I have participated in this forum for a while now... And i am starting to get a really bad feeling about it all.Coming here, use to be fun,now it is like mutilating my self.


When i started this wonderful game i See 3 names written below ... thoses 3 people there become like, kind of gods or super users to me. I mean if one day some of you see Scawen in-game you will surely be very happy.


If you see Scawen acting as a crasher ... probaly something very wrong will happen... your love for the game will become weird.


I was searching for why the feeling in LFS Forums have become strange... I know it exists since about 2003, so pretty long... and then i started to notice something.....



VICTOR do you think you better then other people?


I saw "customers into you case" asking very simple and yes maybe stupid questions. Your answers were like a punishing god ... as if he should know the answer, or know better than to ask.
At first I found your answer Acceptible... but now after reading much more of this forum and looking how people interact between each other ... you answer was not right for your position.

im not trying to attack you Victor but it seems you have a bad influence on how people see things here!

Maybe the introduction of a new Moderator, with you Fousing in a Helping/support context. Don't try to judge or influence others! your Position in LFS is too high. This can become too easilly confused, and miss intepreted.

Into other word... i think is too dangerous for you to gave personal opignion of let go your personal feeling when showing your self here.

I Hope im not looking too mad. I rewrote this 2 times! and I am less mad each time.

And really hope some of your futur action Victor will bring a new wind here.


P.S. i had absolute no pleasure to writing this post that way... but someone has to make it!


I will public Humiliate someone for the good reason! and because he was anoying to me.

so as a good example of a good moderator user : CSU1 will be a very very very very very bad example of a good moderator and thx lfs god is not.

I don't know what post of Victor's you're referencing but from what you say it sounds like he's been short with someone who's asking a simple question. I'd say that's an understandable position to take. There are so many links to FAQs, guides, manuals etc throughout the forum that when someone asks a simple question that's been answered in many different places it is frustrating. Answering questions that people shouldn't ask in the first place (because they haven't bothered to search for the answer) wastes time that could be better spent on genuinely difficult questions.

Quote from amp88 :

I don't know what post of Victor's you're referencing but from what you say it sounds like he's been short with someone who's asking a simple question. I'd say that's an understandable position to take. There are so many links to FAQs, guides, manuals etc throughout the forum that when someone asks a simple question that's been answered in many different places it is frustrating. Answering questions that people shouldn't ask in the first place (because they haven't bothered to search for the answer) wastes time that could be better spent on genuinely difficult questions.

It is indeed understandable to feel frustrated by such users (those who obviously never try to search by themselves before asking), but not to humiliate them because of that... this is not a mature way to act...
In my mind, a forum moderator should be a very patient person and be able to say things politely, without hurting anyone...

link?

Huh? I have absolutely no idea what you're talking about? The only time I remember Victor not being the calm self and actually using big bold letters in this forum when a certain guy who has no idea about programming (and no incentive to improve despite all the help he got here) continued to post thread after thread basically asking the forum members to solve the simplest of problems for him.

Other than that I don't see anything directly coming from the devs that would be detrimental to the forum's atmosphere. This place being less friendly than before is mainly due to two things:

1) More and more people find and join LFS, and with more and more people the forum's stupid quotient rises dramatically. The relative anonymity is much higher than when it was a tightly knit community, and the bigger masses also attract trolls and other unwanted elements.

2) LFS development (news, test patches, etc.) is currently so slow that the people are starting to get bored and spend more and more time on the forums, bringing their frustration with them.

I looked trough two pages of his posting history and didn't find a single post which matched your description.

Quote from Greenseed :

im not trying to attack you Victor but it seems you have a bad influence on how people see things here!

No offence Greenseed, but having been on the other end of a misunderstanding with you before I think that this is another one.

As already stated the only time I've seen Victor get quite, justifiably annoyed, was in the case of a very young poster who, after months and months of winding people up, was told to shut up.

To give you an idea this person was following others into LFS servers to ask the same programming related questions over and over, the same questions over MSN and other instant messenger, the same questions over on the forum, over and over and over again. Many other forum members complained that they were simply being stalked.

Many of these posts and threads have been removed as it always descended into arguments over and over again.

Without knowing the history of the situation it's extremely hard to see it as anything else, and considering I know you started posting around the time that was happening my only guess is that you've come across those final posts.

Yep, link or gtfo.

