Regarding this subject, Its so sad to see people praising the developers....or bashing on the ones that complain......( and sad aint really the word i would use, perhaps something worst...)

Gain some prespective on the matter, and think!! What, in reallity, people are ranting about is FALSE EXPECTATIONS.

If scawen didnt said anything about S3, and state something like "ok guys, we finished S2, enjoy!!", or even something like " there will be no more content updates, only regular bug/small improvements updates from now on" , we , as costumers, would be ok with that. We payed for S2, and we got S2. No more, no less.

But the minute the devs annouce the scirocco and rockingham, and show us pictures of the content ALREADY CREATED, and say what they did say ( that they would only need to develop the tyres and release it ), we (again), as costumers, are left with this incredible news and expectations!!

Even if it takes one year, we get it, tyres and rubber are a tricky thing to understand, not at all linear! But then another year goes by, and another, and another, and so on.....Meanwhile, we have 0 feedback. Thats right, ZERO. I dont consider "we are still working on it", every once a year, feedback.....

The lack of news, and the ridiculous time that has passed makes us in every right to say whatever the hell we want! And how dare you to insult us!!!

If you lived on the streets, and i told you " Dude! i've built a home for you, its right there!! Just wait till i finish the wooden floors and you can move in any time soon!! and then you are left on the streets for 5 years more, wouldnt that piss you a little?? Especialy if the floors arnt even that important, it would be more important to have a roof over your head, and keep dry and warm through the winter.....or am i wrong??

So please, for the love of god, just try to understand the situation and stop droping the bombs on us. The devs not only disrespect us as clients, as they also inforced silence into the forum, closing threads that where not "positive", just like opression days of history.....

And even after 5 years of waiting , the devs think its more important to adapt the game to 3D gogles, then to release new content....its like they are just screwing with us and having a big laugh.....

I will not buy S3, on principle, because i have no respect for people like this....

And just a quick though, this one specialy directed to scawen : Who the hell cares if you are healthier now because you ride a bike or run or stoped smoking?? Would my design clients be happy if i told them " oh sir, im sorry i dont have your work ready, but i lost 5 pounds and i feel so much better now!!" . Have some respect.

Attackers and defenders of this topic express very different emotions, but they all share common feelings, a deep love for this game which gave us much pleasure for so many years, and a sentiment of sadness for what is happening now!...The saddest of all is that the community is prouder and more attached to lfs than its creators, so plz do recognise your deeply shared feelings and do not hate each others for choosing sides!

My 2 cents...

Quote from farcar :

This isn't a prison. You can leave any time you like (preferably right now).

Your argument is outdated and do not lead to any success, by that it's meaningless.

Scawen, Eric. Go get a coffee/tea/beer/water, some cookies and read this.

Quote from The Very End :

SOoo, let me get this straight, you call everyone that has a constructive negative veiw on the development a kid? That tells more about you than the user you aimed at. And "I AGERE" statements are so dull and borring that you can either 1: explain your opinion well, or "2: log off and go away you troll.

See what I did there? I called you a troll, the same as most of you calls us "whiners". What kind of sick enviroment has this forum become, where we canot express the opinions without getting nailed to the god damn Scirocco cross for the 8th deadly sin "DO NOT TALK CRAP ABOUT LFS" ?

It's not about money, value or what not - I both got the enjoyment, value, money and so on from LFS by far. For many years I have enjoyed the game, yes MANY, but as time moves on you veiw things differently, you grown up and you changes opinions and tastes.
Saying LFS is still "the best" out there is... it's mad men's talk. Now there are so many games that beats LFS to it socks in various areas, and others claiming something else is either in denial or just too stubborn to realize it.

I agree LFS offers, still today, a great allround package, good at every aspect but not great at any (in todays standards).
* Graphics - they are nice, but old
* Multiplayer code - they are still pretty damn good, but it's not the best thing around
* Interface, looks, astetics, designs and so on - it's really falling behind here, compared to other games
* Development - close to none
* Dialoge between users / developers - catastrophal

So as said before, the game is good, but very much outdated. It's too starting to coming to surface that the devs really are feed up by much of it's community, and therfor treats 'em like that too (feed up).

