I totally agree with you. I'm a demo user too, but I am getting S2 in a weeks' time . People are no different because of the licence they use, and I can't believe some people think that.
Offtopic: I can't wait to use the ramps feature and make some ai crashes :P
The problem isn't with demo users per se, although it's an unfortunate majority of S2 users that seem to post "blah blah blah... and oh yeah buy S2". That's just not called for.
However when Demo users start posting suggestions or complaining about lack of features, or for one silly reason or another, I'd be the first to tell them to shoo.
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Although I agree with your post Funnybear, the global financial crisis was caused by over-eager b(W)ankers sending and recieving money with loads of £.....0's that didn't actually exist. Repeat until crisis. :P
Yeah, anger management. Whenever I get angry I just pretende the Scirocco to be Scawen, and while that little car gets ruined I sit home laughing *Muahahahhahahahh HOW YOU LIKE THAT HU?!?!?*
Joke aside, I will of course drive it, and trash it
No one (with the slightest bit of sanity) is unhappy with what they have paid of LFS. I have even bought so many high res skin downloads that I could have bought myself another S2 account, and I still consider it all extremely good value.
So, money isn't the case, value of the product isn't the case. It's all good in that department. I would immediately pay the devs double of what S2 costs if that would get more results.
What I think a lot of people find frustrating, is the massive potential of what LFS has and that isn't being utilized while the competing sims are slowly starting to stomp over while LFS is sitting still spinning its thumbs around.
Exactly!
Because I canot actually think of anyone that don't like LFS that moans here, but everyone know that this game is able to reach the top, but is hindered by rather sluggish devlopment speed. I have heared a lot of people saying they are interested in LFS, but won't buy it before it goes beta or final, they are kind of not into buying alpha product. Even if it's a solid product the mass marked are not too keen on alpha product.
I hope that within 2010 LFS is in final S2 stage.
Some people are only used to games made by whole teams with more than 10 people. Remember that Live For Speed is made by only 3 people. Thats 1,2,3 ... Takes more time but its still a top game.
Lol I'd be outrageously happy when that happened :P. My ever favourite car. All these under 300hp japanese icons(RX7, Skyline, Z, Supra, EVO, Impreza and so on) are nothing to me compared with the beemer :P
Coming back to reality, looks like we won't have any updates any more, never. I'd like to hope that we will, but it's starting to look like the game will be dead in few years or even less. Let's see. That's just my opinion.
I don't agree. The people who don't moan, or the people who moan constructively (I categorize myself there) would be grateful for an update, even if it was just a sentence. Yes, some people would moan, but not to say anything just because some people are immature or just stupid isn't really great for the rest of the community, who would appreciate the gesture.
It's like if Scawen decided to make S2 free because demo users complain.
Personally, I'm happily going about my LFS life without worrying about when the Scirocco is coming out, or the next patch. I've still got my leagues to run..LFSBC/NDRC, Kyoto 500, LFSCART, etc. Look at the leagues section....several active leagues at the moment...LFSBC, LFSCART, oneGP, IGTC, ITCC, OWRL, IMA, plenty more. As long as these and other EVENTS keep going, LFS WILL NOT die. League races are never the same...there's always something more to be had. Sure, LFS is great for it's pickup and play racing, but really, LFS is really mostly about league racing. It's so easy to do a league idea...many possibilities. If/when the Scirocco comes out, we at NDR might find a way to incorporate it regularly.
As a side note to this point, great kudos to the new league forces in LFS such as ICON Racing Events, and International Motorsport Association. All these one-off events are also amazing. The annual 16 hour race, the other one-off yearly events that are held are also great variety to this.
I don't think it's mainly because of how the devs feel about the constant whining and moaning, but rather the image it creates to new possible customers. Afterall,the community is one big selling point of LfS, so we shouldn't scare new people away by making it too obvious that a great part of us are whiny bitches who are never content with anything.
