Quote from TKKN :

The GTR 2 demo was rubbish according to my friend

It's not "rubbish", its just not as good as LFS, but its still good fun to play

Quote from danowat :

It's not "rubbish", its just not as good as LFS, but its still good fun to play

The cars behave ok, nothing special, I like the brake fade. If your using a Momo your supposed to reverse the effects for it to feel good.

Quote from danowat :

It's not "rubbish", its just not as good as LFS, but its still good fun to play

Bah, that's a moot point. You cannot argue over tastes, now can you? For you it might be "good fun to play", but for others it's just "rubbish". For me personally, it's the latter, simply because LFS has spoiled me in that regard. If a game is not arcade but trying to be a sim, and not having "it" - that special feeling that makes LFS, RBR, etc. stand out - then it's just rubbish for me. I want either a fun arcade game or a sim where the fun comes from it's realism. GTR2 is neither, so the demo went to the bin faster than KiD gets banned on RSC
Oh god, I hope I didn't start a new endless argument with that

I would say LFS beats GTR2 hands down and I`ve played GTR2 for a few months.
Long live LFS

Cheers!

Quote from danowat :

I find that having fun on other sims keeps LFS fresh and interesting and stops me getting "sim burn out" (a phrase that is prevelent in the flight sim fraternaty)

Dan,

Dan,

I understand and completely agree. I love LFS. So much so that I when I'm into it, I play it a lot, and eventually experience 'sim burn out'. It's inevitable. Although there aren't many other sims that interest me for more than a day at a time, it is nice to experience something else when the burn out comes along. The bonus is, it usually makes me appreciate LFS all the more. Sometimes I even take something from playing the other game that helps me in LFS.

An interesting thing ( I think ), is that when I bought GTR2, I was using a momo racing wheel. I thought the game was OK, nothing like LFS, but then if was like LFS it wouldn't serve a purpose.

Anyway, I just got a G25, and after playing LFS for several hours using it, I decided to try GTR again. It felt entirely different, and not for the better. I didn't much enjoy it at all. The feedback was pretty strange.

In LFS, I'm shocked to find what a piece of junk the momo racing wheel is in comparison to the G25. I quickly found out why I could be fast, but not consistent. The momo racing wheel isn't feeding back nearly as much information about what the car is doing. In contrast, it seems like in GTR2, you immediately notice the poor nature of the force feedback in that game. It's pretty obviously 'canned' effects, as others have suggested.

I've digressed from the initial point. GTR2 is a different experience. It's not LFS. It's apples and watermelons. But for 20 bucks I can't find any reason to get too upset. I wasn't expecting it to be better. I was just curious. Netkar, in contrast, feels like an immitation of LFS, without the functioning multiplayer, which makes it useless to me ( all just opinions, based on my experience as the person who purchased the games.).

First of all, if you have a job, can't you pretty much buy every race sim that comes out? Really people.
Secondly, I really love the off line racing in LFS. Crazy, I know, but I like to win occasionally and, ironically, I can't beat the guys who have no jobs. (Evidently they have practice time)
Instead of having this binary reaction to other games - it's either LFS or brand X- why not look at them with an open mind and see what we can incorporate into LFS?
You may now imply directly or indirectly that I am gay.
Thank you.

I wanted to take a look at other sims/games. I tried the GTR2 demo, and I dunno, aside the glorious and flashy intro with the quotes about it being the most advanced simulation mankind has ever created (which reminded me of like a moon landing event of some sort, really), I think I did one lap and a half, I had no way to guesstimate my speed and I missed every freaking corner.

Hell, I also bought TOCA 3 and it seems to have a better feeling than GTR2. There's no way I'm going to switch from a game - that runs 50fps on a 4 years old computer - with outstanding physics and great feeling to a game - that has trouble getting over 20fps on MY machine - with average everything.

For people who complain about LFS' sound, get yamakawa's CSR. It changed everything for me, and I'm pretty sure something along those lines will be implemented sometime in LFS.

I mostly play GPL because I'm in a league and I love the cars, but LFS is the only other sim that's kept my attention for the last 3-4 years. The variety of machines rocks, the physics have the goods over nearly every other sim out there and the MP code is exemplary. I hop into other games all the time but always come back to my top two netKar is a brilliant piece of work but too often I see empty servers - I also think the devs need to work a bit on their PR
I haven't tried GTR2 but I worked the first GTR demo pretty hard and it wasn't able to hold my attention. I won't say it's bad - it simply wasn't up to the standards that LFS and GPL have set
rFactor was similar. It's not bad, certainly not crap or arcadey (except for the GUI, ew), but again - simply not what I wanted.

i-racing looks like a really promising sim - a new sim with Dave "GPL" Kaemmer on board :up: Watch the video, it's very impressive (mostly because it confirms that I've been taking the right lines around Lime Rock in GPL )! Looks very professionally done, immersive and with great attention to detail - the "Kaemmer Effect" netKar is going to have some competition, methinks

Quote from rubberbrush :

First of all, if you have a job, can't you pretty much buy every race sim that comes out? Really people.

First of all, haven't you ever heard of a car payment, mortgage, electric bill, heating bill, groceries, taxes, clothing your children, insurance, phone bill, credit card debt, vehicle maintenance, fuel to get to that job, home repairs, remodelling, internet fee, cable TV bill, garbage bill.... Really rubberbrush!

Ok, I assume from your comment there that you are still young. Just wait until you have all those bills, then you'll understand that some of us can't just run out and buy everything they want. Else I'd be sitting in my Force-Dynamics with a G25 mounted. Scratch that, I'd be sitting on the real track in my Porsche, after all, I have a job, I should be able to afford it, right?

rubberbrush, come on dude I'd love to be able to buy everything that comes out - but then I'd need a PC capable of running all the newest games, which would cost as much as the bike I'm looking at, but one needs to prioritise, doesn't one? Unfortunately, my folks stopped buying me stuff years ago. My lady thinks I should spend my cash on rent, food, gas, power and the phone - I think I should spend it on games, PC upgrades and peripherals. She usually wins: you die if you don't eat, you get cold without a house and you stink if you don't have hot water

@Kev, setups are very important in GPL and the default setups are plain awful. The forum will be able to help you out with setups or tips (or I can email you some if you like). The original 1967 physics have a few flaws as well (which the community are all familiar with and know how to "drive around" )
You may want to try the 1965 Mod too, the cars are a lot more forgiving ('65 was the last year of 1.5L engines) and well-known bugs (specifically the low-speed lack of grip) have been ironed out or minimised :up: The 1969 Mod is great too: the power of 3L engines but with wings. If you're used to LFS it's very different but to me it's worth the time it takes to get good

The GPL version of Lime Rock (the version that's been copied over to just about every other sim you can mod) rules in the GPL cars, btw :up:

Quote from Hankstar :

i-racing looks like a really promising sim -

The video looks interesting. Of course, so did a half dozen other pre release videos. Sounds like its some time before it's released, so I guess we'll see when we see.

Yeah, I'm not expecting to come out before Christmas But with Dave "Papyrus" Kaemmer on board expectations are, rightfully, very high. I think it'll be worth the wait and I don't think it'll be a repeat of the current netKar situation.

Young?
Hardly...I'm 42. I have two kids. It's just that (most) of the folks who are into LFS seem to be on the right side of the bell curve. That usually means they can figure out some sort of career that will make buying video games painless. I'm on my second already.
I would guess that the majority of LFS players over the age of 30 have a combine income of over 100k a year. If you are struggling on that you need to budget better. Cut the Starbucks out for a week...bingo...
It would be an interesting anonymous poll... age and income of LFS users.

Quote :

I would guess that the majority of LFS players over the age of 30 have a combine income of over 100k a year...

LOL!
Come join us in the real world! You are way off the mark, do not judge people by your own standards.

Quote from TKKN :

As a teenager, I have no income at all.

as a teenager, i have bought two S2 licenses. Do odd jobs!

Quote from rubberbrush :

I would guess that the majority of LFS players over the age of 30 have a combine income of over 100k a year.

Well, we haven't done any "combining" of our pockets with my "partner" (what a weird term... has a distinct PC ring to it) so I can only speak for my income which is roughly over a 10th of what you mentioned there. I suspect that my expenses average on the same level as I always have money left over...