Quote from Weakseed :

I will public Humiliate someone [...] because he was anoying to me.

I think a certain phrase associated mostly with WoW players is appropriate here: crai moar nub

Quote from the_angry_angel :

To give you an idea this person was following others into LFS servers to ask the same programming related questions over and over, the same questions over MSN and other instant messenger, the same questions over the forum, over and over and over again.

Aah, if this would be the reason behind the OP, lol..

edit:
Re-reading I didn't really find anything constructive in my post (no surprise there ) so let me fix that now.
- moderation is not open for discussion
- this is a privately owned public forum, it's not run a democracy

And most of all what bugs me about the OP is that I considernaming & shaming without a shred of evidence to back up claims to be very obnoxious and unconstructive.

Quote from NotAnIllusion :

Aah, if this would be the reason behind the OP, lol..

If it isn't then there are 2 angry posts from Victor, which I really can't see somehow Now if it were me - I've definately got a large number of posts left over from prior to being a mod where I really let rip

I'm a young innocent mind, I'll take your word for it!

Without a link for us to see for ourselves it is hard to judge.

However though: I have been around this forum quite some time now and while there seems to be more and more 'stupid' threads I wonder occasionally whether that is simply because I have been round long enough to know the answer myself.

Victor is a dev but on this forum he is a mod too. You make out that mod are gods on fourms and should do no wrong etc. Being on this forum as well as others, there are occasions (some very good occasions) where mod's have to step in and have a go/shout at someone over something they have done or doing. Now while not part of the day to day moderating it is something they have to do too.

i know it a very delicate thing...


but take that FACT

i quote my self:

Quote :

I will public Humiliate someone for the good reason! and because he was anoying to me.

so as a good example of a good moderator user : CSU1 will be a very very very very very bad example of a good moderator and thx lfs god is not.

For me this should be edited by a moderator to remove at least the name of the user i pin point.

But removing the name right now would not follow the "general way of acting" i have seen here... and i have seen that example from the Administrator... so how can you go over the example your Administrator is showing!

Don't get me wrong! Victor is very good person! all energy he put into LFS is amazing and ho so appreciated, this is all about my post! i wan to feel good when i come here! i Live For Speed.

Quote from Greenseed :

For me this should be edited by a moderator to remove at least the name of the user i pin point.

Not really. There's nothing specific in your quote that should be removed, except it should never have been posted at all because it's flamebait. You haven't made any accusations concerning CSU1, baseless or otherwise so there's nothing to be moderated in that sense. The only thing you've done is flamed the dude for no apparent reason. This is why the thread should be locked.

I'm going to have to call troll on this one

Greenseed I have no friggin' clue what you're on about. Maybe it's the language barrier but you make no sense. What is your point? Right now it looks like all you try is being a troll yourself...

Quote from Greboth :

Victor is a dev but on this forum he is a mod too. You make out that mod are gods on fourms and should do no wrong etc. Being on this forum as well as others, there are occasions (some very good occasions) where mod's have to step in and have a go/shout at someone over something they have done or doing. Now while not part of the day to day moderating it is something they have to do too.

I think his point is not that mods should do no wrong at all... of course we are all human beings and we all do mistakes...
But Victor is one of the 3 most important persons in LFS... anything he says that is not 100% polite can hurt more than if it was anyone else than him saying it...

You should visit the official irc chan o_O

Quote from FukEduP :

I think his point is not that mods should do no wrong at all... of course we are all human beings and we all do mistakes...
But Victor is one of the 3 most important persons in LFS... anything he says that is not 100% polite can hurt more than if it was anyone else than him saying it...

I understand that but whether he has said something you or someone else, you have to distinguish (sp) between Victor as a dev and Victor as a mod. As a dev he can talk about lfs and be all nice as a mod sometimes you have to be hard.

In a way, scavier need to be extra vigilent moderating (in the sense of what content is posted by others) this forum as it is their forum, their community and their game.

Quote from AndroidXP :

Greenseed I have no friggin' clue what you're on about. Maybe it's the language barrier but you make no sense.

Oh good, I thought I was the only one with no idea what he's on about

Everytime Victor has been short with people has been fully justified, and letting people get away with being idiots would be more harmful than calling them out on it. I say that as someone who has been on the end of it, Victor called me out for acting like a complete ****, you can check my infraction if you want to know what I did.

