Diminishing returns.

Just like tuning an engine. In the beginning easy, quick and inexpensive modifications produce big results. The further you go the more complex, time consuming and expensive the modifications come while the visible gain gets smaller and smaller.

I couldn't care less for graphical stuff but as atledreier wrote: more damage. It would make races more interesting. Apart from the random electrical failures. That's a big no no.

Abuse your car => damage = Good!
Random damage = Bad!

Good post atledreier.

That is what I long for the most that the environment is not static.
That along with improved physics is most welcome but I guess these things are for S3

Hold fire a minute!!!

Since when has having children been a major disadvantage to a guy doing his job??
As far as I know (and I am pretty certain about this!) Scawen is NOT a "single parent family"..He is a normal guy with a wife and two kids, who, like most of us has a HOME LIFE and A JOB!
The fact that his job is coding LFS is no different than somebody who goes out driving a bus for a living...(albeit a little but more involved!)
My point is, I am bloody CERTAIN that if I said to my boss that I wasn't going to be able to work full time any more because my wife had just had another nipper, the only place I would be going is the dole queue! Give him a few weeks to get over the trauma of the new arrival, and everything will be back to normal..any parents out there will tell you the same thing!
As said in another thread..congratulations on the new arrival Scawen and Geraldine, and I hope that Leo doesn't beat her up as often as I beat up MY little sister when we were young!

LFS is made by 3 guys THAT actually give a shit about the sport :P not just out to make money's from a game, And that is what keeps me happy with the content we have ( oh and ofc racing against friends i've made along the way)
congrats on the nipper btw scawen you can stay up late now and use the excuse of driving the baby around to help it go sleep

Might I propose that changing the thread's topic would be a good idea? The idea of someone having a baby, which is a happy event for most sane people, being associated with "another nail in the coffin" is kinda creepy to say the least and even if it wasn't meant as such it could be taken as an insult.

I wouldn't be surprised if the developers have some stuff that's nearly ready which they aren't telling us about that could be launched in the near future.

Quote from Storm_Cloud :

I have a different outlook of LFS and one that means development is less important to me.

Look at it this way. Anyone here play football on a Sunday morning? Still using a round ball? Goalposts still more or less the same as when you started playing all those years ago? Bored of football? Of course you're not and why is that? Because you've got that big semi final coming up or a grudge match against a big rival.

And that's what LFS is to me. It is the trusty old football pitch. I don't give a fig about new things and developments, even physics updates. All I'm bothered about is my next league race against a rival. It is competition for me.

I suppose development must come to keep others interested so I have people to race against.

100% my feeling exactly

Benn driving very close to 300.000 Km in aprox 3 years.
Fed up ? Not at all, and if that was bound to be the case, it would have happened a LONG time ago.

According to the government:-

Quote :

You can take statutory paternity leave if you:

• are an employee, with a contract of employment (most agency workers and sub contractors don't have the right to paid paternity leave) and
  
• are the biological father of the child, or are the mother's husband or partner (including a mother's partner in a same-sex relationship) and
  
• have been with your employer for at least 26 weeks by the end of the 15th week before the beginning of the week when the baby's due and
  
• will be fully involved in the child's upbringing and are taking the time off to support the mother or care for the baby.

and this leave is paid if you:

• earn at least the lower earnings limit (LEL) for National Insurance contributions.

If you earn less than the LEL, (currently £87 a week), you have the right to unpaid paternity leave if you meet the other conditions, and could get Income Support while on paternity leave.

If we're lucky, Scawen won't take this opportunity himself. If he does, then he has my absolute 100% support. Every father works for his family. That's the point. And this time in Nicole's life is a magical time.. any time Scawen gives US over Nicole, I think we should be bloody grateful for.

Quote from SamH :

No, I think you need to hang fire. You shouldn't be shooting your mouth off in such blatant and complete ignorance when there are facts so easily available.

According to the government:-


Since Scawen is, AFAIK, self-employed the above is completely irrelevent. However, after such a silly post from you, I felt the need to get a bit of fact out there.

If we're lucky, Scawen won't take this opportunity himself. If he does, then he has my absolute 100% support. Every father works for his family. That's the point. And this time in Nicole's life is a magical time.. any time Scawen gives US over Nicole, I think we should be bloody grateful for.

Sam, I think you totally and completely missed the point of my post....
I _KNOW_ that we are entitled to Paternity leave...but the OP seemed to be of the opinion that the new arrival would stop progress permanently..
Paternity leave is LIMITED anyway, and I quote from the SAME SOURCE that you specified:

Quote :

How much paternity leave can you take?

You can take either one or two weeks. You can't take odd days off, and if you take two weeks they must be taken together.
You can choose to start the leave:

• on the day the baby's born
  
• a number of days or weeks after the baby's born
  
• from a specific date after the first day of the week in which the baby's expected to be born

Your leave can start on any day of the week (but not before the baby is born), but has to finish within 56 days of the baby being born or, if the baby's born before the week it was due, within 56 days of the first day of that week.

