And Bernie's at it again.

From Autosport

Quote :

Formula 1 has found itself back in the headlines for the wrong reasons thanks to controversial comments made by Bernie Ecclestone in interview suggesting praise for the fact that Adolf Hitler 'got things done'.

Just a week after grand prix racing thrust itself to the top of news programmes and the front pages of newspapers after teams briefly launched a breakaway championship, an Ecclestone interview in The Times has put the focus back on the sport once again.

In the lengthy interview, where Ecclestone talks about life and politics rather than racing, F1's commercial rights holder makes no bones about his belief that strong dictators are best.

When asked if he had a favourite historical dictator, like Stalin or Napoleon, Ecclestone said: "Maggie's [Margaret Thatcher's] gone.

"In a lot of ways, terrible to say this I suppose, but apart from the fact that Hitler got taken away and persuaded to do things that I have no idea whether he wanted to do or not, he was in the way that he could command a lot of people able to get things done.

"In the end he got lost so he wasn't a very good dictator. Either he knew what was going on and insisted, or he just went along with it — either way he wasn't a dictator."

Ecclestone also questioned the more up-to-date western foreign policy of going after the Taleban and Saddam Hussein.

"Politicians are too worried about elections," he explained. "We did a terrible thing when we supported the idea of getting rid of Saddam Hussein, he was the only one who could control that country. It was the same [with the Taleban]. We move into countries and we have no idea of the culture. The Americans probably thought Bosnia was a town in Miami. There are people starving in Africa and we sit back and do nothing, but we get involved in things we should leave alone."

And he also vented his frustration at environmentalists who criticise F1.

"I was on the Fulham Road the other day and there were six buses lined up empty," he said. "I thought, 'Don't complain about us'. Thirty seconds of the Red Arrows at Silverstone use more fuel than we use in a week."

It is Ecclestone's comments on Hitler that have caused the most controversy, however, with them receiving widespread media coverage worldwide - and damnation from politicians and Jewish organisations.

Conservative John Whittingdale, chairman of the Culture, Media and Sport Select Committee, told The Daily Mail: "These are extraordinary views and I'm appalled that anybody could hold them."

A senior F1 insider told AUTOSPORT that he feared for the damage being caused to the sport by Ecclestone's comments, and suggested the controversial remarks were evidence that the time had come for him to step down from his control of grand prix racing.

"The saddest thing about it is that no-one close to him has got the guts to put a hand on his shoulder and say: 'You aren't the man you used to be and it's time to call it a day.'" said the source. "And the man who should do it is Max."

IMO, I think he talks sense about not knowing the cultures, but he talks a load of manure about everything else.

EDIT: Whoa, I broke the swear filter? Edited to avoid mod wrath

Hopefully this will result in his power being undermined.

the worst bit is in the end it said max is a better person for the job, now eccelstone is an ancient blithering idiot but by know means is max any better for the job, maybe he was getting max and adulf hitler confused, its not hard, both have/had a tendancy to **** everything up

Is there any link on the web to the interview?

what is completely retarded is that he is actually right. But oh noes, he mention the name Hitler... so it is automatically a very bad phrase and the content doesnt matter.

What he MEANT was "a strong dictator gets stuff done, cause he doesnt care what others say - and sometimes this is exactly what's needed".

THEN he gave a few examples, one being hitler (who DID get a LOT done - usually BAD, but they got done), also noting that hitler was a tad too soft for a good dictator, cause he let himself be influenced and controlled by his advisors.

What the media heard was "I wanna be like hitler cause he was teh bomb!"


Is the requirement to work in the media an IQ of at most 50??? Jeez.

Quote from three_jump :

Is there any link on the web to the interview?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/t ... mula_1/article6632991.ece

Bernie seems to be somewhat misguided in his understanding of who Hitler was and what Hitler did. I'm really not sure where in normal life you'd actually get that kind of illusion about Hitler, but somehow Bernie seems to have collected it at some point. Rather a weird and distorted understanding, really.. and suspiciously bizarre.

The media definitely seems to be compounding the problem. Any mention of Hitler is automatically examined for hints of anti-Semitism. I'm less than impressed by that trend, but it's been cumulative for about 60 years now. It's a bit too witch-hunt for my taste, but understanding the politics behind The Times newspaper is important to keep a proper perspective.

Quote from Stigpt :

what is completely retarded is that he is actually right. But oh noes, he mention the name Hitler... so it is automatically a very bad phrase and the content doesnt matter.

What he MEANT was "a strong dictator gets stuff done, cause he doesnt care what others say - and sometimes this is exactly what's needed".

THEN he gave a few examples, one being hitler (who DID get a LOT done - usually BAD, but they got done), also noting that hitler was a tad too soft for a good dictator, cause he let himself be influenced and controlled by his advisors.

What the media heard was "I wanna be like hitler cause he was teh bomb!"


Is the requirement to work in the media an IQ of at most 50??? Jeez.