I'm happily taking an disccussion any day about these things, with people who are worth it. Hoshimodo you got a free cookie, you made me tip just over the edge with your god damn "I agree, u suck" type of comment, and made me ramble on about what I think about LFS these days. Maybe it was a little uncalled for and maybe it was unfair that this ragemonster whent full retard mode on you (for that I'm sorry :/ )

Fact is, either the devs can start treating the community they have nice, or they can simply - as most of it's user base, disapear.
What had LFS been without the community which made things like Highres textures when the devs could not be arsed to do it themself? What would LFS be without advanced insim and tracking systems (do I need to mention CTRA?) made by the community? What would LFS be without the organized races and leagues by the community?
It would be something, sure, but I doubt it would have reached anywear near the status it got thanks to the community. Where the devs failed the community pulled through and made it live long, sadly it canot continue like it. Show us the propper respect and start talking about the god damn things you do Scawen, Eric and Victor. Don't say crap like "things we work on", "the wheeels are round" , do actions. Show us and talk with us.

Edit: And the actions done instead of complaining (refering to adults taking actions)? Moved on, as most users did. But the child inside me still hopes for an update, therfor I keep coming back to this forum to have a discussion, chat or whatnot with the community that once were a great bunch of nice people. The community today is but a shadow of it's former self. It got mistreaten from the inside, and got left in the dark by the devs.

Quote from JBiturbo :

Regarding this subject, Its so sad to see people praising the developers....or bashing on the ones that complain......( and sad aint really the word i would use, perhaps something worst...)

Gain some prespective on the matter, and think!! What, in reallity, people are ranting about is FALSE EXPECTATIONS.

If scawen didnt said anything about S3, and state something like "ok guys, we finished S2, enjoy!!", or even something like " there will be no more content updates, only regular bug/small improvements updates from now on" , we , as costumers, would be ok with that. We payed for S2, and we got S2. No more, no less.

But the minute the devs annouce the scirocco and rockingham, and show us pictures of the content ALREADY CREATED, and say what they did say ( that they would only need to develop the tyres and release it ), we (again), as costumers, are left with this incredible news and expectations!!

Even if it takes one year, we get it, tyres and rubber are a tricky thing to understand, not at all linear! But then another year goes by, and another, and another, and so on.....Meanwhile, we have 0 feedback. Thats right, ZERO. I dont consider "we are still working on it", every once a year, feedback.....

The lack of news, and the ridiculous time that has passed makes us in every right to say whatever the hell we want! And how dare you to insult us!!!

If you lived on the streets, and i told you " Dude! i've built a home for you, its right there!! Just wait till i finish the wooden floors and you can move in any time soon!! and then you are left on the streets for 5 years more, wouldnt that piss you a little?? Especialy if the floors arnt even that important, it would be more important to have a roof over your head, and keep dry and warm through the winter.....or am i wrong??

So please, for the love of god, just try to understand the situation and stop droping the bombs on us. The devs not only disrespect us as clients, as they also inforced silence into the forum, closing threads that where not "positive", just like opression days of history.....

And even after 5 years of waiting , the devs think its more important to adapt the game to 3D gogles, then to release new content....its like they are just screwing with us and having a big laugh.....

I will not buy S3, on principle, because i have no respect for people like this....

And just a quick though, this one specialy directed to scawen : Who the hell cares if you are healthier now because you ride a bike or run or stoped smoking?? Would my design clients be happy if i told them " oh sir, im sorry i dont have your work ready, but i lost 5 pounds and i feel so much better now!!" . Have some respect.

Hope you (Scawen and Eric) have a good year and lots of fun! ; ) We are moving to Assetto Corsa !

That's right Framaris.

I just read the thread a bit and i'm quite amazed how people react. Imo totally unnecessary to insult.

If unsatisfied... what's the big issue to leave and move on with AC for instance? Although I can understand new developments are taking quite some time which people might not like.. ( Including myself!) there must be still something attractive otherwise all the 'bashers' would have been gone already I assume?

