Quote from Lateralus :

Shut the hell up you whiner.

I'll shut up hell as soon as I have the time to fight satan.

Vain

this reminds me a bit of armed assault community where the devs were badgered so much into realeasing the game early that it was full of horrendous bugs so what they got in the end was a half finished bug filled game good things come to those who wait I guess

Was that called Armed Assault S2 Alpha by any chance?
maybe we have a link, its all happening for a reason, it doesnt make sense in the slightest but in a couple of years time we'll get some half-arsed nonsense that explains wtf has been going on, where the updated in-car textures have gone, why the GTR balancing balances things even further in the FZRs favour, why the tracks have screwed up curbs which launch you 1% of the time, where the polar bears came from, how the island disappears and... hmm, maybe im getting wires crossed :rolleyes:

oh, and lol @ TVE

This is amazing, whiners fighting with people who whine about whiners. Anyone who thinks it's lame to whine about the Scirocco being late - fine, have that opinion. You might be right - maybe it is lame. (I don't feel strongly either way.) But if you don't want to read the whines, just don't bother.
(Hey, does this make me someone who whines about whiners who whine about whiners? )

^yes!!! cookie for you!

/me presses also 1, but does it 7 times

^ZOMG Haxorzzz!!! lol. why close this thread, you guys know closing this will open another...

Is this fuzz really all about Scirocco or is there something else that's really exciting about this patch?

If it's just about Scirocco then this got to be the most overrated lfs patch ever.

Quote from ponczak :

Is this fuzz really all about Scirocco or is there something else that's really exciting about this patch?

If it's just about Scirocco then this got to be the most overrated lfs patch ever.

I think that Scawen said somewhere that the patch will not contain anything big but only Scirocco + some minor things. But I'm not sure.

FlameCZE: I think that he said that to
But dno maybe the scirocco is finished and theyre doing something other thing for us but we dont know.

Letz get suprised!

I hope not...
I mean I hope the FZ and FX will be updated at least... I always drive FZR so it's pretty important for me to not have a CD player in a Race car
But I think it won't even be updated as the latest LFS viewver with Scirocco has still old FXO/R and FZ5/R...
I'd like to know if it will be updated for this patch but Scawen has probably more important things to do
EDIT:

Quote :

While most people will be happy to see these improvements, we predict that some will be disappointed that the other GTR cars are not yet done. But don't worry, the FZ updates are near complete and we are keen to get that released along with the FXO updates as soon as possible - but not in time for Patch Z which will look very much like today's test patch and should be released next week.

Reading this makes me think that new FZ and FX interiors should be ready...

Yeah... but then Scawen didn't know that there will be an opportunity to make Scirocco, so i won't be suprised will be realesed later.

Well maybe Eric has time to do that while Scawen is trying to repair the patch bugs...

I hope they will release it as soon as possible. Now I have repeating dreams about Scirocco release And it is very cruel when I wake up and realize, that it was just a dream...
It looked so real when they announced it on 19th December
It reminds me this video: www.liveforspeed.net/download/S2clip.zip

Quote from chavm481 :

^ZOMG Haxorzzz!!! lol. why close this thread, you guys know closing this will open another...

LOL i know they'll make new one. They have already made some, but I think it would be good idea to clean it up a bit

nah... im sure bob is too lazy... loke me..

People seem to forget the most important thing, LFS is a BUSINESS, as in, they need to make money or they don't eat. I'm more worried about them keeping LFS alive than I am about the scirocco. In the early days you could pick the car you like, find a server with people on it and race. Now if you want company you have to pick a server with people, and drive the car they are driving. I've got about 10 friends to buy LFS over the years, and none of them are regulars any more. Now I know this is fine, people take breaks etc but here's the thing; LFS needs new content just to stop or slow the "churn", the people leaving LFS for other sims. It does not need this to make me happy, or to satisfy the whiners. It needs this to STAY IN BUSINESS, to put food on the table etc etc. The hardcore LFS crowd is not enough to keep things going, even though they are usually the most enjoyable people to drive with there just aren't enough of them.

Thing is though, when I see Eric post "You don't like it, leave" I get scared. It makes me think the devs themselves aren't mature enough to maintain a professional apperance. LFS's public relations could really use some help, and this forum sure isn't doing that. If you REALLY want LFS to survive, go get new people to buy it. It's that simple. The dev's just aren't good at getting people to do that. I bet Eric's post got a good number of them to stop actually, and that is not how you run a business.


TL;DR?

Quote from McDee :

People seem to forget the most important thing, LFS is a BUSINESS, as in, they need to make money or they don't eat. I'm more worried about them keeping LFS alive than I am about the scirocco. In the early days you could pick the car you like, find a server with people on it and race. Now if you want company you have to pick a server with people, and drive the car they are driving. I've got about 10 friends to buy LFS over the years, and none of them are regulars any more. Now I know this is fine, people take breaks etc but here's the thing; LFS needs new content just to stop or slow the "churn", the people leaving LFS for other sims. It does not need this to make me happy, or to satisfy the whiners. It needs this to STAY IN BUSINESS, to put food on the table etc etc. The hardcore LFS crowd is not enough to keep things going, even though they are usually the most enjoyable people to drive with there just aren't enough of them.

Thing is though, when I see Eric post "You don't like it, leave" I get scared. It makes me think the devs themselves aren't mature enough to maintain a professional apperance. LFS's public relations could really use some help, and this forum sure isn't doing that. If you REALLY want LFS to survive, go get new people to buy it. It's that simple. The dev's just aren't good at getting people to do that. I bet Eric's post got a good number of them to stop actually, and that is not how you run a business.