For a long time it was the editors who always had a lower IQ, but now it's becoming harder to tell.

As for what Bernie says, well I'm sure this will be used as a stick to beat him with, however anyone that can link Maggie and Hitler together gets a from me .

hmm, maybe it's just me, but I don't really get what all the fuss is about.

Bernie is talking about the shortcommings of democracy, like politicans more caring for the next election and being to feared to do anything unpopular but necessary. He's stating that a strong leader (Thatcher etc.) can get it done (for the good or the worse) and thats the better solution instead of doing nothing.

Quote :

He seems to see Hitler as a passive bystander who was too weak to stop the Holocaust.

Pure speculation, imho.

/me goes searching for his flameproof suit

I agree with Three_Jump, he was merely talking about the way dictatorships get things done, he wasn't commenting on whether or not those things are right or wrong. His comments about Hitler not really being in control towards the end are correct too, that's the reason the allies didn't assassinate him when they had the chance. Don't get me wrong, I think Bernie is a greedy little twat, but the media has just jumped on this because he mentioned Hitler.

OMG! OMG! OMG! A thread that has Hitler on every post! QUICK! LOCK IT!

The world needs more people like bernie!

Quote from Ssr_Nick :

The world needs more people like bernie!

lol wut?

What he said wasn't technically incorrect, but it was certainly insensitive and unnecessary, given that one of the things that Hitler "got done" was the extermination of several million people, and given that references to that "getting done" made in a positive light are prone to provoking controversy. Plus, given Max Mosley's history, it's not exactly hard for tabloid and even mainstream media outlets to make the jump. It's just stupid.

Hitler was an amazing leader - the fact he managed to lead people into well... I think we all know is probably a bigger testament than any.

You can support someones style of leadership without supporting their policies...

Hitler certainly 'got things done', having around 6 million people murdered is quite a significant example of 'getting things done'.

Germany prior to Hitler was in a terrible state.
Germany with Hitler in power became a superpower.
Hitler then went a bit too far, and Germany ended up in a terrible state (but with the structure to allow it to recover and become the country it is now).

Hitler did a damn good job in some ways, and in those ways is a far better leader than most in history.

Quote from Jakg :

Hitler was an amazing leader - the fact he managed to lead people into well... I think we all know is probably a bigger testament than any.

Yep. Hitler 'got things done' through fanaticism, not leadership. He didn't lead Germany, he fired it up.

I could win the grand national by cutting the legs off all the horses and walking round. Technically, that would "get the job done" but that doesn't mean it's justifiable.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Hitler then went a bit too far, and Germany ended up in a terrible state (but with the structure to allow it to recover and become the country it is now).

Good grief.:rolleyes:

Obviously you are unaware of what Hitler did before "The War".

Quote from durbster :

Yep. Hitler 'got things done' through fanaticism, not leadership. He didn't lead Germany, he fired it up.

Still - did he turn Germany from a wreck into a nation which could (and did) take on the rest of the world?

Quote from tristancliffe :

Obviously you are unaware of what Hitler did before "The War".

Quote from Jakg :

Still - did he turn Germany from a wreck into a nation which could (and did) take on the rest of the world?

Ermmm, do you lads know how he did it ?

Quote from tristancliffe :

Obviously you are unaware of what Hitler did before "The War".

you mean overspend far too quickly forcing him to rob norway quicker than originally intended thus losing the war due to lack of preparation from cutting them short by a couple of years?

Personally if I was Bernie and i said that, and everyone expected an apolegy i would tell them to hit the road, he did nothing wrong, he has the right to an opinion(which may or may not be stupid) and what he said wasn't even in support of Nazism, it was stating Factual information with hes opinion.

Quote from Mazz4200 :

Ermmm, do you lads know how he did it ?

Clearly not, which is a bit of a shame. Everyone should be aware of this stuff at the very least.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Obviously you are unaware of what Hitler did before "The War".

Played Risk?

Quote from durbster :

Clearly not, which is a bit of a shame. Everyone should be aware of this stuff at the very least.

I rather agree. The first thing Hitler did, as soon as he was able, was to imprison and torture any and all opposition, anyone who disagreed with him, anyone who was overheard questioning his policies and practices.

People who think Hitler was a good leader should by the same token also think that all those bankers that got us in this idiotic financial crisis should be praised for their insights in short-termism and cowboy boom/bust economics. What Hitler did was atrocious from the get-go.. what he did to Germany and its people, and what he went on to do to the rest of Europe. Absolutely NOTHING that Hitler did, at ANY point, deserves praise.

And we, the rest of the world, can't shirk our responsibilities either. We facilitated his sick and twisted mayhem with our vindictive subjugation of the German people after WWI. And bugger me if we're not doing the same bloody thing in Iraq, all over again. Idiots, the lot of us, and the cherry on the top of the idiot cake is definitely Hitler.

But they did have nice uniforms, lets not forget that.