Quote from thisnameistaken :

Teams can make way more money from sponsorship opportunities arising from the publicity of winning the WDC than any financial reward for winning the WCC, TV money etc.

not quite
mclaren lost some 80million dollars for stealing ferrari blueprints which would have been the price money for comming in (iirc) second in the constructors
considering that a top teams yearly budget its about 3-400million 25% of that is anything but insignificant

Quote from Shotglass :

not quite
mclaren lost some 80million dollars for stealing ferrari blueprints which would have been the price money for comming in (iirc) second in the constructors
considering that a top teams yearly budget its about 3-400million 25% of that is anything but insignificant

Compared to the other 75% it is.

But that's an extreme example - the difference between first and last place in the WCC. Of course that's going to involve a large amount of money. The difference between first and second is probably not so huge, whereas the difference between first and second in the drivers' championship certainly is.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Compared to the other 75% it is.

But that's an extreme example - the difference between first and last place in the WCC. Of course that's going to involve a large amount of money. The difference between first and second is probably not so huge, whereas the difference between first and second in the drivers' championship certainly is.

Just sayin' that you 100% pulled this post right out of your ass. Way to go.

Quote from 5haz :

Thats the point, Button had to work for his championship in the end, it wasn't handed to him by the mistakes/misfortune of others.

Yes the crashes and Ruben's puncture helped a lot, but Button still needed to make the passes he made in order to be in the right place.

FFS! Cut it off.


you say that jenson is the best driver in this god damn world just because he had a car with illegal parts at the start of the season.


then later on someone says that jenson is a worthy champion and that kimi and lewis are utter shit. now, gonna think like you guys did, and say that KIMI is a more worthy champion that Jenson AND Lewis just because HE DROVE HIS ARSE OFF FOR THE GOD DAMN WDC. he was 17 points behind with 2 races to go, and still managed to take it away from hamilton by 1 point. i wonder what jenson would have done if he was in the same situation that kimi was 2 years ago. i bet that he would whine about on the radio that some japanese rookie should let him thru since hes fighting for the WDC.


5haz, you can eat shit and die... and i mean it, with a passion

Quote from lamerr :

Hm am I The only one who is a bit pissed off at Webber?? I mean his move on Raikkonen was really dirty, I thought he deserved a DT for changing his line twice and forcing Kimi off the road

It was a bit naughty but Kimi already had a puncture at that point, Sutil hit him into the first turn and you could see half way round the lap his left rear was flat.

Quote from el pibe :

. he was 17 points behind with 2 races to go, and still managed to take it away from hamilton by 1 point.

i would say that was more Lewis losing the championship than it was Kimi winning it.

I am now interested with the champsionship well and truely over, can Button take a stab at winning the last race?

Quote from pik_d :

Jenson won because he was gifted (by Ross Brawn) a bunch of wins early on.

Don't think so, he earned those poles in the early season and for the first five races never made a slight mistake, the car was good but not miles ahead of another other cars. The pole in Monaco is in particular all down to him in my opinion.

If he earned them, then why did he all of a sudden stop earning them after Turkey? He had 7 podiums in a row, 5 of which were wins, then didn't get another podium for 6 races. Qualifying followed a similar pattern, while the rest of the teams were trying to catch up on the diffuser tricks he was getting pole positions left and right, but after Turkey, well he got a 3rd in Germany but nothing else too impressive.

The other drivers didn't suddenly wake up and say "Oh Christ, I'm racing aren't I?", it's pretty clear he had a superior car to start with, then couldn't manage to keep up in the mid and late season once everything had settled into place so far as relative car performance.

Jenson is good, no doubt, but he's really only capable of winning when all the cards are stacked in his favor. When the car became less than perfect in the mid-season all you heard on his team radio was an incessant whine, unlike Rubens who was able to pick up two wins. He's only good though, not great; likewise he did deserve the championship the most out of anyone on the field this year, but that's not to say that he deserved it as much as other champions who were strong contenders all year long.

Hmm... Well it has to be said that was easily Jensons best drive of the year. One of the best drives I've seen from anyone for a while in fact. No doubting he got lucky though in order to place where he did and take the championship, but thats racing.

Nice to see Hamilton showing his true colours and practically ramming Rubens off the circuit in an attempt to pass, just so he could get his (meaningless) podium finish and damn the championship title contenders chances. Many other drivers would have acknowleged Rubens fight for the title and not made such an aggressive overtaking manouver or pressured him so hard. But no he has to go and clip him and give him a puncture. Not that it mattered ulitmately given Jensons position, but I have no doubts he would have done the same thing even if Jenson had already DNF'd or was way out of the points. Selfish anyone? I haven't actively disliked him to this point, (despite what you may all think), but I'm not impressed with him now.

End of the day though. Well done Jenson !!

Quote from pik_d :

If he earned them, then why did he all of a sudden stop earning them after Turkey?

I think it's a mental thing, particulary how he approach the quali, seeing his race pace has never actually dropped throughout the season, and he generally make up a lot of places in the race itself. It's a confidence issue that dawned on him when he realise he can't win every race, and tried to adjust his approach which somehow worked against him.

Quote from pik_d :

If he earned them, then why did he all of a sudden stop earning them after Turkey? He had 7 podiums in a row, 5 of which were wins, then didn't get another podium for 6 races. Qualifying followed a similar pattern, while the rest of the teams were trying to catch up on the diffuser tricks he was getting pole positions left and right, but after Turkey, well he got a 3rd in Germany but nothing else too impressive.

