Today in Rotterdam there were/are nice shows of race-cars including an F1 car(renault).

What is most noticable:
Clutches are not that weak in real life
The F1 car can take really high bumps at high speed
Tyres do not severly overheat as fast from severel burn-outs, powerturns etc. They did wear out quick, but the severe overheating and complete loss of grip as what happens in lfs, dit not happen irl.

Same for gtr-like racing cars, doing several 0-100km/h-0 runs for show. Did they kill their clutch and/or tyres? NO!

Last week there was a news article about F1-tyres. Drivers were complaining about it was impossible to get soft-tyres to optimal tempature and were begging bridgestone to give them the super-soft compounds. In lfs, tyres on bf1 are phrone to catching fire just by looking at them.. what a difference with real world..

So now i am even more convinced lfs is very wrong about how weak tyres and clutches are.
I am still hoping it will be fixed soon!

If you are still having problems with tires/clutches you are driving wrong.

And It's hard for us to compare to Real F1 tires As not very many of us have driven an F1 car. We can only go by what the drivers say about the single tire manufacturer.

It sounds like you are driving on the lowest temp. tire available. They require a lot of skill to not overheat them as quickly. As for the clutch.. Most people do not have a problem with it.

The clutches are far too weak and I think most of the community recognises this, however I don't think you can draw real comparisons of tyre heat/wear until we get a real track in LFS. It sounds silly but different tracks have different effects - if there was a real life Aston we could probably test this with some F1 data from there but since there isn't - its guess work really.

I have yet to kill a clutch in LfS (except one time in the UF1 on a rallyecross track).

Also, it's quite unfair to compare 2 year old F1 tyres (we have the Sauber BMW 06) with current ones. Also when talking about wear you have to take into account that due to lack of fatal consequences, even a sub par LfS driver drives much more aggresively than a race driver, thus eating through tires quicker.

Still I agree that tyres are one of several points in LfS which could be improved.

clutches are an odd thing...when the killable clutch was first brought in we in the banger servers thought it would be the end as all the cars would be dead before the finish, it was like that for a while but then people learnt not to just pile in on everything like they had been doing before but to judge what to hit and where, and now it's just like it was before the killable clutch was brought in

There are still occasions though when I can kill my clutch in one go after a particularly meaty hit

Quote from Bluebird B B :

What is most noticable:
Clutches are not that weak in real life
The F1 car can take really high bumps at high speed
Tyres do not severly overheat as fast from severel burn-outs, powerturns etc. They did wear out quick, but the severe overheating and complete loss of grip as what happens in lfs, dit not happen irl.

Same for gtr-like racing cars, doing several 0-100km/h-0 runs for show. Did they kill their clutch and/or tyres? NO!

Last week there was a news article about F1-tyres. Drivers were complaining about it was impossible to get soft-tyres to optimal tempature and were begging bridgestone to give them the super-soft compounds. In lfs, tyres on bf1 are phrone to catching fire just by looking at them.. what a difference with real world..

So now i am even more convinced lfs is very wrong about how weak tyres and clutches are.
I am still hoping it will be fixed soon!

Good job that:

Clutches are not weak in real life
F1 cars can take similar bumps in LFS to those in Rotterdam
Tyres do get a bit hot a bit quickly in LFS, but this isn't really noticable unless you are trying to show it.
0-100 runs in LFS won't kill tyres or clutchs. In fact, in this regard LFS tyres heat up too slowly.
We don't have the same compounds as real life F1, so perhaps consider using the next compound up? As we are unlikely to see specific information on F1 tyre compounds and temperatures I don't think that it's entirely fair to blame anyone. You could have rFactor tyres that remain totally inert at all times, would that be better?

I think you need to learn to drive.

Quote from Bluebird B B :

Today in Rotterdam there were/are nice shows of race-cars including an F1 car(renault).

What is most noticable:
Clutches are not that weak in real life
The F1 car can take really high bumps at high speed
Tyres do not severly overheat as fast from severel burn-outs, powerturns etc. They did wear out quick, but the severe overheating and complete loss of grip as what happens in lfs, dit not happen irl.

Same for gtr-like racing cars, doing several 0-100km/h-0 runs for show. Did they kill their clutch and/or tyres? NO!

Last week there was a news article about F1-tyres. Drivers were complaining about it was impossible to get soft-tyres to optimal tempature and were begging bridgestone to give them the super-soft compounds. In lfs, tyres on bf1 are phrone to catching fire just by looking at them.. what a difference with real world..

