It did happen.
He "replicated" iRacing car behaviour (atrocious) with GTR2, potentially with rFactor too. But as someone asked, why do that except to prove a point (and he did)?
Anyway, the poster at NoGrip got himself banned...or the local iRacing fanboys got him banned (reported his posts to MODS ad nausea).
Really?
It's amazing how these iRacing zealots/fanboys blurt out comments such as these.
iRacing management misses deadlines - nothing wrong with this, "they're being professional".
iRacing puts out a new NTM with a host of features (so they say) , which should imply to anyone paying attention that the OLD Tire Model (OTM) was far from being a good product - and to fanboys it's like the Second Coming, and no worries about the OTM being what it was (well, it still is, for 90% of the cars).
I for one hope the fanboys continue to inject their mega-doses of iRacing-hype, if that's what makes them happy. But refrain from coming to other forums, post bad remarks about other simulations and other people's works (yep, some of those constantly complaining about LFS and "no evolution" or "no patches" are coming from the iRacing camp - interesting...).
Cheers
About the initial crash issue with 0.6A4
Scawen,
just thought you'd like to know I found out what caused the problem I reported (the freeze and black screen upon launch - if on fullscreen - or when shit-F4ing to fullscreen).
drv.nam
Almost a year now, and I defined some 18 AI drivers (names). From then on, I have pretty much kept them all and race against them at several tracks.
So, I was looking for differences between the z28 files and the copy&pasted 0.6A4 and found none. Of course, the reason being I had used ALL my original files from the z28 version, and copy&pasted the 0.6A4 into it.
drv.nam was there.
Take away this file, no crash.
Put it back in, crash.
Take away and launch from fullscreen and iterate between full and windowed, no crash.
Put it back in, and do the above, crash (freeze+pitch black screen).
Just this file.
That was basically what I had missed (and the one difference between a fresh z28 install and the one I had - other than the controls configuration, which cause zero problems).
Cheers,
Miguel
just thought you'd like to know I found out what caused the problem I reported (the freeze and black screen upon launch - if on fullscreen - or when shit-F4ing to fullscreen).
drv.nam
Almost a year now, and I defined some 18 AI drivers (names). From then on, I have pretty much kept them all and race against them at several tracks.
So, I was looking for differences between the z28 files and the copy&pasted 0.6A4 and found none. Of course, the reason being I had used ALL my original files from the z28 version, and copy&pasted the 0.6A4 into it.
drv.nam was there.
Take away this file, no crash.
Put it back in, crash.
Take away and launch from fullscreen and iterate between full and windowed, no crash.
Put it back in, and do the above, crash (freeze+pitch black screen).
Just this file.
That was basically what I had missed (and the one difference between a fresh z28 install and the one I had - other than the controls configuration, which cause zero problems).
Cheers,
Miguel
Hello.
As you can see (the installer Scawen suggested solved it) it was NOT related to any graphics driver(s).
Food for thought for your benefit, if I may:
- previous versions of LFS: NO PROBLEM
- more than a dozen simulations installed: not a single problem with any of them (at least, of the nature of this issue)
You probably meant well, but...why would my PC be at fault? Hmm...
@Inouva,
no. I tried the ENB series for GTR2 and GTRE and had serious performance issues, no matter how I reworked the ENB config files.
Anyway, LFS is rather pleasing to look at, the lighting and shaders used provide for quite realistic visuals, so ENB is (IMO) not necessary.
That's good!
Anyway, the follow-up then...
Installed the 0.6A4 via the PE you offered and:
- spent one unlock
- problem eliminated, finito, smashed into oblivion, kaput.
I doubt it was corrupted installation related - probably something I had previously that no longer is compatible with 0.6A4. What that was, no clue.
Also, tried what you suggested (after I was sure the problem was no more): I tried a different rez, 1600*900 (the LCD native) and was pleasantly surprised to find that FPS wise, there was no discernible hit.
Scawen, thank you for the help and suggestions.
Regards,
Miguel
Yep. I thought of that and did folder comparisons back and forth. Nothing odd there too.
Not at all.
I am downloading it now.
This LFS_S2_6A4_setup.exe will install a full version, now up to and including 0.6A4?
Just one problem I see, but then you can probably neutralize that: what if it requires another unlock? I believe I have one left (spent the other one installing the 0.6A4), but...
I'd prefer to do this the way you suggested: install the file I'm downloading now, as this guarantees a really fresh-from-scratch install.
Oh, download finished. Will tell you what happens.
Thank you.
I clicked 1024*768 in the screen modes in "Options...Screen", when I first installed LFS (if it is listed and one can choose it, it IS supported, I assume).
As I said in my last post, I will try changing the rez from that location, given that by doing so it forces fullscreen on.
We'll see.
Yes, it is odd, I grant you that.
Hmm...
There always was a difference - haven't tested it with the last nvidia drivers releases - and it amounted to, at least, 10 FPS, even considering the effort of scaling down.
