Quote from Shotglass :

ive been using dos and windows ever since we had the 386 at home and since 2k came out i dont see anything wrong with it... especially nothing wrong enough to make me pay twice as much for an os which isnt any better and was made with being pretty in mind rather than useability

I disagree with that. I like the Mac OS UI, it's clever and straightforward, it doesn't get in the way, the search tool and smart folders work well, the backup mechanism is smart - everything's just so much more cohesive and considered than it is Windows.

Windows also still has fundamental problems like the cruft-ridden registry, a complete reliance on the old hierarchical file/folder thing, after a few years those little gripes get really frustrating.

I don't know if a few years of Mac OS will leave me equally frustrated, maybe so, but in the meantime it will be a breath of fresh air.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

I disagree with that. I like the Mac OS UI, it's clever and straightforward, it doesn't get in the way, the search tool and smart folders work well, the backup mechanism is smart - everything's just so much more cohesive and considered than it is Windows.

Windows also still has fundamental problems like the cruft-ridden registry, a complete reliance on the old hierarchical file/folder thing, after a few years those little gripes get really frustrating.

I don't know if a few years of Mac OS will leave me equally frustrated, maybe so, but in the meantime it will be a breath of fresh air.

It hasn't left me frustrated, if anything I like it more and more every day.

Sorry Thunderhead, I forgot my sarcasm smilie

I take it you can't buy Mac OS X and install it on a "normal pc"?

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Windows also still has fundamental problems like the cruft-ridden registry

agreed on that

Quote :

a complete reliance on the old hierarchical file/folder thing

huh? macos is bsd which is even deeper entrenched in the whole file/folder thing... heck even nothingness and your cdrom are a file in a hierarchical folder structure

Quote :

I don't know if a few years of Mac OS will leave me equally frustrated, maybe so, but in the meantime it will be a breath of fresh air.

tbh my experience with macs is a while back but the only good thing i remember about macos 8 was that the pc turned itself off within milliseconds

Quote from mclarenmatt :

I take it you can't buy Mac OS X and install it on a "normal pc"?

you can but itll take a bit of fiddling and if you decide to go with the eula (which is worth less than the paper you print it on in europe anyway) youll have to put a semi eaten apple on your pc at all times which gets a bit ugly once it starts to decompose

Quote from Shotglass :

huh? macos is bsd which is even deeper entrenched in the whole file/folder thing... heck even nothingness and your cdrom are a file in a hierarchical folder structure

Well, yes of course, but you don't have to treat the filesystem as a huge tree if you don't want to, because your files indexed in a db and the Spotlight-centred UI's very clever.

When those features were originally touted for 'Longhorn' I thought it was a great idea, but of course it got dropped like all the other interesting stuff. I've tried a couple of Windows integrated search tools and they are still way behind Apple.

I also like the way Apple's desktop works. I think it shows Windows up for being the cluttered, rigid, sloppy mess it is. Also - looking at some of the info that came out during the Windows source code leak I don't think Windows will ever have a cat in hell's chance of getting out of the '90s due to all the backwards compatibility issues.

Anyway I'm not into evangelising about operating systems - if Windows works for you then great, you saved some money. I have to spend a LOT of time with a computer so I'm happy to pay a bit more to get a better product.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Well, yes of course, but you don't have to treat the filesystem as a huge tree if you don't want to, because your files indexed in a db and the Spotlight-centred UI's very clever.

When those features were originally touted for 'Longhorn' I thought it was a great idea, but of course it got dropped like all the other interesting stuff. I've tried a couple of Windows integrated search tools and they are still way behind Apple.

i guess theres a pretty fundamental difference of how we like to use our pc
personally id rather not have my drives filled up with backups and search dbs and all that other clutter
but if you like these sort of things maybe windows 7 is for you

Quote :

Anyway I'm not into evangelising about operating systems

oh yes absollutely id just like to try to get the rationale behind paying twice as much

for me macos never got beyond being a nice hobby to get it running on machines it wasnt built for

Quote from Shotglass :

oh yes absollutely id just like to try to get the rationale behind paying twice as much

For Kev specifically it's just a delayed post-traumatic reaction and trying to maintain a balanced consumer-karma.

ah yes that happens more often than you may think to those who dare to talk to germans

I am aware that Apple's hardware prices are totally shocking, which is why I've never bought one before, but I think I'm willing to consider it paying for the OS.

Quote from Shotglass :

ah yes that happens more often than you may think to those who dare to talk to germans

Interesting - it used to be something that happened to the ones who declined to talk. Amusingly enough there appears to have been another American computer company lurking in the background of that period as well.