The other drivers didn't suddenly wake up and say "Oh Christ, I'm racing aren't I?", it's pretty clear he had a superior car to start with, then couldn't manage to keep up in the mid and late season once everything had settled into place so far as relative car performance.

Jenson is good, no doubt, but he's really only capable of winning when all the cards are stacked in his favor. When the car became less than perfect in the mid-season all you heard on his team radio was an incessant whine, unlike Rubens who was able to pick up two wins. He's only good though, not great; likewise he did deserve the championship the most out of anyone on the field this year, but that's not to say that he deserved it as much as other champions who were strong contenders all year long.

What are your feelings on Fernando Alonso as 2005 and 2006 World Champion then? Both Alonso's title winning seasons are pretty similar to Button's. When he had the car advantage he won, when he didn't he went into point scoring mode, the only difference in my opinion is that there are more cars capable of winning Grand Prix than in 05 and 06.

Quote from CSF :

What are your feelings on Fernando Alonso as 2005 and 2006 World Champion then? Both Alonso's title winning seasons are pretty similar to Button's. When he had the car advantage he won, when he didn't he went into point scoring mode, the only difference in my opinion is that there are more cars capable of winning Grand Prix than in 05 and 06.

05 there where some fantastic battles though, and 06 was pretty close the title battle was always there, unlike this year where most thought it was over by Turkey.


Still, not much come close to Brazil 08.

In 2006 Alonso had a 25 point lead after Canada... everyone though it was over after he won 6/9 races and had finished 2nd in the other 3 and had 84/90 points! The similarities between Button and Alonso's two titles are quite great to be honest.

only difference was alonso never had a string of crappy races, he would either be up the front or retired.

USA and Germany 06 were pretty bad. As I said the difference is that there are more cars that can win and be up front in 09 than 06, meaning that Brawn's slip in development was highlighted more. Spyker were never up there in 2006 like Force India have been in 2009 for instance.

well how is it compariable?
No one could even touch Brawn in normal conditions till silverstone.

Quote from pik_d :

There are champions who win on equal footing: Lewis over Massa, probably Alonso over Schumacher (haven't watched that year), Aryton and Prost over... each other; there are champions who win simply because they are supremely dominant: Schumacher, Fangio; then there are drivers who win because they're in the right car at the right time and are just good enough to take advantage of that: Button, Hill, Villeneuve.

Button certainly deserved it the most out of anyone this season, that doesn't really make him a great champion though.

But at the end of the day, they are champions, end of. If you sit in your armchair discrediting people all day (like you seem to do) then you have no chance of winning the world championship, you have to get out there and race to win it. What I mean is, the F1 world championship does not come to you, you will never get it if you dont earn it.

Quote from el pibe :

FFS! Cut it off.


you say that jenson is the best driver in this god damn world just because he had a car with illegal parts at the start of the season.


then later on someone says that jenson is a worthy champion and that kimi and lewis are utter shit. now, gonna think like you guys did, and say that KIMI is a more worthy champion that Jenson AND Lewis just because HE DROVE HIS ARSE OFF FOR THE GOD DAMN WDC. he was 17 points behind with 2 races to go, and still managed to take it away from hamilton by 1 point. i wonder what jenson would have done if he was in the same situation that kimi was 2 years ago. i bet that he would whine about on the radio that some japanese rookie should let him thru since hes fighting for the WDC.


5haz, you can eat shit and die... and i mean it, with a passion

Go and cry to your mummy, shame, she probrably dosen't love you either.

I will die eventually, you may have to wait a while.

Quote from Mustafur :

well how is it compariable?
No one could even touch Brawn in normal conditions till silverstone.

Apart from one race in Germany the same, the exact same, went for that 06 Renault. Alonso would have won in Malaysia if his team hadn't screwed up in Qualifying, and in the end Fisichella won anyway, and then at Imola the Renault was quicker than the Ferrari but Schumacher won through totally out foxing Renault in the final round of stops. It's worth remembering too Alonso was on pole at the Nurburgring and only came 4s behind Schumacher who could only beat him in the pits.

According to the logic on this thread, Nigel Mansell must be the least deserving WDC ever, as the Williams in 92 was frequently 1.5 sec per lap faster than the opposition. it was so superior that Patrese could regularly beat Senna who was driving a McLaren.

It could be said that Nigel worked harder and deserved the championship more in '86 and '87 than in 92. In the '86 he often clearly outdrove double world champion Piquet in the same car, as well as Senna in a competetive Lotus and Prost/Rosberg in a not too shoddy if slightly outdated Mclaren.

In 87' he won more races than Piquet, then rotten luck intervened again.

If he is champion, that's because he deserved it, otherwise he wouldn't be. So stop talking shite please.

92 was a joke the car basically drove it self, ABS, Traction control the works.

Quote from CSF :

Apart from one race in Germany the same, the exact same, went for that 06 Renault. Alonso would have won in Malaysia if his team hadn't screwed up in Qualifying, and in the end Fisichella won anyway, and then at Imola the Renault was quicker than the Ferrari but Schumacher won through totally out foxing Renault in the final round of stops. It's worth remembering too Alonso was on pole at the Nurburgring and only came 4s behind Schumacher who could only beat him in the pits.

beating them in the pits happens now its just a general better team effort.

but see the Ferrari was still fast enough to win the race, nothing Redbull could do at the start of the season would even get them a fight with the Brawns, only race they really could of won was maybe Bahrain.

I think if Button had won six out of the last seven races, instead of the first seven, we wouldn't be having this discussion.