I'd say there are not much alternatives that offer such a package as LFS does when including aspects as physics, community, multiplayer etc., which is why probably those people still hang around. This means using a product with an amazingly good price/value ratio which only had to be paid once and for many many here a very long time ago, compare this to Iracing?

Quote :

Originally Posted by seniecka
You making fools of yourself believing in nothing and acting such awesome, judicial dudes. Don't pretend you are gonna wait as long as you need. No need to draw yourself as a hero. You are not unique. We all are wait along with you, and no matter if we do like it, or not. And those, who are not afraid to express frustration about being unhappy as far they has been waiting already for 5 year for some kind of update - win. We are not a band of sheeps. The opinion should be stated about all this circus.

This is a perfect case in point. It is nice you have your opinion, but it is less nice that you do not really acknowledge the people who are still enjoying themselves with LFS and telling them to be fools. To show you what probably your 'frustration' has done to your thinking capabilities.. I am not really waiting for any update, I'd prefer them to come, but IN MY OPINION, LFS offers me something unique whether it is 5 or more years old I could not be arsed. So I do not feel the need to express any frustration.. could you perceive it as possible?

About the expectations for S3 or Rockingham etc.. I could very much understand when they are originated by Scawen, and there is no further communication possible, people would be upset about that. Not that I think they have the right to bash around.. but I can fully understand as it's a obvious reaction.

So in the end..

Quote :

Originally Posted by dawesdust_12
It'll never cease to amaze me the children who seem to think that Scawen (et all) are slaves to us because we purchased a software licence.

+2

I can't see the benefits of continuously bashing LFS and/or its developers. As stated above, accept it and perhaps drive two games or leave and let the ones who still enjoy themselves very much with LFS enjoy themselves. For the question I feel coming up.. why would people still care about LFS? When speaking about myself; I think the physics are unmatched and this aspect is by far the most important one to me.. I dont care about graphics for instance because it is simply not really important to me when I want to play a simulator.

When did people start to believe bashing, whining, shouting and complaining about a project would make a lead designer motivated to speed-up the implementation of further improvements?

Are the times of positive feedback and encouragement over? Where did the respect, forethought and gratitude go (towards other human beings)? Is it really necessary to communicate with a groundbreaking development group this way?

Do you think it will get their attention, but most important, do you think it will inspire them to go on? Is it really that hard to be polite and grateful on the internet? Have you tried writing a comment that is constructive, and at the same time, carries a polite tone resembling gratitude?

If you were a project leader for a successful product for over 10 years, what would you rather hear from your clients regarding the future:
a) "You s**k, because we want more and we havn't got it", or
b) "keep up the good work?" (point out the already present awesome features and suggest how new planned features can make it even better...)

I know, we all want the same thing; for LFS to progress, but it can be expressed in a way that will not totally ruin the motivation of its creators.

AC looks and feels promising indeed, so let's hope that platform will encourage Scawier to take on the challenge to elevate LFS even further. There's certainly a good potential in LFS, still. As a client I will simply enjoy both.

Quote from OTone :

We are moving to Assetto Corsa !

If an unfinished offline simulator is something you're looking for,have fun!

Quote from Ingolf :

When did people start to believe bashing, whining, shouting and complaining about a project would make a lead designer motivated to speed-up the implementation of further improvements?

Are the times of positive feedback and encouragement over? Where did the respect, forethought and gratitude go (towards other human beings)? Is it really necessary to communicate with a groundbreaking development group this way?

Do you think it will get their attention, but most important, do you think it will inspire them to go on? Is it really that hard to be polite and grateful on the internet? Have you tried writing a comment that is constructive, and at the same time, carries a polite tone resembling gratitude?

If you were a project leader for a successful product for over 10 years, what would you rather hear from your clients regarding the future:
a) "You s**k, because we want more and we havn't got it", or
b) "keep up the good work?" (point out the already present awesome features and suggest how new planned features can make it even better...)

I know, we all want the same thing; for LFS to progress, but it can be expressed in a way that will not totally ruin the motivation of its creators.