How much "fiddling" would it take to get OS X to work on a "normal pc" then?

£83 isn't bad at all imho, might be worth getting for video and photo editing.

depends on your hardware
if you use an intel with the exact same components as in any of the macs on the market... very little
if you use an amd youd better be pretty handy and willing to accept a lot of hoops youll have to jump through

Quote from mclarenmatt :

How much "fiddling" would it take to get OS X to work on a "normal pc" then?

£83 isn't bad at all imho, might be worth getting for video and photo editing.

You won't be using a legit copy anyway, so scrap the cost. I guess unless you feel like patching an original, which could work. Too much effort though really.

you dont need to patch anything
all you need is an efi partition on your boot drive with all the drivers in it

Popping a vanilla disk into most PCs won't work.

Sod it im never going OS X then :P

Not willing to pay Apple's price's.

Yeah the hardware costs are a joke, and of course you end up with a computer that makes you look like a cock, but y'know, its just a computer.

I look like enough of a cock most of the time that the addition of a cockish computer won't make a great deal of difference.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

When you've put up with Windows for 15 years, Mac OS almost wins my the simple virtue of not being Windows.

Quote from pb32000 :

I exclusively use OS X now, won't be going back to Windows anytime soon. But it's not only the OS, it's the complete package. It's being able to sit in a coffee shop looking trendy. You don't get THAT with a Dell.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

I disagree with that. I like the Mac OS UI, it's clever and straightforward, it doesn't get in the way, the search tool and smart folders work well, the backup mechanism is smart - everything's just so much more cohesive and considered than it is Windows.

Windows also still has fundamental problems like the cruft-ridden registry, a complete reliance on the old hierarchical file/folder thing, after a few years those little gripes get really frustrating.

I don't know if a few years of Mac OS will leave me equally frustrated, maybe so, but in the meantime it will be a breath of fresh air.

Quote from pb32000 :

It hasn't left me frustrated, if anything I like it more and more every day.

Sorry Thunderhead, I forgot my sarcasm smilie

Quote from thisnameistaken :

I am aware that Apple's hardware prices are totally shocking, which is why I've never bought one before, but I think I'm willing to consider it paying for the OS.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

Yeah the hardware costs are a joke, and of course you end up with a computer that makes you look like a cock, but y'know, its just a computer.

I look like enough of a cock most of the time that the addition of a cockish computer won't make a great deal of difference.

I love both of you.

Quote from pb32000 :

Popping a vanilla disk into most PCs won't work.

yes it will the method has been well known for quite a while now and if doen right it will work perfectly including online updates and everything

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

I love both of you.

if thats the kind of sex mac users supposedly get unlike windows users i think ill stick with xp for now

Quote from Shotglass :

if thats the kind of sex mac users supposedly get unlike windows users i think ill stick with xp for now

If I've been having XP user sex for the last 6 or 7 years I'm buying a ****ing Mac.

or youve been having perfectly normal long term relationship sex ie none

Does XP user sex mean you get BSODs while "doing it?"

LOL gotta love those BSOD's.

I was thinking that if I were to buy a laptop to use so I can lay in bed and watch TV without having to use my desktop, I was thinking about getting a Macbook... how would it work though? I mean can I use it with my netgear router without breaking, or having to install 95 patches and 12 new thingys, would it play all my MP3's without shouting at me because I didn't get them from iTunes and do Macs play AVI's and stuff?

(don't shout at me I'm an apple noob.. )

Apple... basically an update every 2 weeks, and a major (like 10.5.5 to 10.5.6) update every 3 months (later on in the lifespan, it gets to like 5 months). AVI's and stuff, you can use VLC or Perian to play them (Perian basically installs ffmpeg into Quicktime, so anyapp that uses Quicktime can play back AVI's such as Front Row)

Also, internets should work perfectly fine, however I have had some issues with one of my routers dropping connection, but it was on stock firmware, and an upgrade fixed it, but it's 1 case in a lot of routers I've connected to. (D-Link one, one of the first that had Wireless N, so that's another reason why it was pretty ****tarded).

MP3's will work perfectly fine, iTunes won't scream at all at you.

I'd strongly recommend using Safari on OSX, it's actually decent (unlike the Windows version), runs quickly and fits into the OS a heck of a lot better than any other browser (however there are some alternatives that are "decent" but not really good). You could also wait until Chrome gets released for OSX, which is coming (as of now, it builds a test shell which is operational, then they're doing the OS specific integration).

Hope this helps.

Cheers Dustin.

Definatly will be thinking about it.. although I'm too into the "windows lifestyle" of things as a main PC, as a Laptop (or a 2nd PC) I think it's probably the way to go!