Needless to say if he had not done that then I may have thought it was acceptable to make comments that could upset people, the same way that kid may have thought it was acceptable to bother people with stupid questions all the time, without using their own brain to work things out. Victor shows more caring for the users of this forum by telling them when they are wrong, than if he just ignored it and added infractions and bans without telling people what they did wrong. Sometimes you have to be nasty to be nice.

If you've had some kind of conflict with Victor, or a disagreement, then I suggest looking at your own actions to find out why, and then changing your attitude accordingly.

Quote from ATC Quicksilver :

Everytime Victor has been short with people has been fully justified, and letting people get away with being idiots would be more harmful than calling them out on it. I say that as someone who has been on the end of it, Victor called me out for acting like a complete ****, you can check my infraction if you want to know what I did.

Needless to say if he had not done that then I may have thought it was acceptable to make comments that could upset people, the same way that kid may have thought it was acceptable to bother people with stupid questions all the time, without using their own brain to work things out. Victor shows more caring for the users of this forum by telling them when they are wrong, than if he just ignored it and added infractions and bans without telling people what they did wrong. Sometimes you have to be nasty to be nice.

If you've had some kind of conflict with Victor, or a disagreement, then I suggest looking at your own actions to find out why, and then changing your attitude accordingly.

infractions are only visible to yourself (100% sure) and mods (not quite sure but it would make sense).

About the rest, well said. About this thread...:doh:

Well I insulted someone in this thread here...

http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?p=191211#post191211

...Victor then gave me an infraction and I complained saying I just gave an opinion, to which he replied that he didn't care. That got me all angry and I lashed out, then the next day realised he just did the same thing to me that I did to that person who posted the video, and realised the point he was making. I didn't like the way he made me feel, and he treated me the exact same way I treated the OP in that thread. I thank him for that because I was becoming one of those ****s on the internet that think they are better than everyone else, and he helped knock me down a few pegs and restored me to my normal attitude.

There is no way I would have made such harsh comments to someone in real life, so why should I have done it over the internet? I just lashed out unfairly, and if Victor had let it slide without comment then I might have become worse. Luckily I'm not stubborn like some people, I will accept when I am at fault and try to change my attitude, and I'm never afraid to apologise for my actions.

So Victor has not had a bad influence on how I see things here, he has had a very positive influence on how I see things here and how I interact in this community.

I don't have a clue about what's going on as I'm not a massive poster here, but I'm still allowed to voice my opinion LFS' forum is far, far too uptight for me to become a regular poster on, even if I am very interested in what's here. Too many "Use the search!" posts and some very stringent moderation, even of little things like banter on threads. Nothing at all like the forum I've been a regular on for about 4/5 years. S'pose it's hard to change what you're used to though. *goes back to lurking*

The moderation is SOOOOO lax here, unless you break the rules - that's either spamming or posting content you shouldn't have access to.

The 'SEARCH' replies are only aim at those posts in which the question/suggestion is so obvious it will have been mentioned before. Some people still start threads suggesting weather - do they think that in the years LFS has been around no one has EVER suggested it, or that Scawen is too thick to think of these things himself.

Quote from ATC Quicksilver :

Well I insulted someone in this thread here...

http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?p=191211#post191211

...Victor then gave me an infraction and I complained saying I just gave an opinion, to which he replied that he didn't care. That got me all angry and I lashed out, then the next day realised he just did the same thing to me that I did to that person who posted the video, and realised the point he was making. I didn't like the way he made me feel, and he treated me the exact same way I treated the OP in that thread. I thank him for that because I was becoming one of those ****s on the internet that think they are better than everyone else, and he helped knock me down a few pegs and restored me to my normal attitude.

There is no way I would have made such harsh comments to someone in real life, so why should I have done it over the internet? I just lashed out unfairly, and if Victor had let it slide without comment then I might have become worse. Luckily I'm not stubborn like some people, I will accept when I am at fault and try to change my attitude, and I'm never afraid to apologise for my actions.

So Victor has not had a bad influence on how I see things here, he has had a very positive influence on how I see things here and how I interact in this community.

I guess this post pretty much sums up the whole thread, really.

And to the OP : Since when was CSU1 a mod? He's nearly as much as a moron as me. (Unless of course I've missed the point/not read it propperly)

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

Since when was CSU1 a mod?

/facepalm