My point is that having a new baby is NOT an excuse to give up work completely....unless you come in the category of lazy social security scrounger, a breed that I find totally abhorrent; and do not for one second believe that this applies tp Scawen, who has proven without doubt that he is a grafter!
I would also humbly request that you retract your statement concerning my "blatent and complete ignorance".

I was just re-reading your post, and coming to the conclusion you weren't making quite the same point I was addressing

Quote from Bladerunner :

I would also humbly request that you retract your statement concerning my "blatent and complete ignorance".

I will!

Quote from SamH :

I was just re-reading your post, and coming to the conclusion you weren't making quite the same point I was addressing

I will!

Thank you...apology accepted!

Quote from Bladerunner :

Thank you...apology accepted!

Yes yes, I apologise!

OK, this is my turn to be the eccentric, over-reacting idiot again but... after further thought on the matter; I'm totally disgusted now by what lead to the creation of such a thread and the foundations upon which the content of the thread is based, not to say the title. It's a disgrace and although the OP has explained himself and what is on his mind it doesn't change the fact.

As I sit here working and churning it through my brain - even if "the blame isn't put on the child" as has been said by the OP the whole core of the argument and what brought it up is rotten, selfish and just brings out the true colours of the consumerist, demanding gamer. I can't even imagine how I'd feel if I had that said to me from one of my customers, let alone put in writing.

Un****ingbelievable.

I ain't disagreeing, xaotik. Smiling from the wrists down, I may be. Impressed at the thread and its subtext/motivation, I most certainly am not.

Eh, TBH i have been a bit bored of LFS.


I downloaded rFactor today....





....just refreshed my interest for LFS for a LONG time!



We are still so much further ahead people!!

Quote from SamH :

If we're lucky, Scawen won't take this opportunity himself. If he does, then he has my absolute 100% support. Every father works for his family. That's the point. And this time in Nicole's life is a magical time.. any time Scawen gives US over Nicole, I think we should be bloody grateful for.

i dont think this applies to self employees
and since hes working from home he has the luxury to take five and spend some time with his kids whenever he feels like it

Aoun, where did you find a download for rFactor? Every time I tried to get the demo recently (deleted it at one point), the installer is FUBAR

http://www.rfactor.net/index.php?page=buyonline

Try/Buy Option.
Gives you 60mins trail. Im telling ya, worst 60 minutes of my life!

hevent read all the thread yet sooo..

but im self employed and have 2 kids and there demanding, i build cars from the ground up and ya need ya concentration, and if anything my buisness whent into overdrive when i had the little ones turn up... basicly if having an extra kid kills a buisness there wouldnt BE any buisness LOL...

and i find calling it "another nain in the coffin" concerning to say the least.....

Quote from SamH :

According to the government:-


If we're lucky, Scawen won't take this opportunity himself. If he does, then he has my absolute 100% support. Every father works for his family. That's the point. And this time in Nicole's life is a magical time.. any time Scawen gives US over Nicole, I think we should be bloody grateful for.

Amen to that !!

As for a point made about the devs working on other projects? Well, we can hardly blame them can we ?, (I'm not implying that is how the comment was intended). They are people after all, no? They have a living to make, no? They have families to feed, no? How many subs at whatever an S2 license costs do you think it takes to earn a decent living for a family? Hell I know people that can't afford to work for the less than the cost of an S2 licence as an hourly rate !! I'm betting that LFS is probably not even a cash positive business as yet, (at least not on a month by month basis), I'd be amazed if they didn't have to do other dev work in order to make ends meet.

If this means that the game you like to play feels a bit boring now, well all I can say is bad luck really. Other people don't exist to make your life fun, enjoyable and fulfulling, that is your responsibility.

NB - That's a general statement and is not aimed at anyone in particular in this thread.

First of all, LFS is still developed on, receives regular updates and test patches, which not alway contain candy but stuff that has to be done and fiished at some point. And as long we have signs that LFS is still being developed (not unlike other games where there is just hope for another update) we shouldn't worry about anything.

LFS developement has always been fast and slow times, there are times when Scawen just throws out one testpatch after another, but I know no human that could keep that speed for more than a month without burning out / needing a break.

LFS is in no trouble according to the amount of user online. What happens at the moment is some kind of a change of the player base with lots of the "old" folks leaving. To compare it to the soccer analogy earlier: You are playing for years every sunday with people you know, good friends you got to know over this game, but one day you enter the field and they are nearly all left and there's just strangers around who may be nice, but you still loose the motivation to go there every sunday.

On the other hand:
What is it what people would really want?
Tracks & Cars: Would that help to fill a server when there is even more combinations? (apart from league racing)
Changing conditions: wind is rarely used, and different lightings even less.
Damage: fun for the simmer, but also for average Joe who just has time to play once a week and just wants his fun?