So now i am even more convinced lfs is very wrong about how weak tyres and clutches are.
I am still hoping it will be fixed soon!

So you PERSONALLY drove these cars did you so you knew what you did with the clutch etc and then took the tyre temps after the run. How do you have ANY idea about what you just spoke about unless you had access to all the data on the cars you probably looked at only?

99% of people that cook the clutch in LFS do so because they are either too lead footed or DO NOT put the clutch in when then spin. IRL if you spin you put the clutch in to protect it. How often do you do that in LFS?

No LFS is not perfect BUT most of the problems reported are still between keyboard and chair in that people DO NOT drive as they would IRL. Too many people push too hard and exploit LFS and its unlimited setups for extra speed instead of just driving the car then wonder why things go wrong

Quote from Woz :

So you PERSONALLY drove these cars did you so you knew what you did with the clutch etc and then took the tyre temps after the run. How do you have ANY idea about what you just spoke about unless you had access to all the data on the cars you probably looked at only?

99% of people that cook the clutch in LFS do so because they are either too lead footed or DO NOT put the clutch in when then spin. IRL if you spin you put the clutch in to protect it. How often do you do that in LFS?

No LFS is not perfect BUT most of the problems reported are still between keyboard and chair in that people DO NOT drive as they would IRL. Too many people push too hard and exploit LFS and its unlimited setups for extra speed instead of just driving the car then wonder why things go wrong

Well did any of you ever drive an F1 car, did the engineers who built it? Who designed the tyres?? I think not. Apperently it is not required to drive one. But listen carefully to what the drivers tell and what you see etc. does seem to give a very good idea what is going on and don t jump conclusions. Here we do assume things: "tyres must be really as bad and troublesome, irl F1 drivers are lying about tyres, why don' t they complain more about overheating? We have it in lfs! So they must have also this problems, It can' t be true tyres irl are that good.."


Using r4 tyres? nobody uses very hard compounds irl nor should we in lfs.

@tristancliffe:
" F1 cars can take similar bumps in LFS to those in Rotterdam"
Well if i tell a fbm should be able to take at low speeds a mild bottom out, i was told to be crazy and out of my mind. Did the youtube movies of flying formula cars help to get that right?

"0-100 runs in LFS won't kill tyres or clutchs. In fact, in this regard LFS tyres heat up too slowly." True, on some cars the clutch is too strong and on some too weak.

"We don't have the same compounds as real life F1, so perhaps consider using the next compound up? As we are unlikely to see specif..."
True, but it can' t be that hard to change some things to get the tempatures bit down in lfs. It is very clear irl f1 drivers don't have any overheating problems and such problems are very rare in most racing classes. Usually its lower raceing classes sometimes a drivers is telling they had to be carefull not to wear tyres out too fast(not too sliding, not too much pusing). It is rare i hear a driver complain about overheating tyres, it does happen but it is rare and in some classes overheating is more common then others.

However something should be made a lot weaker then it is now in lfs, tyres should wear out much quicker. Espacially the soft compounds.

Clutches do heat way way way too fast, and now dont tell me that im driving wrong, you should still be able to do burnouts etc, but in LFS burnouts are basically a suicide.

Quote from Eleanor SpeedGT :

Clutches do heat way way way too fast, and now dont tell me that im driving wrong, you should still be able to do burnouts etc, but in LFS burnouts are basically a suicide.

With auto-clutch or manual? Auto will heat it up real fast because it's always engaging itself and slipping around at the slightest provocation, quite often at times that it's not required to clutch-in at all.

Also note that setups you probably use, have race-car-like gear-ratios, making it hard to spin from stop-n-go. If you need wheelspinzors, make the first gear shorter. A lot.

I find the clutch on the rb4 is right. If you did alot of standing starts in an impreza the gears would start to feel loose because the clutch was heating up.

Ah yes, the clutch gears. I'd forgotten about them...

Err, what are clutch gears, or did you make them up?

Meh dam typo. Thanks for pointing it out

One thing to point out here. Many many people run with VERY long 1st gears and this in itself is the cause of clutch burn. I have managed to do 10+ race starts in GTRs in LFS back to back and NOT burn a clutch out.

Also if you use the Auto clutch I would say its not the actual clutch but the auto clutch as it does appear to slip too often, this has been mentioned as the probably fault before.

I use manual and hence have real control over it so do not burn the clutch ever. Also make sure you put the clutch in the instant you lose control.