TL;DR?

I don't think we need to or even should worry about the business side of things - we're only customers after all... If problems should arise, the devs will take action themselves, we won't have any part in it... As for Eric's post: after all those comments and even punches below the belt it was only a matter of time until one of them would run out of patience... It was surprising how long it took and his post was more restrained than what I would've said - and it isn't even something of my concern...

So unless you hear that prices will go up or you'll have to pay a monthly subscription from now on, you can sleep well assuming that the business is running ok...

Quote from McDee :

LFS's public relations could really use some help, and this forum sure isn't doing that.

The forums can be hardly regarded as PR, the 'average customer' doesn't usually dwell on the discussion boards. The people in here are a limited subset of the whole customer base.

And I totally +1 bbman's post.

Quote from bbman :

So unless you hear that prices will go up or you'll have to pay a monthly subscription from now on, you can sleep well assuming that the business is running ok...

And even if things *did* go tits-up, I think most of us here (myself included) have had a hell of a lot of hours of fun for our £24 investment, so the LFS devs don't owe me a penny

Quote from bbman :

If problems should arise, the devs will take action themselves, we won't have any part in it...So unless you hear that prices will go up or you'll have to pay a monthly subscription from now on, you can sleep well assuming that the business is running ok...

Problems have already arrived, I used to be able to race any car I felt like (except when they released a new car) and now I can't, that is a problem IMO. I would happily put up with a price increase or policy change if it meant more updates, and due to more updates, more racers. It's all about more racers.

Quote from bbman :

As for Eric's post: after all those comments and even punches below the belt it was only a matter of time until one of them would run out of patience... It was surprising how long it took and his post was more restrained than what I would've said - and it isn't even something of my concern...

Hey, I feel for the guy and even agree with him on a lot of levels, but the fact remains. It's just not smart to make those feelings public to your customers/potential customers. Can you imagine any successful business having PR like that? Heck, even a call center person would get fired for saying something like that to just one customer.

Quote from NightShift :

The forums can be hardly regarded as PR, the 'average customer' doesn't usually dwell on the discussion boards. The people in here are a limited subset of the whole customer base.

And I totally +1 bbman's post.

You might be surprised how many LFS'ers are familiar with the forums. Just because they don't post doesn't mean they don't see this place.

Quote from McDee :

and now I can't, that is a problem IMO.

I'd agree with you on the general principle (i.e. the number of racers is falling), but to say you could always choose ANY car and find a full server, well, that's a big overstatement!

Some cars/class have always been less lucky than others... if you search the forum there's ample evidence of that.

Quote from McDee :

You might be surprised how many LFS'ers are familiar with the forums. Just because they don't post doesn't mean they don't see this place.

I've been a lurker for a long time don't be fooled by the silly amount of posts carrying my name these days.

I remember if I said something about test patches in the servers' chat, only a small minority was aware of them. Most never had an idea a new patch was going to be released, or what was going to be in it.

That of course was around mid '08, when there was not a delayed car to draw attention to LFS.

Yeah, I'm talking about 2004-2007. I've been playing LFS for a loooong time. Trust me, it's no overstatement. The release of the MRT5 and S2 had a big impact. And I'm not talking about a "full" server". If you reread my post you will find I never said that, please please do not put words in my mouth. I said you could "find a server with people on it and race". Again, please please do not put words in my mouth.

I didn't know about the test patches till around mid 2008 either. That however doesn't mean I didn't read the forums.

Quote from McDee :

You might be surprised how many LFS'ers are familiar with the forums. Just because they don't post doesn't mean they don't see this place.

I think you are right. I get many complaints in game about how mean I am on the forums for complete strangers. :sadbanana

In response to Neilsers point about LFS going tits up, I agree. I'd even still play it. I'm sure LFS would continue as is, although without any updates in the future. As LFS is, it's a game for life IMO. You just keep improving and keep having fun. Learning new tracks and cars will almost take a lifetime in itself.

Quote from McDee :

Problems have already arrived, I used to be able to race any car I felt like (except when they released a new car) and now I can't, that is a problem IMO. I would happily put up with a price increase or policy change if it meant more updates, and due to more updates, more racers. It's all about more racers.

Your problem, not one of the business... And I honestly can't say that it has been any different in the whole time I've been here - it was always 2-3 favourite combos which were boring, but somehow driven to death and some leagues to the side... CTRA made it worse in a way, as it gathered many racers so that even those 2-3 combos were reduced to 1-2... Now that it's gone, people have to reaquaint themselves with the thought that they have to visit other servers again and/or make their own to have a race... I'll give TBO 2 more weeks before it goes to GTR@ASNat again - Oval seems to have disappeared to iRacing...

Quote from McDee :

Hey, I feel for the guy and even agree with him on a lot of levels, but the fact remains. It's just not smart to make those feelings public to your customers/potential customers. Can you imagine any successful business having PR like that? Heck, even a call center person would get fired for saying something like that to just one customer.

Crowd control. As simple as that... See it this way: You are king as a customer, but if you think you can walk all over me in my own store, I will literally kick you out... Eric has shown that there is a limit and we're approaching it - I find it surprising some people don't seem to get that...
Anyway, if someone is offended by probably this one first time the devs haven't made a jolly face to the constant bickering on here, his life must be bliss...