I doubt very much that either you or me have an objective opinion about how the cars should be balanced (Don't tell me everything different here, it's simply not true).

Again, I can understand your point with the gravel trap, but I don't follow your argumentation about the +30 secs penalty. In my view you want a smaller penalty for a mistake youself (well... we will see :shy made. The FXR doesn't get out of the gravel with a blown rear tire that easy (if it comes out) as you describe it too (and thats the tire that comes first in this car)
My point was / is that it can't be balaced because noone knows how often you will actually get stuck, it could happen every lap or never. So based on that it is impossible to balance this, even when I agree with you that the XRR can get stuck.

Unfortunatly this is the main event of the season and the first with new balanced cars, but it's just one race (and in 24hours so many things can happen).

Anyway, admins made a final decision for this race, and that's it for me.

We can of course have a review after the race about how the balancing / penalties worked out and make some changes again (thats what the FIA usually does in the WTCC) if needed.

Quote from AppiePils :

No, either change cars now and finish with that car the season, or stick to the FXR and finish the season with the FXR.

Would it be problem if we change our car after Aston event? We already made lots of testing with FXR on this track and none with FZR/XRR. Now there's little time for us to practice with other car. It's not just making a good hotlap, we must do much more about tactics, lap time stability, tyres testing, ppl motivating to race now with other car... We're already very grateful to admin team and your great job in this prestigious league.

Quote from marecare :

Would it be problem if we change our car after Aston event? We already made lots of testing with FXR on this track and none with FZR/XRR. Now there's little time for us to practice with other car. It's not just making a good hotlap, we must do much more about tactics, lap time stability, tyres testing, ppl motivating to race now with other car... We're already very grateful to admin team and your great job in this prestigious league.

The sentence you c/p said it all. It was announced a week ago that you guys were allowed to change cars. In that week your team could have been able to test the cars. Even if you weren't sure, you could have chosen not to participate in yesterday's qualification and have another week of testing and decision-making.
By driving the FXR during Q1, your car for the remainder of the season is fixed now.

3J:
Ive never said it should be exclusive to any car, i think the punishment is far to harsh for everyone really. If nobody could get out of gravel, or everyone could, then i'd have no problem with it, however the fact that we've spent 2 weeks talking about making the cars equal, yet now they're capable of similar laptimes the XRR stands to lose an unrecoverable amount of time because of something that cannot be balanced, its a series rule that takes it from being bad luck (losing whatever you've done that lap upto getting stuck) and makes it a real kick in the teeth, but its only a kick in the teeth really to the XRR because its the only one likely to have this issue.

The number of times it happens, whether its 0 or 10 isnt that relevent, if it never happens then thats perfect, but if it happens once you stand to lose about 4min on every other team in the class. But as i say, thats limited to one car, and whether its the drivers fault or not, the cars are equal on performance, but the FXR can screw up every lap and not worry, the XRR only needs to do it once and it could lose 3-5min. You'll see it in the end results, and i'll guarantee there will be 'inferior' teams who gain a couple of places purely off the back of this.
Not because they've made less mistakes, not because they're faster, but because they dont have this issue to worry about.
It may be just 1 race, however its worth twice as much as all the others, and at 24hrs in length the odds are people are going to end up in those gravel traps and FXR's like yours are going to start being given free laps over rival teams.

I can just see it ruining many teams races because of a problem that affects 1 car, and whereas before we'd get it back because its the faster car, now its pretty much impossible, Considering were talking about the XRR being 0.2-0.5sec faster per lap, thats going to take about 400 laps, in a race which will be 490-500 laps in total.
1 mistake, over 18hrs to recover from it. Is that fair, when the FXR doesnt have this issue.

I know all this sandpit stuff is a real "kick in the teeth" for your car, but we have got no solution to it when the drivetrains are already permanent in the game.

If we really wanted to, I think we'd make the FXR rear wheel drive in a heartbeat, but we simply cannot. The FXR is always the lone car, either highly neglected, or highly rewarded for its strengths and weaknesses. What you view as being a very large strength in recovery does indeed hold truth, but we cannot do much about it.

All this reminds me of seeing two different car types go off at the hairpin/turn 2 at Laguna Seca.... A BMW 3 coupe got stuck, the Audi A4 did this:

(best 3 shots I could photograph -- and this all happened in an instant)

Though, even a real AWD racecar could still get stuck in deep sand, this is just another typical issue with LFS, the sand traps have always been too forgiving for nearly every car.

Sorry Paul, but my point is that you've got to work with what you have, these kinds of inconsistencies are in nearly every real racing series. And we don't have the option to ban AWD this late in the season .

lol !

I hope that S-Core, or any other team with potential pwns both of T7R and Mercs hard, so you'd all shutup allready. Besides that, i wish all the teams good luck in da race.

For what im conserned, you would do just greatly in politics!

Quite an unfair post Pwr, Paulie is not speaking on behalf of the Mercury GT2 team and I guess that it's the same situation with 3j aswell.

Would be like me seeing your post right now and wishing great terror during the 24 hour race for the whole XFR team, not just yourself. But i'm not that bad, i'll just tap yo butt while overtaking.

Quote from PwrSlave :

lol !

I hope that S-Core, or any other team with potential pwns both of T7R and Mercs hard, so you'd all shutup allready. Besides that, i wish all the teams good luck in da race.

For what im conserned, you would do just greatly in politics!