For most sims, LFS included, starts are the most critical point (together with collisions) at which FPS take a dive. And during starts, at higher resolutions, FPS can go as low as 20s (consider this: I race against 15 to 17 AI opponents in LFS), whereas with 1024*768 the numbers are somewhat higher: 37 FPS minimum.
These issues are highly dependent on hardware but also software, particularly OS and graphics drivers. There may not be a single cause for performance issues, but probably a host of little details here and there, as you know.
In any case, with the latest Z34 release, FPS jumped a bit - around 5-10 FPS more. Maybe I'll try upping the rez just to see how it goes now.
Thank you for the input.
UPDATE:
launched LFS windowed.
Went to OPTIONS.
Selected 1024*768.
Another pitch black screen. Frozen again.
Reboot again.
Last edited by MiguelMargarido, .
Sure thing, Squelch.
I honestly don't remember about forcing fullscreen on with resolution change. I have been avoiding re-launching 0.6A4 for fear of another reboot (the HDs don't like that), but...
Will try the desktop composition suggestion.
Thanks, m8.
Hi.
Sorry but...what are "ga graphics drivers"? If you're referring to common gfx card drivers, then there can't be any bug, as this does not happen with other versions of LFS or any other sim.
Also...Aero, where do I switch it off?
Hello, Scawen.
Though the LCD monitor has a native 1600*900 rez, I usually stick to 1024*768 (obviously, better on FPS) in-sim (regardless of sim: iRacing, LFS, NKP, XMR, Racer, GTR2, GTRE or rFactor).
As I said earlier, I have several installs now:
- full Z28
- z28+z34 (meaning, I copy&pasted z34 over a copy of the z28)
- z28+patch0.6A4 (meaning, I copy&pasted the patch over a copy of the z28)
The z28 and the z34 are faultless. Also, no unlock issues.
The 0.6A4 one required an unlock connection. Plus, the problem I mentioned: if I start fullscreen, it freezes pitch black. It totally locks the computer (keyboard including) making it necessary to reboot (which is odd with Vista, from my experience).
If I start LFS windowed and then shift+F4, it freezes pitch black. It locks the computer (keyboard including) making it necessary to reboot.
Manually selecting a resolution? What, if I may ask, would be the objective of doing that?
I could, just out of curiosity, try a different resolution, but I still have to activate FULLSCREEN. And that is where the problem is: the other versions, nothing to report, whether I start fullscreen or I shift+F4 causes no issues.
I know. It is odd. But I did follow the usual procedure.
And I rechecked the log and nada. No problem reported.
Fortunately, it is only happening with 0.6A4.
Unfortunately, I do not know if the final patch (when released) will also cause this for me. [But lets be positive anyway.]
Miguel
Scawen,
two issues after "installing" the latest 6A4 patch.
- I can only start in Windowed mode; Shift+F4 or starting fullscreen freezes the system (Windows Vista up-to-date) - I have had to reboot several times upon this.
- I had to unlock the S2 content
No error messages.
Just the freeze-out.
Miguel
PS: I keep 2 other versions: Z28 and Z34 (in separate folders, with obviously different names). Both run OK and are unlocked. I launch them with ZERO problems.
Agreed!
Let the developers finish off what they're handling right now. We'll all see what comes next...afterwards.
One thing is to NOT have anything new, and also no news regarding development (targets, steps, obstacles). Quite another is to HAVE something new, to have important news, to actually have a series of small patches prior to a bigger release.
Let them finish this first.
Cheers,
Miguel
Good news and sound thinking, Scawen. It's certainly too "late" in the patch's work schedule to revise that feature, it's better to go forward with what your team already has, be done with it and think about what to do next...afterwards.
Looking forward for this patch!
Cheers,
Miguel
To me, your post is just another to rationalize the usual "Great, a progress report, now I am satisfied" mentality.
I have been developing systems and applications for Galileo, ESA, Siemens, Vodafone and the like, right.
But I have also worked in game development.
Obviously, if you have worked in game development too, you know there are deadlines. And if you don't respect those deadlines, you're off for a big problem with marketing heads and the lot.
Obviously, Scawen is highly talented and is a respected professional. Obviously, the team behind LFS is terribly small.
Obviously, we all know that.
Read my post and a few other posts from LFS fans and loyalists, and understand them first before posting a comment.
@Scawen: as you said (understandably) you probably will not follow this thread anymore. Regardless, here's my final take on the matter:
post some milestones/deadlines for S3, abide by them, and I guarantee that if you do that, you may ask anything from 15 to 30 Euros for S3. I have been talking to a few LFS "loyalists" and we agree on this: S3 could cost us that much and we'll still purchase S3.
Take your time, research, implement, and surprise us. If you do so, in my view you'll be entitled to ask that fair amount for S3. We'll all stand to gain from this - your team and us.
As it is,
take care, and good luck.
Cheers,
Miguel
Scawen, alright, then
...most of us understand your point.