Errr y are we bickering over annual incomes? Chill.
LFS is one of the best (if not the best) sim... good graphics, good physics, nice machines, different tracks etc, that's why im dying to get my hands (err... pun here) on the S2 license.

Btw, this is abit off topic, but i'd like to ask, I tried playing the online multiplayer demo and when i spec people their actions seem to be laggy. Im in singapore... far frm europe, so are these lagness still present when playing the s2 online multiplayer?

Quote from Alkanphel :

Btw, this is abit off topic, but i'd like to ask, I tried playing the online multiplayer demo and when i spec people their actions seem to be laggy. Im in singapore... far frm europe, so are these lagness still present when playing the s2 online multiplayer?

What sort of ping rates are you getting?
If you want you can compare them with the S2 servers available by downloading "Browse For Speed" (check the addons forum) which grabs the list of servers and pings them for you as well.

Thanks - but how do i see the ping rates im getting?

http://en.lfsmanual.net/wiki/Image:Serverlist.jpg
The value below "Ping"

E: But I guess it's best to continue that discussion in your own thread

Sorry

Rubberbrush,

You might be off on your assumption of 'average income of lfs players over 30'.

I know I'm lucky. If a game comes out, I can buy it, and not lose sleep over it. I don't know that everyone who's purchased LFS could say the same.

Before you brought up income, you were referring to other people who had 'practice time'. I know a LOT of players who don't have endless free time to devote to the game, myself included. One thing that helps you improve is 'quality' practice, and you mentioned that you don't play on-line that much, I believe.

That's probably the quickest way to improve, albeit it's a catch 22 - you have to be online playing to meet people who are good drivers and people you can get along with. But, try to hook up with a couple friendly and skilled people. Find out when they typically join, and race WITH them.

I tend race against a very small group of people, usually 2-5 in a race, but they make me better, even if it's just chasing them (if noone is online I want to race with, I'll try a car I'm not familiar with). Jumping into a 20 car field of random people is usually more of an exercise in frustration than anything.

thisnametaken -

I can point you to many specific people in the US who don't have the delima of what to do with the wads of spare cash they have laying around at the end of the month. Crappy and non-crappy jobs notwithstanding.

Everything is relative ( except my parents).

I was reading over my last few posts and I realized I came across like a bit of a smug prick. I apologize for that. I am really a quite likable prick. Please forgive me.


I looked on wikipedia and I found these stats for average per capita income
1. Luxembourg 80,288
2. Norway 64,193
3. Iceland 52,764
5. Ireland 48,604
6. Denmark 47,984
7. Qatar 43,110
8. United States 42,000
9. Sweden 39,694
10. Netherlands 38,618
So I don’t think I’m completely off base.

But again..sorry if I offended anyone.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Ah! OK. I'll give it a proper try when I get a spare weekend (probably some time in January ). With the default set the car (I think I picked the Lotus - are they all noticably different?) felt like a boat, it just understeered all day. I could just about muster power oversteer if I tried really hard, but pushing it that hard made it impossible to catch...

All cars powers and difference is based on there real counterparts. A Ferrari feels totally different than a Honda.

The Lotus was the most powerful car in 1967. It takes experience and knowledge of the track pushing this car.

You should start out in the Cooper or the Brabham, and slowly try to get into it, these are old cars without downforce so you have to be patient learning how the car needs to be treated before starting to push it.

Try to avoid drifting, and be smooth with it, and hours of practise which is exciting in those beautiful cars. And you eventually will be able to go around Watkins Glen in less then 1 min 10 sec. A very rewarding feeling to master that Formula car without wings.

If you want to learn easier the behaviour of those types of cars you might want to start in the Trainer cars there are in the Training Mode these cars are Formula Cars with lesser Power, like F3. Be Patient the tracks of 1967 were very challenging.

If anybody want to try out GPL. You can get the Demo at bhmotorsports.com

Quote from N I K I :

I forgat to say; I think GTR 2 has best sound system on Earth

I would like to see so something like that in LFS

You can...

http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=12863