As to tyre heat and how F1 drivers do not have same heat issues.... Do you REALLY believe that F1 drivers are as hard on their car as almost all LFS drivers. An F1 driver will never push their cars as far and hard into slip, in fact they try to avoid in ALL situations. Their drive to the cars limit, NOT over it and their EVERY move is checked and they are coached constantly about even the most tiny mistake in their technique when not in a race.

An F1 car is NOT easy to drive right, do not believe that ANYONE here is really a good enough driver to be even able to drive one IRL at the pace required to even keep temp in the brakes and tyres. You will NOT BE however much you might think you are, most overdrive because fear is NOT a factor in LFS! The edge on an F1 is VERY thin. Step over the edge and you are cooking the fragile tyres if you could keep the car from biting and putting you in a wal. Drive too soft and the tyres and brakes will just not be hot enough to even work. Just look at when Hamster tried to drive an F1

Its far better looking at the cars we all have experience in. Use the Road setups from Bob and then look at your replays and compare to driving IRL. Its not 100% as I have said before BUT its not far off.

Quote from Bluebird B B :

Using r4 tyres? nobody uses very hard compounds irl nor should we in lfs.

Even with limitless budgets F1 teams will not be putting new soft compound tyres on cars that are going to do burnouts in a car park, they will either use worn out hard tyres that are of no use on a circuit or in the case of F1 cars they sometimes run special demonstration tyres (very hard and low grip). You should have no issue doing burnouts in LFS just like in real life use suitably low gearing, dump the clutch and away you go.

Quote from Eleanor SpeedGT :

Clutches do heat way way way too fast, and now dont tell me that im driving wrong, you should still be able to do burnouts etc, but in LFS burnouts are basically a suicide.

Please don't tell me not to tell you that you're driving wrong, because if you burn your clutch while making burnouts or drag starts, you ARE doing something wrong.

It only costs you few seconds to save a replay and post it here.

Ok yes actually if done right its good, ignore my post about burnout.

But what i actually wanted to say that sometimes when i shift while full throttle, sometimes clutch wont heat up, but sometimes again it does, i got DFP and auto clutch on at options.

Maybe each "level" presents like 5 celsius and each shift heats it up for about 4,894563452 celsius? Just take the numbers as example.

Quote from Woz :

...put the clutch in when then spin. IRL if you spin you put the clutch in to protect it...

How long has it been since you got your clutch changed? Only once have I driven a car where I needed to press the clutch in a spin, but the clutch fell out in broken pieces when we took down the transmission on that one. On my own Miata, I can hold full throttle in a spin and just skid away in a big blueish cloud...

About tires, we are driving faster in LFS than in real life, the turns and stuff, that's why they heat up so fast. (hope i'm right)

Quote from TurboLag :

How long has it been since you got your clutch changed? Only once have I driven a car where I needed to press the clutch in a spin, but the clutch fell out in broken pieces when we took down the transmission on that one. On my own Miata, I can hold full throttle in a spin and just skid away in a big blueish cloud...

The statement he makes talks of autoclutch. With autoclutch, when you spin, LFS attempts to feather the clutch causing extreme slipping while the car is moving in reverse at 40 mph and the transmission is in 5th with the driver's foot planted firmly on the throttle. Put your Miata into a spin, and hold full throttle while having your clutch halfway engaged. I'm sure it will relate closer to LFS than your statement of "skid away in a big blueish cloud."

Put LFS into manual clutch, no matter if you have a pedal or use the button. Then spin and note what happens. The clutch does not heat up. The car stalls instead or the tires spin in a "big blueish cloud."

Again for the 22364 time, the fault is in the autoclutch not the clutch modeling itself.

Quote from mrodgers :

The statement he makes talks of autoclutch. With autoclutch, when you spin, LFS attempts to feather the clutch causing extreme slipping while the car is moving in reverse at 40 mph and the transmission is in 5th with the driver's foot planted firmly on the throttle. Put your Miata into a spin, and hold full throttle while having your clutch halfway engaged. I'm sure it will relate closer to LFS than your statement of "skid away in a big blueish cloud."

Put LFS into manual clutch, no matter if you have a pedal or use the button. Then spin and note what happens. The clutch does not heat up. The car stalls instead or the tires spin in a "big blueish cloud."

Again for the 22364 time, the fault is in the autoclutch not the clutch modeling itself.

AH! Agreed I use manual clutch myself, so I haven't really experienced the problem

I; m out of lfs until the next patch. I'm so frustrated i have use total weird settings. i' ve had enough of it.

yeah, having to clutch in a car is totally weird...

I got bad news though: I don't think that'll change.