just practice, it is very do-able, just like real life your front wheels need to be pointing in right direction when rear grips come back

that was summed up beautifully
gt5: great graphics and sound, OK physics
LFS: OK graphics, great physics.

both games can be played and enjoyed on different levels

end of discussion............

Quote from legoflamb :

Personally the image of the way the developers of the GT series expect their game to be do not seem to fit the simulation stand point, for physics, A.I., and tire modeling. However it is an amazing looking game.

Already, with GT5 prologue (Japanese version on PS3), the suspension seems to act exactly the same as GT4. It gives of the feeling that the cars is not attached to the wheels at all. Driving feels like being in, what I imagine as, a hover car that follows the road surface and the wheels are just there to make the cars look like they are touching the ground. The A.I. was pretty good in avoiding the the car I was driving in, but they were easy to pass and their average speed (around Suzuka) was slow. I could put at least 12 sec. total at the end of two laps when starting in eighth while also playing with a controller (PS3). As for the tire modeling (grip), it had improved for GT4 and the GT demo. However, I would have to say that Forza motor sport 2 did a better job of simulating tire contact with the road.

The development of GT5 Prologue seems to have been focused more on the modeling of the cars and environments than the progression of their series as a simulation. My expectations of the development of the GT series was ruined when I played GT5 Prologue because it just didn't seem to have been developed much in the time and money they had spent on it. On another note, I most likely will sill purchase GT5 so I can play on some of the famous tracks such as Nurburgring, Laguna Seca or Infineon. But I will definitely not buy, or recommend buying the GT5 prologue.

i had the jap version it I agree it handled badly, there are some welcome changes for the PAL version and on top of that it gets some more improvements after you download the online online update

playing with PSN "friends" is apparently on its way

i didnt see it there, i bought the BD

the update enable online play and allows you to turn off ABS

i never suggested gt5 was better but rather that it aint crap.

dont even try to compare to real life,
some things just cant be simulated and these affect how you play a "game" , a couple for example :the feel of traction loss or pedal feel
both games must take some liberties to make the game about as challenging as real life,
i find LFS less intuitive to drive, sure it can be done easily but it feels better in GT5 imho, im sure LFS simulates things more realistically but for me it is about how it feels, i should be as easy as it is in real life,

i still enjoy BOTH games and partake in REAL motorsport, to dismiss GT5 completely is a joke

get a ps3
get gt5p PAL
get a drving force pro or G25
get the f430
turn off ABS
turn of all other assists
put game in professional mode
and put steering wheel in simulation mode

then... play gt5 for a bit
......
then come back and say that gt5 is crap. i challenge you.

im not saying it is better or worse than LFS but gt5p has come a long way, the physics are a lot changed from even the recent jap prologue, it has a real feel for oversteer now and FEELS GOOD which is the main thing. too many people just write this game off sight unseen and more importantly without playing it