AC looks and feels promising indeed, so let's hope that platform will encourage Scawier to take on the challenge to elevate LFS even further. There's certainly a good potential in LFS, still. As a client I will simply enjoy both.

Quote from Eclipsed :

If an unfinished offline simulator is something you're looking for,have fun!

At least they are making a big effort now for making exclusive content. Multiplayer will arrive. SOON.

But that's not the point of this topic.

If Scawen promised us content and tyre physics in a "NEAR" future ofc we wouldn't believe that "near" would take like 4 or 5 years.

I would love to keep play LFS as far as league racing is concerned. But sadly LFS's devs aren't keeping up with the new comers. "Simple" things like day-night system would revive LFS massively.
Instead of making patches for 3D why not doing stuff 90%+ people actually want here? I suppose they didn't made LFS just for themselves otherwise they wouldn't release it. LFS is here, has a (still) quite good amount of people still playing it.
We have a right to state our opinions about their way of doing things, don't we?

yeah the devs must really regret the way the announcement of scirocco + rockingham failed to deliver when they expected.

+1 to the complainers on that one.

but did you think? the next step for LFS has to be a big one. a decade of development could be ok. i think people who say 5 years is too long don't accept why LFS is so much better than other projects, it's because the devs stick to their vision and their method of development. it's because the result when it does arrive doesn't have big holes in performance. it's because it's sexy

if you want to go wheel to wheel with someone and really feel them bump against you at the limit and just save it with a wheel on the grass, LFS is there for you right now.

Quote from OTone :

"Simple" things like day-night system would revive LFS massively.

you're right day/night would be awesome in LFS. i disagree that it's simple, and not because it couldn't be done simply, but because LFS devs wouldn't accept the quality of realtime lighting that you would get from a simple solution, and maybe they aren't convinced the average graphics card they are targeting can handle it yet.

it's a matter of perspective and like it or not i think the devs are very happy with the result so far, and hopefully will keep going exactly like they have. day/night in LFS would be awesome because it would simply be above and beyond day/night in another sim.

In simple words - don't take everything written here as "promissed",don't have great expectations and you won't have great dissapointment. Just enjoy what you have,you have bought a software which is as good as you can make out of it. If it's not enough - have fun with the offline other one!

Yes,it's sad to see LFS not evolving into something it has potential to be. It's sad to see much racers leaving,as it's not cool to race in LFS anymore (richer guys are iPaying,others now are on hype with Ferraris n'stuff). But as it's often discussed - you can moan,cry,threat or do whatever you do here - you cannot influence anything what devs do. Just a waste of energy and internet bytes. Peace!

umm, day-night ...

We have wind (which is actually very good implemented), but does anyone actually use it other than cruise/crash servers
We have different kind of weathers (sky texture and lightning), but does anyone actually use something else than clear day
We also have option to force cockpit view, but does anyone actually use it

by same logic I conclude no one will use night, simply because its "harder"

Quote from DANIEL-CRO :

umm, day-night ...

We have wind (which is actually very good implemented), but does anyone actually use it other than cruise/crash servers
We have different kind of weathers (sky texture and lightning), but does anyone actually use something else than clear day
We also have option to force cockpit view, but does anyone actually use it

by same logic I conclude no one will use night, simply because its "harder"

If you're talking about public servers, then yes, there are very few servers with wind and/or other weather on other than default. In leagues & other events, there is usually more variety when it comes to weather, or even wind.

Like Marco Massarutto said: "everyone wants to race a 24 hour race, driving at night, under heavy rain, with broken suspension and a puncture. But just one time for a try"...
Yes, a more dynamic racing environment would be nice (diurnal cycle, atmospheric changes, etc)

Day and Night would for me also be a nice addition. If it's not like GTR2 when day literally jumps into night..

Ric, first I shared your thought completely about 3d and oculus rift. I have now tried it with a bloody basic Rollercoaster 'game' more like a demo to show and a hangglider game. I now know the system costs 300 Dollar and to be honest I'd buy it instantly when i could play LFS with it.. I found it more than amazing! When the rollercoaster went down.. I felt like i would fall down your body somehow produces the same feeling like in a true rollercoaster.. 3d with oculus rift... would absolutely be amazing to me..

