Don't you get this huge feeling like there just wasting there money for no reason, i mean you can't really enjoy your self if your spending $500 million a year and your still waiting for your first race win.

If they were as smart as they are when it comes to selling cars they would abondon their formula one team and give factory backing to Williams a team that knows how to win with the right funding(as proven with Renault,BMW etc).

Quote from Mustafur :

Don't you get this huge feeling like there just wasting there money for no reason, i mean you can't really enjoy your self if your spending $500 million a year and your still waiting for your first race win.

If they were as smart as they are when it comes to selling cars they would abondon their formula one team and give factory backing to Williams a team that knows how to win with the right funding(as proven with Renault,BMW etc).

It's doing their PR quite good though, at least a survey last year show that is the case.

and with Williams winning.......well not in a short time imo, now engines are pretty much equal they are still not doing so good. the team lacked some real spark and a top line of drivers.

Yeah, it sucks to be pouring money down the toilet without wins, but it seems to me they're in F1 more for marketing/advertisement than for winning. Even if you don't win, you still get a lot of attention just because you participate in F1, and I think that's why they haven't jumped ship yet. Call them attention whores if you like. Soon they'll be quoting themselves in their own signatures, as per JJ

Toyota are in f1 because toyota are dull bland auto white good. so they want to liven up their image....

Quote from vrooom :

Toyota are in f1 because toyota are dull bland auto white good. so they want to liven up their image....

Funny that their participation in F1 has coincided with the end of production of all (well all 3 that I can think of) of their slightly sporting models. I doubt they've ever had such a dull and uninspiring model line up (at least in the UK).

Quote from sinbad :

Funny that their participation in F1 has coincided with the end of production of all (well all 3 that I can think of) of their slightly sporting models. I doubt they've ever had such a dull and uninspiring model line up (at least in the UK).

The Yaris is an insance care man what u on about?

Quote from Intrepid :

The Yaris is an insance care man what u on about?

lol what are you on about?

that thing isn't remotely exciting.

Quote from sinbad :

Funny that their participation in F1 has coincided with the end of production of all (well all 3 that I can think of) of their slightly sporting models. I doubt they've ever had such a dull and uninspiring model line up (at least in the UK).

So true, i miss the mid 90's
Boring cars are everywhere now, whatever happened to a sports car for the masses, something most ppl can at least ASPIRE to own, even if they can't quite buy it now.

Quote from senn :

So true, i miss the mid 90's
Boring cars are everywhere now, whatever happened to a sports car for the masses, something most ppl can at least ASPIRE to own, even if they can't quite buy it now.

i agree
in the 90's there was the skyline, the nsx, the supra ect...
but now there is only the nissan gt-r

Quote from senn :

So true, i miss the mid 90's
Boring cars are everywhere now, whatever happened to a sports car for the masses, something most ppl can at least ASPIRE to own, even if they can't quite buy it now.

Quote from Alistair :

i agree
in the 90's there was the skyline, the nsx, the supra ect...
but now there is only the nissan gt-r

the most people cant afford a GT-R

Quote from senn :

So true, i miss the mid 90's
Boring cars are everywhere now, whatever happened to a sports car for the masses, something most ppl can at least ASPIRE to own, even if they can't quite buy it now.

you can get them now, just have to accept they have gone through N amount of owners and generally abused to the bone.

Well, atm Toyota developes the Coupe with Subaru, RWD flat4 sportscar ("new Hachiroku"), Lexus has its ISF and LFA, Honda does the new NSX, Hyundai makes their first RWD Coupe, Mitsubishi has its Evo (but I'd call it a rally, not a real sportscar), MAzda has its MPS modells and the RX (and a new 3rotor in the oven), and a lot of other (europian) companies advertise something affordable and fast too (OPC modells, Passat CC, Audis RS3 and TT RS)

And back in the 90s, not everyone could afford a GTR or Supra when it was new

Quote from vrooom :

Toyota are in f1 because toyota are dull bland auto white good. so they want to liven up their image....

So you call this kind of motorsport pedigree "dull?"
or is it just the road cars you dont like?

Toyota WRC
Toyota GT1
Toyota BTCC

& there are probably more.

Quote from sinbad :

Funny that their participation in F1 has coincided with the end of production of all (well all 3 that I can think of) of their slightly sporting models. I doubt they've ever had such a dull and uninspiring model line up (at least in the UK).

Honda too, both companies haven't made a decent car for a decade or so. Despite spending gazillions on the pinnacle of motor sport, they are both only producing ugly girl's cars, ugly 4WDs and ugly people movers.

I still think Toyota have done alright in F1, it's a tough arena to stand out in.

Quote from Gunn :

Honda too, both companies haven't made a decent car for a decade or so. Despite spending gazillions on the pinnacle of motor sport, they are both only producing ugly girl's cars, ugly 4WDs and ugly people movers.

I still think Toyota have done alright in F1, it's a tough arena to stand out in.

If by made you mean introduced then not counting the NSX facelift in '02(?) I probably agree with you, although there may be one or two which creep into that time-frame that I consider "decent", but I agree in general about Honda.

It's nowhere near the Toyota level of abstinence from sporty car building but there is definitely a similar trend. The S2000 is a great car, but I believe it will be canned after '09 with no replacement planned. The NSX was a great car but they only ever threaten to replace it and don't appear to actually want to, particularly given the current economic climate.
The latest Civic type R is a bit of a sign that they're only doing because it's expected of them, and they're not exactly committed to it.

I think with Honda and Toyota they need to target a particular market. In todays climate trying to target "Everyone" just doesn't cut it anymore. If you don't specialize in something, you're disposable. Like Woolworths, (yes I know everyone pipes on about them) they appealed to no one. They had no niche market, no speciality. All of their competitors beat them in every aspect of their company.

If Honda & Toyota decided, right, this isn't working. Let's decide upon a direction, and an audience to sell to. Then we might have a hope in hell of working through this rough patch.

Inflexibility is the motor industry's ailment.

Quote from anttt69 :

So you call this kind of motorsport pedigree "dull?"
or is it just the road cars you dont like?

Toyota WRC
Toyota GT1
Toyota BTCC

& there are probably more.

yes but all those are from the 90's
the btcc was i thing 93'
the wrc cars stoped in about 97' and the gt1 wa 98'-99'
see so toyota have not made any interesting cars since 99'