Sorry for posting it but I thought it would be better to give a link than order to go to kunos b side forum and checking threads started by username called mussolini, that way probably most of readers wouldn't even care to go there and see it. I'm not sure but I think that link was already posted in this thread. Anyway you deleted it now so probably no harm happened...
I know but I haven't seen here rFactor, netKar or other fans posting LFS cracks or trolling. I'm a LFS fanboy myself too but I don't go to rscnet rFactor/netKar/whatever sim game sections just to do internet trolling without real arguments or opinions like Kid did and has done before too.
Also... ever happen to notice the speed gauge? It is going in negatives when the car is slowing down from the full lock. Basically it goes from 150, to 0 while still moving, and then shows -7 or something. :zombie: I think the physics in NkPro are reacting to a '90' degree force which slows the car down at incredible rates. So if you think about it, this is the way the car stay so stable if it slides. Ehmmm?
I am sorry, but I think more effort was put into their excellent cockpits and tracks, but physics are in need of help :doh:
Looks to be... Man he is deeply sorry to have these problems, must feel really bad from what he read on the forums
He says the physics problems are 'no-brainers' to fix... ehh I would think it would be a 'no-brainer' to spot such huge physics problems :doh: To me, it seems like this release was really REALLY pressured and released without a sense of completion from kunos... Just read his overall tone in that thread, and then this quote:
I just don't know how you go and release a game in that state, and expect people to say "wow great game". Hopefully he improves soon enough, and if he can fix all these problems like he says, then good for him. :up:
Says the FPS issues online have been worked on, but it is an "improvement", not a "fix". :o
I guess with the exploits being posted and his time being wasted on fixing the licensing bug, it's probably a good decision.
I've been enjoying nKP offline. Yes it's buggy, but it will improve. If Kunos can spend time on improving multiplayer fps and stability, then I'm happy enough with offline being free. I paid because I wanted to race people online, and was very disapointed with the muliplayer side (lets face it, it's total shit at the moment) so this post from Kunos has been the best news since the release.
For the meantime LFS will keep providing the online racing (it's smoothness is almost surprising after suffering a few hours of nKP online) but the cockpits and dashboards have never looked so in need of updates as they do now. rFactor's terrible cockpits/dashboards made LFS seem great, but I think nKP has moved my expectations. Shame the online experience didn't do the same....
That quote got my attention too... it just seems like there were no beta testing at all or then they had very weird testing methods. Like the FF slider setting that doesn't work, how you can not notice that? Just one example...
The overall quality in the release (expect the physics) is way below than in any other (commerial) game I've played for a long time. I was very disappointed because I thought Kunos had similar dedication to his game than Scawen has. Sad. I think Kunos is just collecting sympathy with those progress reports, of course he says he's going to fix "everything" but I'm not hoping for too much... I don't think he'll simply "fix" the whole multiplayer side in 1-2 weeks. It needs much more time.
Good lord this thread and forum have gotten out of hand. I think so many people are so attached to LFS that they will beat the tar out of anything that is or has the possibility to become a threat! Come on people, at least realize that competition makes for better sims for all of us. NetKar is buggy at the moment and it can be said that it should not have been released in such a form, but like many, I see the potential, and I have been having my fun with it. I guess I just don't see the point of tearing this game to shreds when it's just another driving sim that can be enjoyed. Afterall, isn't the act of driving and racing what we all like to do?....then JUST DRIVE!
PS: I realize the frustrations with paying for a product that you thought would be vastly different. But on the bright side, Kunos is being very supportive and understanding. The game will be patched and tweaked in the coming weeks and months. But let this be a lesson. If there is a demo, always try before you buy!
I'm really NOT familiar with nKP. I haven't bought it, and I've seen one brief video (from late on in this thread), and apart from the expressions of those people that pre-ordered it, that's it. Is nKP released as a full product or an alpha, or a beta? I got the impression it was released as a full product, but didn't actually deliver in this form.
To say Kunos is being very supportive strikes me as an odd thing to say. The guy has your money. For shame, he should be supportive. And as for understanding.. that is, I rather think, in the hands and minds of the people who have paid for a full, beta-tested product.. and have not received.
From what I've heard, I should bloody well think so. Oh for shame!
Was this an option? I heard it wasn't. Moreover, I rather got the impression that the authors of nKP sang up their impending release, encouraging on a large scale the idea of pre-ordering an extraordinarily complete and fabulous new racing sim. They were accepting pre-orders for nKP's April 10th release up until at least a few days before the actual release. My gut tells me that, if what I understand is true, those who invested in this product in advance based on the promises and assurances of the nKP developers have effectively, and in the short term, been "had". Until such a time as the nKP product is everything it was promised it would be, those who pre-ordered will remain "had". That could be a long, long time.
If my understanding of the circumstances surrounding the release of this sim is wrong, then I apologise for my derisive view. As I said, I can only go by what I've learned very recently. All of which is 2nd hand at best.