Between the abusive venom spat out by the likes of Guercio and the live-in-the-clounds blind optimism of many, something has been lost.
You're a developer, so am I (have been for many, many years).
Aside from my professional life, I have dealt with simulation physics (developer too) for commercial grade combat flight sims and have been involved with modding for racing sims.
Having a degree in Theoretical Physics, having read my heavy share of SAE papers, books et al, I really understand how hard it is to develop tire/chassis/aero physics. It takes time - particularly when the team involved is very small. Particularly when the most complex aspects of these models physics falls on the shoulders of one person alone (correct me if this is not so).
However...
I believe you are aware of the real issue, here: it's not that your team is lying or being dishonest, no. No.
It's rather the perceived (should I say obvious) lack of ability to effectively communicate with the community around a product YOU SELL/SOLD.
I have been following your project and this community for many years. Clearly, the credit given to the team behind LFS has been eroded, slowly but surely.
This goes beyond perfectionism - it bears on the ability to understand what people (we, the people, no pun intended, those that purchased LFS) expect from you and LFS.
In the real world, Area Managers, Division Managers, etc, demand from me and my co-workers, not only quality, dedication, but also deadlines.
In the era of MS project and the likes, we ALL know about deadlines and milestones. We cannot run away from them. They're imposed on us, and we are expected to deliver. Period.
Give us deadlines. And respect them.
Word of advice: do remember that ISI is releasing a new product, do remember that SIMBIN has suffered internal changes and is releasing a new product, do remember that netKar Pro is gathering a bit momentum, do remember that X-Motor Racing also has an interesting package, do remember that iRacing (with a heavy discount on hype) is here to stay.
Communicate better, dare give this community a few deadlines or dates for milestones, and I assure you that you can be "Perfectionism ad-infinitum" and still have more than a few thousand loyal followers - I'll be one of them.
Take care.
Miguel
PS: thus far, physics and graphics wise, your team has done a job to be proud of.
Between the abusive venom spat out by the likes of Guercio and the live-in-the-clounds blind optimism of many, something has been lost.
You're a developer, so am I (have been for many, many years).
Aside from my professional life, I have dealt with simulation physics (developer too) for commercial grade combat flight sims and have been involved with modding for racing sims.
Having a degree in Theoretical Physics, having read my heavy share of SAE papers, books et al, I really understand how hard it is to develop tire/chassis/aero physics. It takes time - particularly when the team involved is very small. Particularly when the most complex aspects of these models physics falls on the shoulders of one person alone (correct me if this is not so).
However...
I believe you are aware of the real issue, here: it's not that your team is lying or being dishonest, no. No.
It's rather the perceived (should I say obvious) lack of ability to effectively communicate with the community around a product YOU SELL/SOLD.
I have been following your project and this community for many years. Clearly, the credit given to the team behind LFS has been eroded, slowly but surely.
This goes beyond perfectionism - it bears on the ability to understand what people (we, the people, no pun intended, those that purchased LFS) expect from you and LFS.
In the real world, Area Managers, Division Managers, etc, demand from me and my co-workers, not only quality, dedication, but also deadlines.
In the era of MS project and the likes, we ALL know about deadlines and milestones. We cannot run away from them. They're imposed on us, and we are expected to deliver. Period.
Give us deadlines. And respect them.
Word of advice: do remember that ISI is releasing a new product, do remember that SIMBIN has suffered internal changes and is releasing a new product, do remember that netKar Pro is gathering a bit momentum, do remember that X-Motor Racing also has an interesting package, do remember that iRacing (with a heavy discount on hype) is here to stay.
Communicate better, dare give this community a few deadlines or dates for milestones, and I assure you that you can be "Perfectionism ad-infinitum" and still have more than a few thousand loyal followers - I'll be one of them.
Take care.
Miguel
PS: thus far, physics and graphics wise, your team has done a job to be proud of.
I know!
Hence my thank you!
Funny....
I never would have guessed from watching Top Gear that The Stig could be this nice to people! But I guess that's why he is always so quiet and why he listens to the weird songs...Miguel
Thank you, Bmxtwins.
I didn't mean to upset people by posting here. Not having the email of Bob, not being able to PM him back, at the very least I had to write that "thank you" post.
In any case, hopefully, Bob Smith must have already read the message.
Thank you all for your patience.
Miguel
For Bob Smith Moderator - a thank you note
Greetings, Bob Smith (Moderator).
I tried to PM you back, but unfortunately it seems your inbox isn't accepting more messages.
So, to the point, thanks for the swift reply. And thank you for helping me out!
If I can be of any assistance, don't hesitate and say so!
Regards,
Miguel
PS: intelligent and methodical work you got there! Many thanks!
I tried to PM you back, but unfortunately it seems your inbox isn't accepting more messages.
So, to the point, thanks for the swift reply. And thank you for helping me out!
If I can be of any assistance, don't hesitate and say so!
Regards,
Miguel
PS: intelligent and methodical work you got there! Many thanks!
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG