IM, I don't mean to be a killjoy, but wasn't the second car you passed within his rights to use the whole track as he exited the corner? It looks like you were a bit lucky that he didn't move further left.

Quote from bobvanvliet :

Would have been nice if you hadn't hit that black FZR...

thats the thing... i didn't !

he got spooked or something, he never expected me to catch the car back end again

its a legit overtake, it just went wrong because the car lost downforce when passing him

Quote from jtr99 :

IM, I don't mean to be a killjoy, but wasn't the second car you passed within his rights to use the whole track as he exited the corner? It looks like you were a bit lucky that he didn't move further left.

well he could have....is this one of these racing rules things...?

I dont see that I did anything wrong...surely you should be able to pass as long as you dont run the other guy off the road or take him out...he had enough room.

Quote from Iron_Maiden :

..is this one of these racing rules things...?

Yeah i guess it was a bit tight, but i wouldn't call that a dirty move or anything. Looked like the passing car drove very aggressively (clean) and the black fzr failed to really handle the situation.

you guys talking about my move? i thought it was about maiden one lol


EDIT: i saw the replay on the fzr car, he stopped accelling because he lost sight of me or lost focus or something
if he didn't he could have passed me again because i lost 15km/h in that stunt
http://rapidshare.de/files/14870482/bblack_fzr.avi.html

come on guys...... use Fraps, and VirtuaDub to compress, and thats it! post vids


this is the most awsome overtake i saw (and it happens to be me doing it )
Theres only one way to overtake MATZE he is pretty good

http://rapidshare.de/files/148 ... middle-overtake1.avi.html


check the foot work! its nuts... (the red and green thingy)
i should've been BAnned for pulling that one off... it ends in accidents 99% of the times

pretty good...I cant believe they you didnt touch wheels!

I'm gona make a vid of a pass I did a long time ago (not in a galaxy far far away)...from when I was a newbie....

I thought it was pretty amazing then....doesnt look so incredible now though.....but whatever....

Come on people...surely you have some decent replays...? (to make inot videos.)

Sorry, I was talking about IM's move. Haven't seen what happened between you (spyshagg) and the black FZR, sorry.

IM -- at the risk of really being a nit, yes, I guess it is one of those racing rules things for me. Be glad to hear your opinion on it though.

Before I quibble, let me say that your move looked very cool and it's true that you didn't hit the guy and you are clearly the next Alonso, etc., etc.

But I was just thinking about what I'd be thinking if I was the lead car going into that corner (and by corner I mean the whole left-right sequence as we go up the hill). If I had looked in the mirror and to the side as I approached the initial braking point, and found that I was not sharing the line with anyone (i.e., nobody anywhere near overlap with my car) I'd be assuming that it was my right to drive a normal line through the chicane. Brake over on the right, turn in, lift throttle as we start to turn and to climb, gently re-apply power as we float out to the left of the track onto the green run-off kerb at the top of the hill. Assuming I was doing a reasonable race speed (which we can maybe argue that your target guy wasn't) I would have been surprised and a little annoyed to find that someone had come barrelling up the left side of me at a point on the track that, to my mind at least, doesn't really have a two-wide racing line. Also, if it had been me in the lead car, we would surely have collided, as I would have been drifting way out to the left on exit and there would have been nowhere left for you to go.

It looks to me that either:

a) the second driver you passed just had a really crap line on exiting the chicane, and was content to stay well to the right, which you maybe anticipated or maybe got lucky with.

b) the second driver saw in his mirrors what was happening, and thought that he'd better give you plenty of room as you were coming up so fast. This was generosity on his part though, as I'd say that he had the line through that chicane (due to the basic rule about you not having been alongside him at turn-in point). Come to think of it, he wasn't being shown a blue flag was he?


Anyway, you see what I'm getting at. As things turned out, no harm done, but I'm wondering what led you to be so confident that your move was going to work out OK, and I'm hoping that the answer to that question isn't "I'm faster, he should get out of the damn way even if it is mid-chicane".

Regards,
--Jason.

Quote from Takumi_Project.d :

well i have a vid of a stunt that happened online, it isnt overtaking but its pretty cool!

http://media.putfile.com/LFS-Cunning-Stunt

i was messing around in demo and it just happened, hehe. if only there were some opponents nearby, it would have been awesome to overtake someone this way

TOTTALLY unexpected!! awesome!!

I just spent the last hour or so learning how to use fraps, virtualdub and movie maker, I ended up with this. The passes weren't that great, I couldn't be bothered to hunt for many, and most of them were picked because they went with the lyrics.

Quote from jtr99 :

--Jason.

I made the pass because I was traveling a lot faster than the other people, the 2 cars infront went slow though the chicane and took me by suprise, if you watch the video I dont spend much time in the lead car's "area"...

I think I'm pretty clean driver, I was never gona take either of them out. Being truthfull I never thought about it as far as this...I understand the corner rights thing...but it didnt come into my mind then, as far as I could see they had taken a dodgy line into the chicane an there was enough room for me to drive past them.