Yeah, Kunos said he doesn't want to make money... yet there is/was no benefit of preordering really at all, right? I mean, I never understood the reasoning why the preorder price was cheaper, other than to increase potential buyers. The slightly lower price for preordering is DEFINITELY a move to gain more sales, what else could it be...
I understand his approach though... saying he would prefer people to be happy with what they bought and not be just a jackpot for himself. But come on, the hard work spent on things, you expect a reimbursement for your hard work... especially for such a big project as a simulation.
I haven't an issue with getting a financial return on your invested hours. Nobody should be pressured to work for free. To me the issue is paying for 50 acres and receiving 10. A friend of mine was fooled into buying realty in upstate NY that didn't exist. The one word that seemed to stick, after the fact, was "sucker". An ONLINE demo (coincidentally like LFS's) would definitely have reduced the risk of nKP and sucker being synonymous.
This is ALL separate from whether nKP drives well or not. I know some people are really enjoying it. I'm glad that all is not lost. But the level of development at time of release.. this doesn't sound too good.
What pissed me off quite a bit was the Guys at AutoSS Magazine were blowing sunshine up this sims ass, only to find upon release that it's an alpha with its main selling point (Online racing) knackered.
When I'm driving the cars in nKp they actually feel quite good, it's just the whole interface and mulitplayer element is so offputting that I just think, sod this. The sound is a bit hit and miss, I can see what he's trying to do and it works to an extent. I got the same reaction to the sound in LFS at first but it grew on me and is actually quite functional.
The sim has potential and the best thing Kunos could do right now is release the Dev kit for free and let people actually get this sim up to a decent level. I know a lot of people are opposed to user made tracks and cars a la rFactor but I don't really see 4 cars and 4 tracks (The 4 tracks actually justy feel like a variation of 1 to me) holding peoples attention for long, especially when the sim is in the state it's in.
As it stands the sim doesn' thave enough gravity to draw me towards it let alone away from LFS and GTL. I'll give it another go once it's been patched as it just feels half assed at the moment.
Maybe Kid was the main betatester - he got sent a beta version and replied back a few minutes later saying "yeah, it's brilliant, not a bug in sight".
In a way I'm quite enjoying netKar. When you're driving around not making big mistakes and dialling in a setup it's quite good fun, and in that respect reasonably realistic. It's only when you spin or brake too hard (and apparently lock up though I'm convinced I haven't yet) that the poor physics become an issue. Sure it's a bit too easy to jump on the throttle, and sometimes it just decides your due for a spin without any real provocation, but other times you spin because you deserve it.
It's also an added challenge - learning a new sim, a new feel, a new way of doing things. For sure LFS can learn something from it, if only what not to do, and how far to take realism before the fun factor becomes impeded by certain things. At the moment it's totally bashable - Kunos should be, and is, totally ashamed of his product.
As for ASS, they to should be ashamed of themselves. They always big something up with absolutely scant regard for problems, lack of realism, bugs, or anything negative. LFS doesn't feature much in ASS, and actually I think thats a good thing. I'll read ASS to see what the sim-racing world is up to, just like I check BHMS every so often, but I'm not going to believe anything they say from now on - rF and nK lies have taught me that.
Sounds like the physics are extremly random, sometimes you spin just because it pleases the program and sometimes you spin because you deserve it.
Btw what became of this LFS section they wanted to make. Few weeks after they started this thread here in the forum no new information was released about that?
I expressed my interest in writing for them at the time, although I made it clear that I didn't know what sort of thing they were after etc and would need tips, and the reply was that they had had a lot of interest in writing for the LFS section and they would get back to us. Since then I've heard nothing more.
Even if I had something to write, I'm not sure if I would now. I don't think I possess the ability to write as biasedly and shortsightedly as the other ASS writers.
Well you've got to see it from their point of view, you can't have a magazine about the sim-racing community which slates every game going can you? I mean, how's that for killing your own audience?
Lol, no. No need for slating, just a simple realisation that NO sim yet is perfect. ALL of them have flaws in different areas. All it would take is the odd sentence in the nK preview saying "it's quite buggy at the moment, but the number of massive bugs is decreased daily. It also took a while to make the sounds work properly, but even then they had static in them. Can see the potential in this area, but it's not quite there yet."
Nothing major. Not ripping every sim to shreds, but not making every sim/game seem like the best thing since sliced bread. A real life review, warts and all.
But seriously, I do see your point. If I was promised a great product, and gave them enough benefit of the doubt that because they were taking pre-orders, that the game was up to par, I would be upset too! But what's done is done, and Kunos is refunding money all over the place (apparently), which is a good start to correcting the team's mistakes; although the situation is sort of unforgivable. And yes, you can try before you buy, because that's what I'm doing.
Hmm. Just a thought. Would people be interested to redo the "LFS community gives nkpro a go" thing? I don't know if there was people racing last time but now that at least some of the showstopper problems are solved, we could try again?
One chance would be this weekend but I think it would be better to wait until monday to get the patch released and installed. (if it is released)
So what about next tuesday evening, anyone interested? I have no info about server but maybe fel could help us?
(So let's hope the LFS patch isn't released by then )
Just one example...
I just lav it!