Still im not trying to say that there aren't other aspect which might/should have priority...

Quote from Framaris :

The saddest of all is that the community is prouder and more attached to lfs than its creators...

Just lol

Quote from MrSam :

Just lol

Explain why you just "lol", instead of writing like a imbecile.

Alltho both you and me know what he means, and I somewhat agrees with Frammaris. The community is the one that actually has done a proofable (is that even a word?) amount of work these last years. Other than that we only have been told things are according to plan.

And to the guy above that asked me what I would do with other projects and things outside the computer when things do not go according to my wishes? I complain, then I do something else. It's not like I go armageddon on the big bad corporations because I disagree with them, but I raise my voice. The same as I do around here. I express my veiws and belifs, which some may look like spam while other finds matters to discuss with me on.

I don't claim my belifs to be superior or even smart, I just explains what I think about something. If you look upon it as spam because someone else has said something before, so be it. If we should not speak about things that has been spoken about before, then we could not speak at all.

I'm imbecile if you want, but that customers are more proud than creator for LFS :
tell me who is the real imbecile ..

I was aiming at your totall ability to write something of value. Frammaris have a point, and if you cannot be bottered to take 5 minutes to write a propper respons to why you disagree with him then don't write at all.

@TVE: plz keep the insults for yourself!

@Sam: Un minimum de respect stp, je n'est plus douze ans et je ne t'es pas insulté que je sache...donc je ne vois pas pourquoi tu décide de m'attaquer comme sa? si tu as un différent avec quelqu'un, il y a des moyens plus mature de réagir!


A bon entendeur, salut!

LFS is the best simulation games that you can find.

I agree on the fact that LFS is abandonned, and we deserve to have some info on the game progress

But that the community is more proud than the createur is just fun for me.

How many programer for GTA 5 and after how long?
then yes LFS is very slow for the development, but their creators are proudest. Because the merit is their

@Framaris : je ne t'ai pas insulté, c'est un de tes gars qui m'a insulté le premier. je me defends c'est tout.
Mais dans le font je ne suis pas d'accord du tout avec toi.
Tu te rends compte de ce que tu dis, que les createur sont moins fiere que nous?

Je crois qu'on peut etre en colere sur le jeu car il meurt à petit feu.
Mais on n'enlevera jamais le mérite au createur de LFS qui sont je pense les plus fieres.

Moi aussi je n'ai pas 12 ans, alors comprends que si on m'insulte je reponds.

Le problème c'est que tu lui répond en m'insultant moi, et mon opinion n'engage que moi.

Je comprend and respect ton opinion, j'ai fait partis de se groupe pendant des années, malheureusement j'ai perdu mes illusions. Ceci dis je ne suis pas du genre a dire des choses négatives sur LFS (que j'aime trop pour sa), donc je n'expliquerais pas les détails de mon opinion en public, mais je t'assure qu'elle est bien fondée.

Je m'excuse pour ça, c'est presque sortie tout seul à cause de ton gars.
Je suis comme toi, déçu de voir que LFS est en fin de vie.
Et que nous attendons toujours après la S3.

Mais honnêtement, je préfère attendre et avoir quelque chose de bien, que être pressé et être déçu. Même si on attend beaucoup.

il faut aussi ne pas oublié qu'il ne sont pas 30 derrières le jeu.
Mais meme si l'aventure s'arrete ici, on pourra toujours dire qu'il ont fait un super jeu. Et c'est là que je ne suis pas d'accord avec toi, car ils peuvent être fière de ce qu'ils ont fait.

J'ai essayé beaucoup de jeu, et je n'ai jamais retrouvé les sensations que LFS me procure.
C'est vrai qu'il devient un peu vieux maintenant. et je suis comme vous impatient d'avoir la S3.

Mais ce n'est pas en les attaquants, qu'on aura plus d'infos.

Quote from PioneerLv :

Your argument is outdated and do not lead to any success, by that it's meaningless.

Outdated how? By that, you're inferring that this forum once was a prison, and that people could not leave when they wanted.