It was only a 3 lap friendly anyway...not a serious race or anything...


@cropsy - Hey! You the Welsh maiden fan I met th other day..?

Quote from Iron_Maiden :

I made the pass because I was traveling a lot faster than the other people, the 2 cars infront went slow though the chicane and took me by suprise, if you watch the video I dont spend much time in the lead car's "area"...

All this is true. They are indeed travelling a lot slower than you, and I admit that the whole "corner rights" thing is easier to think about when the speed difference between you and your opponent is not too great.

Basically I wanted to use your move as an example to see whether people agreed with my interpretation of corner-rights thinking here. Didn't mean to single you out as some kind of loon or anything.

Quote :

I think I'm pretty clean driver, I was never gona take either of them out.

I agree, I've raced you before and I'd say you were clean.

Quote :

as far as I could see they had taken a dodgy line into the chicane an there was enough room for me to drive past them.

It certainly looked that way.

You know, I think my motivation for questioning your move is based on something that keeps happening to me not on this track, but at Aston Club in the FOX. You know the high speed esses at the end of the back straight? I regard it as a one-car line through there. Trouble is, as you come out of the chicane at the beginning of the back straight, it's often possible to catch the draft of the guy in front of you, and gain just enough ground on him that you are threatening a pass just as the esses begin. When I'm the one drafting, I back off at this point (unless I've managed to get my nose in front already) as I don't want to cause a high-speed accident while trying to get through the esses two-wide. But when I'm the one being drafted, it ticks me off that the courtesy is rarely returned: people who've hardly established any overlap with my car by the end of the straight will just blast on through as we enter the esses, and typically my choice is either to lift and let the jerk through or to have both of us go sailing into the sand.

I'm definitely not saying that you are that guy, IM, but I'd be curious to hear what you and anyone else thinks about this example. Although there are some spots, like your move, where the opposition is so far off the pace that you are reasonably entitled to simply drive around them mid-corner, it seems to me that if two cars are reasonably well-matched, corner rights should be respected but all too often aren't.

somebody should do a video explaining racing rules.... the wrongs and correct moves

with examples and stuff..

Quote from spyshagg :

somebody should do a video explaining racing rules.... the wrongs and correct moves

with examples and stuff..

Damn, that's a brilliant idea! I'm in if somebody wants to spend an evening on a private server taking replays. I'm sure some edit-guru in these forums would be kind enough to cut them together nicely.

I'm unemployed at the moment so basically all I have is free time.

I'd be happy to take part...

I can make video's...and put them together...and add text and explanations to em....I aint too great at them though...

I think we should get some experienced drivers who understand the finer points of the rules though...

@jtr99 - "Although there are some spots, like your move, where the opposition is so far off the pace that you are reasonably entitled to simply drive around them mid-corner, it seems to me that if two cars are reasonably well-matched, corner rights should be respected but all too often aren't."



I agree, the thing is if they were moving as fast as I was I wouldn have even considered trying that move...as it simply wouldnt work...

I knwo what you mean by the esses after the chacane though....I tend to give way in those circumstances, as they often are so despeate to get infront that they will out brake themseves and stick it in the wall...

Quote from Iron_Maiden :

..who understand the finer points of the rules...

Them rule-knowing racers would probably say there's very few situations you can put in a video and show as an absolute rule, ie. it's not a case of 3.51 meters of this at an angle of 53 degrees, and these few situations are already in this video, even if it's from s1.

http://www.asrg.org/gpl/gplac/rec_dvr_beh/rec_driver_beh.htm

I drive by these rules,what do you think?

John

hey johnpen! you show up in the video i posted!

Quote from filur :

Them rule-knowing racers would probably say there's very few situations you can put in a video and show as an absolute rule

I know what you're saying, but I don't really agree. I can think of several scenarios that could go in a video that are absolutely clear-cut no-nos and conversely, several things you could show where a pass was unarguably clean. I think that would be a helpful start.

Hey fellas, I wrapped this up in a couple of hours. Any good?

http://www.mikkohuotari.com/lfs/lfs-edumov_pt1_xvid.avi

I'm not trying to make the video bible of racing (video bible... iBible?) as I certainly have had my mishaps online. But I figured these kind of really short and simplified movies, starting from basics and moving towards advanced stuff, could do some good. But it's getting damn late and my brain is fried from rendering so I might be going nuttyh.

That's great. Now that you did that we will force you to make a full "not too shabby" educational movie.

Quote from spankmeyer :

Hey fellas, I wrapped this up in a couple of hours. Any good?
http://www.mikkohuotari.com/lfs/lfs-edumov_pt1_xvid.avi

This was actually really good

Quote from deggis :

That's great. Now that you did that we will force you to make a full "not too shabby" educational movie.

That's very nice, Spankmeyer.I concur with deggis

Good job spankmeyer! I loved it Now make it longer!