I don't really get what you want. The discussion (maybe not the their tone sometimes and went a bit off in the end ) was important and needed to get the car balance done, which happend.
I doubt we would have done it so fast without Mercury or T7R as no other team seem to really care about the balancing, meaning that from both teams were always drivers on the track for test races...

Besides goes the usual saying: "When the flag drops the bullshit stops"...

I wish all teams good luck and close battle for the win.

Quote from PwrSlave :

lol !

I hope that S-Core, or any other team with potential pwns both of T7R and Mercs hard, so you'd all shutup allready. Besides that, i wish all the teams good luck in da race.

With that you are atm on place 1 for the most unsportsmanlike driver in LFS. Great attitude NOT

I totally agree with 3j on this one..even though discussions on here goes a bit overboard sometimes, nobody (besides perhaps the admins) does more research and gives more feedback (good or bad) than paulie...
T7R and Mercury have been working their asses off in order to sort this balancing issue to the greater good for everyone....
And comments like that, just shows me how ignorant you are...good luck!

Quote from PwrSlave :

lol !

I hope that S-Core, or any other team with potential pwns both of T7R and Mercs hard, so you'd all shutup allready. Besides that, i wish all the teams good luck in da race.

For what im conserned, you would do just greatly in politics!

It certinaly wont be XFR 'pwning' Mercs and T7R now will it?


You fail.

Omg, this only represents the tension thats going on out there. Now i have tried to make a little joke, wich came through badly. My fault, i guess im dead now.

But, i really dont see the point of all this fighting about 30 sec sand penalty or 1 lap, as it was kinda clear to me reading the posts, then Paul suggested the 30 sec sand penalty for all teams, not just GT2 XRR cars. Or am i wrong? And this T7R crying about stuff is really getting old to me, as its not the first time i have seen stuff like that from them. Although i would like to see the penalty reduced from 1 lap to bit less, as it is a sht long one, it is stil same for all teams as it stands. For us that internal means, u get in sand, u loose a ball. Do it 3 times, u get castrated. And while i appreciate all this testing and balancing the gt2 class, i just dont understand all the hard words some are saying over here.
True, when season started, we all had a choice of choosing the cars. And while manly teams (reffering to GT2 class), chose XRR, some have decided to go for pussy FXR. Its everybodys choice.
And please, stop taking stuff all that serious, or cant you undrstand the sence of joking?

At this point, i only would like to ask you 1 thing. My name in race will be: 24 Z.Hajdinjak. So if you want to take it out on me, do it while im be driving, not any of my other team mates. You all shall have a fair bit of chance, as i will most likely be in the car for 6 hrs or more. Please don't take it out on any of my team mates, they have nothing to do with my big ignorance and sht.

Other than that, believe it or not, i trully wish ALL the teams very best of luck!

Quote from Rooble :

It certinaly wont be XFR 'pwning' Mercs and T7R now will it?

Wouldnt be first time, though.

Quote from PwrSlave :

Omg, this only represents the tension thats going on out there. Now i have tried to make a little joke, wich came through badly. My fault, i guess im dead now .

Well, if it was a joke then ok (maybe put a smiley behind it next time, then it’s more understandable for others).

Quote from PwrSlave :

But, i really dont see the point of all this fighting about 30 sec sand penalty or 1 lap, as it was kinda clear to me reading the posts, then Paul suggested the 30 sec sand penalty for all teams, not just GT2 XRR cars. Or am i wrong?

When people have different opinions then they usually try to explain it with posts here, you know. Often the foreign language (or the epic posts ) that is used for it by some people makes it hard to really get the point or what they really mean and sometimes a discussion went a bit to far.

Quote from PwrSlave :

And this T7R crying about stuff is really getting old to me, as its not the first time i have seen stuff like that from them.

Maybe it was just another joke of you that went wrong but I don’t think so.
So I can’t leave that uncommented because it’s just not true.
If you can’t distinguish between a discussion or bringing up points or thoughts or things that are wrong and “crying about stuff” then no one can help you. But don’t write such a sh.t about my Team which just cast a poor light on us for no real reason.

Quote from PwrSlave :

. i truly wish ALL the teams very best of luck!

So do we.

must be an important race this weekend... huh

Quote from BBO@BSR :

With that you are atm on place 1 for the most unsportsmanlike driver in LFS. Great attitude NOT

Then this statement take the price of #1 untrue statement of the year ... this far ...

Dunno where this came from, tension must have laying there over many years, just waited to pop up.

Anyway, have no doubts ... Team XFR wishes ALL teams good luck for the race

im really looking forward seeing the finish order after the race... what if there are 3 fxr's in the top? :ices_rofl :bananadea anyway i copy the last sentence of my mate obove

Quote from Cawwa :

Then this statement take the price of #1 untrue statement of the year ... this far ...

Dunno where this came from, tension must have laying there over many years, just waited to pop up.

Anyway, have no doubts ... Team XFR wishes ALL teams good luck for the race

He just likes to bitch alot, guess he was a right little bitch as a kid.

Quote from ZanZi :

im really looking forward seeing the finish order after the race... what if there are 3 fxr's in the top?

If that happens i will roll over and die.

Quote from rc10racer :

He just likes to bitch alot, guess he was a right little bitch as a kid.

U got me there lol, but now i've grown and i turned into bitch slapper
But i shall turn out good soon, just like u did.

Cya on track, Pecker

can we finally close this topic?

I think all relevant was said, balancing is done.

Agreed.