different things.
The real thing that is annoying you is that you don't like my personal opinion.
My sisters boyfriend has a motorcycle. I think it's a kamikaze something or other.
Besides I don't have the license to drive one. I have a license to drive a car a lorry or even a semi but not a itsy bitsy bike. Yay for the Finnish legistlation!
street racer culture is in every motorsport, are you genuinely this ignorant? where do you think racing originated? where do you think drag racing originated, its only fitting this is where drifting originated as well.
i can guarentee you there are a lot more young "street racer" idiots out there racing on the streets and through the hills than drifting in them, guarentee, this is what i see. do we stereotype these people with circuit racers? hell these people are the worst if anything, they have no skill, they've spent all their money on their sound system and then they go through the hills as fast as they can, most people dont have the balls to throw their car sideways in the hills.
these are just a few vids ive found going through the related vids on youtube, but i think they illustrate my point.
the video you posted up is a classic example of a typical drift session in the hills, they are usually closed off roads that are in the middle of nowhere, what you dont understand is that in Japan there are thousands of roads deep in the hills that will go nights without any traffic, these roads are used by these people as it is rare to see any traffic. of course there are a lot of other times where it isnt in such remote locations and there is traffic. not to defend it, but its a lot better than what these "racers" are doing in the hills with plenty of traffic around and at higher speeds.
its one thing to not like something, its another to insult something with ignorance. you do NOT know the first thing about proper drift, you have said this urself, therefore i would of expected u would try and reserve ur opinion based on ignorance as it only makes urself look bad.
being a victim of buying into a stereotype is certainly nothing to be proud about.
no im not saying there isnt that culture attached, im saying that culture is attached to every motorsport, it is an unfortunate fact and we should be fighting as a whole of the motorsport community, not bitching about the other and putting ourselves on a podium.
ok because some bloke has collected a bunch of random clips and put a hip hop sound track to them, it means? um, that someone that listens to hip hop also likes to watch drift? ok, youve convinced me, there is a person in the world that listens to hip hop and watches drift, you win that argument.
as ive mentioned, i can guarentee you, most of that street racer culture is probably associated with drag racing, think of all the dick heads that sit at the lights revving their engines, dragging off the line, 2ndly would be grip racing through the hills or on the street, there is a massive amount of people i see come through the hills pushing their cars to the limit either racing someone else or just going as fast as they can. lastly would be drifting, how many people do you see from day to day ripping up the handbrake or scandoing in and throwing their car into a corner, sliding through the whole corner?
then i guess you could probably put another category to burnouts and donuts etc, which would be very high, i guess there are burnout competitions, so it would be considered a motorsport.
but i think that all this becomes irrelevant once we recognize that these people simply do not represent what our sports are about.
lol what? so would you say that freestyle motorcross is not considered a sport as opposed to supercross? or figure skating is not a sport as opposed to race skating? hell look at sports such as skateboarding and rollerblading, Bike riding, a lot, if not the majority of the sports using these vehicles are based around style and control rather than racing.
i hate to tell you, but there is a lot more to a sport than simply speed, car control is simply an aspect of driving that drifting focused on, racing focuses on different aspects of driving, neither is superior, they are all just simply different aspects of driving.
Yeah, that'll have to do I guess. I work round the corner from Evans (London bicycle shop)... In the paper this morning they were bragging about selling the £7000 carbon fibre Ferrari race bike. Might see if they have one in the showroom at lunchtime & post pix.
nihill: you don't want to hear, so don't read it. Skip to next post. Problem solved.
Nisskid,
You make fair points and I genuinely read and consider your arguments, even if they are a little defensive.
I will say though, I'm not "insulting" anyone or anything (as you suggested). I don't like it for some reasons (which maybe flawed) but that's not an insult. That's my opinion.
Well, yeah I do think it's kind of "moronic" to drift race in public streets, whether you expect there to be traffic or not - in fact, in some ways, not expecting traffic is even more dangerous! Ditto to be proud of the damage you've caused your tyres. I guess "moronic" is an insult, but if you don't do those things it doesn't apply to you or other drifters who don't do those things.
Now you do actually make a fair point about the same type of kids racing around the streets in their ricer-cars and that not being representative of circuit racing, however I don't think it's entirely valid. The different is that "drifting" is primarily a street racing thing that has only recently made the transition to a properly controlled track environment. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't think it originated on a track, it originated from kids in ricer cars trying to do power-slides.
Closed circuit racing and rally certainly did not originate on the streets. The origins of these types of motor-sports go way back to the invention of the auto-mobile when racing was the pass-time of high society and the aristocratic class that could actually afford cars. A lot of this mentality can still be seen in F1 in particular.
So while those same kids might also be into street racing that holds some similarities to closed circuit racing or rally racing, I think it's extremely disingenuous to pretend that the "proper" (note inverted commas - no offence) motor-racing genres have anywhere close to the same kind of link to the "bling" street-racer culture.
Yes, drag racing started on the streets too. But I'm no great fan of drag racing either.
So, is it fair to dislike something because of where it originates from? No, it's not. But because of the origins, it still retains a lot of the mentalities and style of street racing and that is the thing I really don't like. And that's not for any other reason than personal opinion. I don't like ultra-flashy, imported cars or the fashion and culture that goes along with them. Just not my thing. Well, it is for another reason I guess: street racing is dangerous and done by idiot kids who just have the drivers licence but think they're the best drivers in the world. But that's off the point of drifting, I know (unless it's done on public roads).
Lastly, I just don't like the actual act of "drifting". To me it's driving slowly around a corner, sideways and ruining tyres. Doesn't appeal to me on a personal level.
nihill: you don't want to hear, so don't read it. Skip to next post. Problem solved.
Nisskid,
You make fair points and I genuinely read and consider your arguments, even if they are a little defensive.
I will say though, I'm not "insulting" anyone or anything (as you suggested). I don't like it for some reasons (which maybe flawed) but that's not an insult. That's my opinion.
Well, yeah I do think it's kind of "moronic" to drift race in public streets (whether you expect there to be traffic or not) and be proud of the damage you've caused your tyres. I guess "moronic" is an insult, but if you don't do those things it doesn't apply to you or other drifters who don't do those things. And yes, I think it's moronic to "race" on public streets too.
Now you do actually make a fair point about the same type of kids racing around the streets in their ricer-cars and that not being representative of circuit racing, however I don't think it's entirely valid. The difference is that "drifting" is primarily a street racing thing that has only recently made the transition to a properly controlled track environment. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't think it originated on a track, it originated from kids in ricer cars trying to do power-slides.
Closed circuit racing and rally certainly did not originate on the streets. The origins of these types of motor-sports go way back to the invention of the auto-mobile when racing was the pass-time of high society and the aristocratic class that could actually afford cars. A lot of this mentality can still be seen in F1 in particular.
So while those same kids might also be into street racing that holds some similarities to closed circuit racing or rally racing, I think it's extremely disingenuous to pretend that the "proper" (note inverted commas - no offence) motor-racing genres have anywhere comparable a link to the "bling" street-racer culture that "drift racing" does.
Yes, drag racing started on the streets too. But I'm no great fan of drag racing either.
So, is it fair to dislike something because of where it originates from? No, it's not. But because of the origins, it still retains a lot of the mentalities and style of street racing and that is the thing I really don't like. And that's not for any other reason than personal opinion. I don't like ultra-flashy, imported cars or the fashion and culture that goes along with them. Just not my thing.
Lastly, I just don't like the actual act of "drifting". To me it's driving slowly around a corner, sideways and ruining tyres. Doesn't appeal to me on a personal level.
Problem solved.