Don't get me wrong, I want all of this cool stuff, the harder the more challenging it is, the more fun I have. But I really beginning to doubt that all the stuff would help for more than 6 month before we end up with the same question again.

my 2 cents

Quote from xaotik :

OK, this is my turn to be the eccentric, over-reacting idiot again but... etc. etc.

Hmm, well, yes, I can see how you can come to this conclusion, but the OP seems like a well balanced and reasonable individual on first looks, and quite likely doesn't have undesirable motivations or questionable moral attitudes... Still, unfortunate thread title, especially at this time. A bit insensitive, really.

Anyway, to get back to topic, I agree with some other posters here that there are developments going on that we don't know about. I'm sure of it.

I don't mind waiting for high quality enhancements/content. And if I have to relearn how to go quick around the track, then so be it.

I have sympathy for the crowd thats getting a bit tired of LFS. Have a break, hey. Get some sun. Make a baby. Build a house. Shut up 'n play yer guitar. Or something...

These kinds of threads get boring too, you know.

Well personaly I love those little updates, they make LFS look that it is going to perfection in details... but yes, major content would be nice. Personally I want physics as good as possible(brakes overheating, engine stuff etc), more content?

One think about modding(sry for offtopic). What if there was something like two spare slots. A server admin could use them to create new cars based on LFS physics and using something like ULTRA TWEAKER. People joining the server would simply download those stats and vuala(or something ;P), each server would be uniqe, having two personal "cars". Also client would be able to download 3d objects, each connected to the slot.

For example: You've got all those 20 cars, but you would also have 2-3-...-n slots , for those slots you could personally create Your own "car", thx to "tweaker-build-in-LFS", for those cars You could either use already made 3d cars from lfs(well... of course we know what happens when we use car from lfs and make its wheelbase longer, wheels stick out from the car ;P), or made your own 3d car(and import it to LFS).
So... cars based on LFS physics would be rather realistic, the only problem are 3d models , and It would be much easier for developers to focus on other things than adding more cars ^^(physics :nana


Back on topic, i'll stick with LFS because its the best sim out there right now, and simply... the community lives and it is a part of LFS creation. I understand that Scawen has new kid on his shoulders and have to take care of her and he should ^^, and I think that development may slow down... but what's more important It WILL go on . That means that someday LFS will be the BEST sim in EVERY(maybe except graphics ;P, i truly dont care about them much ^^) way out there(the ultimate one ;D). That's all .



Again sry for offtopic, and please dont flame me.

Quote from xaotik :

OK, this is my turn to be the eccentric, over-reacting idiot again but... after further thought on the matter; I'm totally disgusted now by what lead to the creation of such a thread and the foundations upon which the content of the thread is based, not to say the title. It's a disgrace and although the OP has explained himself and what is on his mind it doesn't change the fact.

As I sit here working and churning it through my brain - even if "the blame isn't put on the child" as has been said by the OP the whole core of the argument and what brought it up is rotten, selfish and just brings out the true colours of the consumerist, demanding gamer. I can't even imagine how I'd feel if I had that said to me from one of my customers, let alone put in writing.

Un****ingbelievable.

And IMO, this is exactly what's wrong with a big part of the world today... to many PC people trying to censor way way too much. What happened to a spade being called a spade?

I'm not saying kids should be referred to as nails in coffins, and it seems the OP wasn't really suggesting that, merely that LFS' development (using the word 'progress' would be an oxymoron) has become pretty dismal over the past 2 years and echoes my own thoughts from way back about Scawen seemingly being bored with it and just picking and choosing stupid little pointless (at least for now) things to work on.. much like a kid picking at his peas on a dinner plate rather than eating his steak.

Yeah, we all paid for S2 knowing it was an alpha product at the time. I certainly still didn't expect it to be 2 years+ later (if I'd known that was going to be the case, I simply wouldn't have bothered upgrading my S1 license). I'd love to see the look on my boss's face if I turned up one day and said I'm only going to be putting in 50% effort for the next 2 years so I can sit and have a think about my kid... unfortunately, too many people here think of Scawen as their long lost uncle or something.. he's not, he's a business entity and, LFS development is business (it's available for sale, thus no longer some kind of "hobby" or the likes), nothing more, nothing less and to that, IMO, the dev team have certain responsibilities. I worked from home for 7 years as something that started as nothing more than a hobby for me. The moment you start charging for that, you have a responsibility to produce... of which IMO, LFS just isn't doing anymore.

Good luck to Scawen, Geraldine and the littlens.. but there's still a responsibility towards paying customers... end of the day, if it wasn't for the people paying for licenses and the interest in LFS, Scawen wouldn't be able to afford to have kids / house / etc, whether he wanted them or not.



Regards,

Ian