In another thread ("CTRA and Yellow flag") someone complained about people passing under yellows.

I gulped, because I've done it, and actually just about everyone does - if you don't, then you end up at the back just after T1

So then I rechecked the rules. In fact, they say nothing about not passing under yellows, just basically advise caution and not going full steam.

(The actual text is: Yellow Flags: Drivers are expected to heed yellow flags and drive accordingly. Driving headlong into accidents when drivers have been issued yellow flags is not considered acceptable behaviour. Penalties may result if such instances compound existing race incidents.)

I have mixed feelings.
It is pretty annoying when you are in a tight battle, and you slow down for an incident and get passed by the guy you've kept ahead of for five laps and lose a win/podium/whatever. But if the rules say nothing about it, and passing under yellows is the done thing on CTRA servers, then I guess it's just one of those rolls of the dice - you win some, you lose some.

Does anyone out there avoid passing under yellows?

I try to use caution when I see the yellow message. I do limit passing, unless it would make my own situation safer on track. There's no point in taking a risk for one position if it could lead to a wreck.

Did you actually read that thread?

It was about a mid racer joiner, crashing and then reversing back onto the track/racing line without looking and taking out the leader. The leader saw the yellow flag and the reason, slowed down but couldn't avoid the reversing racer. There is a replay to show you everything.

It has nothing to do with passing for position under yellow flags.

And that thread isn't really about any of that, it's some guy playing mind games and manipulating people.

If you're going to use a thread as an example for something, read it first.

I use the yellow flag system in LFS as a warning that something has happend and I should be aware of that. The yelllow flag system is not really accurate enough to put off passing someone unless you can actually see that the reason for the yellow. Most of the time it will be because someone has run wide at the next turn or 3.

I do not pass someone else under yellow flags, unless I see that there's nobody in front of me on the track map and deduce that it is a bug. For me it's just unfair and dangerous, even if the rules don't state something about it.

But in general cases I try to slow down a little bit and I don't take risks when I see that someone is spinning on the next turn. I think that's why I have these good yellow flags and finished races ratios. And remember, "To finish first, you need first to finish."

Quote from garph :

Did you actually read that thread?

Chill, man, chill.

Yes, I did read it (and am actually quite sorry I did )
Did you read what I posted? A guy early in that thread made the remark I'm referring to, and it piqued my curiosity. I was not using the thread as an example for anything I'm well aware that that incident had nothing at all to do with passing under yellows, and that's one of two reasons I didn't put my question in that thread. (The second being that the thread has descended into something much sadder than a flamefest and is now quite tragic, and most people have probably quite sensibly stopped reading it.) Sorry if my wording made it sound like I was using the thread as an example of passing under yellows

Back on topic though, I do think the flag system is often flaky/misleading/wrong.
But the tricky incidents are those where someone is posing a genuine hazard on the track, you have to pass them, probably off line, and you have to slow down to do it "safely", but then you run the real risk of getting passed by the guy behind. In fact, maybe slammed hard from behind by him cos you slowed down. Having said that, I mostly do slow down, and as a result I often do get passed. Stuff happens.

On balance, I'm glad CTRA doesn't have a rule about passing under yellows, because I think it would be a nightmare to enforce, and would lead to a lot of name-calling and pain and maybe not help very much...

Well, I'd pass under yellow flag on CTRA permitting it's safe to do so. I'm not going to "not" overtake a slower racer if I know that I can pass <here> safely and without risk to either myself or them.

I'll always check the map to see if I can see where an accident is. If it's a big pile up, I'll slow wayy down, if it's just one or two cars I don't tend to pay it much attention.

Just use normal common sense

tbh in lfs the yeloow flags have a differant menaing than irl. in lfs it stands as more of a' be allert of the situation' message than a strict dont pass system because the reasons for yellow flags in lfs are different

Quote from james12s :

tbh in lfs the yeloow flags have a differant menaing than irl.

That's true, the YF detection system has its flaws, sometimes it gives out warnings just because someone was driving a bit slow (exiting from the pits, slight wall contact, you name it).

There's basically no way to know whether an accident has truly happened or not and as far as CTRA is concerned, it's not mentioned in the rules, case closed for me.

You guys are correct. The implementation of yellow flags in LFS isn't solid enough for us to make any strong determinations. This is the reason why we haven't explicitly defined overtaking regulations under localised yellow flag conditions, and why we've always asserted that we place no emphasis on yellow flag ratio statistics in MyCTRA.

We do place additional onus on drivers to drive with care on approach to a possible accident, and have been known to criticise drivers (or dismiss reports by drivers) who, having been shown a yellow flag in LFS, continue to drive full-speed into oblivion.

It was me Neilser who posted about passing under yellow in that other thread

I think its clear some people see yellow flags differently to others, in both sims and IRL. (not so much IRL )
IMO and limited experiance I always take extreme caution to be super safe under yellow, and for me keeping position, I think is just being fair to the guy in front, I mean its reasonable easy to pass someone if they get off the gas even a little or brake early in response to a yellow.

I think the rule as quoted, applys most when a broad yellow is thrown, and the procession of cars has to slow a little (always happens to me in a fast part of the track hehe) now either all of the whole line of cars slows and keeps position, assuming they are nose to tail, or some cars decide to risk a pass, fine if on a straight with no stationary cars etc, but lethal in a twisty fast part, with drivers ahead looking to see where any crashed cars may be, being cautious and suddenly theres cars beside you

I may well be getting my CTRA rules mixed with other leagues etc Ive driven in.

SD.

Crikey me...... hey SpankyDave....... long time since I've seen you on an LFS server - hope you're doing well

Well, it's not like it matters anymore.

:slap:

S14, no offense, but you sound like a 5yr old who had his candy bar taken away.


Let the whole thing play out before you start wetting your diaper.

Quote from th84 :

:slap:

S14, no offense, but you sound like a 5yr old who had his candy bar taken away.


Let the whole thing play out before you start wetting your diaper.

Haha, couldn't have said it better! That is, indeed, how he comes across

It's ok. Well, CTRA was my candy bar. I know what's gone on, and as far as I'm concerned, it's all done with now!