The thing is, you don't know any better than the next guy about the reason why the silent treatment is going on. We can go on and on about why they won't say anything, but none of us will have any hard facts because none of us really knows. Being worried of new customers - well, there are a bit more suppressing matters than frustrated "whiny bitch" old customers, don't you think? Have new customers suddenly become way more important than the old time supporters? Are new users so fragile they can't hold some silly forum moaning without falling apart? The moaning and whining is what it is, trying to cover it up at the expense of people who actually want to know what is going on and want dev reports would be a piss poor choice.
Although I agree with you, I can not stop being worried with what´s going on right now. It seems that all of this became some kind of contest between LFS users and the devs to see who is more stubborn. If is the users asking for updates or the devs in not saying anything and releasing information about what´s being developed. The people who run the events that you mentioned or the ones that put their time and money to run servers where you can race, are what´s really important in LFS, much more than any update or patch. And in my opinion, they are being left out just like everybody else. I used to feel that we were part of the project, that it was easy to talk with the devs, that we could somehow influence the future of LFS, that it was "my" game and not only the game developed by Scavier. I don´t feel that now, and I think that the devs should think a bit about this. If they really plan on keeping improving LFS, they cannot afford to loose contact with the users. Without the people that support LFS by giving their time and effort to provide ways for people to have fun racing in LFS, it is just another "car racing game"...
You're right, that's just some speculation. You have to admit that it all got quite out of hand with the scirocco though.
I still do think though that we don't need a real dev blog. What would be nice though would be a community Q&A, either through the forums (well moderated, every post in the thread that isn't a question to the devs will be deleted) or via IRC. Allthough I'd prefer the forum one because of easier moderation and more time (instead of one hour, it could be a week, with Scawen, Victor and Eric checking for questions once a day, if the mods weed out the rubbish posts and questions)
Yup, I agree. As much as I'm dissatisfied myself, I have found some of the whining comments pretty darn hillarious. Not being to able to drive a boring FWD bucket in a car simulator will never ruin my christmas, I tell you that much.
But yeah, we don't need a dev blog, but it would be nice to have something to hold on to while imagining LFS still has a bright future ahead of itself. If a blog is too much for scavier (I know it is), then atleast keep posting at the forum, keeping us up with the status. No matter how little the progress or a plan change, it's all good when we know about it. It's good to keep secrets and surprise the players a little with something unexpected, but it's not very pleasing to be kept in total darkness of what's coming. Even if some of us sound like whining little spoiled brats, all we want is the best for LFS.
We don`t even know HOW this whole crysis affected them personally.
Would be nice, IMO, not an update, inside info's and stuff, just a post saying: "Hey, we`re here, we`re good, carry on".
This reply not even 2 months old isn't enough, STF?
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Anyway, I really don't know what to say about this talk in this thread, mixed emotions.
I understand some views, some are plain ridiculous, and other just stupid (NHF :shrug.
As much I would like (as anyone else, probably even Scavier) more public info and whatnot, sometimes that just isn't possible for varius reasons. Even for simple things like making a plan for shopping, let alone a big buisness.
For example, for a week I'm putting off going to shops to buy new gear for riding and I love riding bikes, but I just didn't had the energy to go look around or more important stuff got in a way.
I can go into speculation mode too and say that maybe they are reworking their master plan becouse of new sims on the market are gettin' pretty damn good.
Two years ago I didn't even think about any other sim (not counting GPL and RBR), but it seems market has taken a sharp turn and you know (well, some maybe) 2 years can fly like nothing so to speak.
Please don't go naming other sims flaws now, that's not the point.
All I can do right now is keep my faith in Scavier, good luck guys!
P.S. I didn't play LFS for a long long time (any other car race sim too), but still when I go for some pick up racing every now and then,
there's always (and I really mean always) a grin on my face after a session. Not something that happens on much other sims, or games in general for that matter.
That tells something, after all this time.
Sure, call me fanboy now .
Long "P.S.", eh?
Totally agree. Who wouldn't fork out additional cash for a significant update. It think 90% of the posters in this thread would.
You're not alone. The old RSC days were the best. Scawen actually participated in discussions about the game and its development. Improvement/suggestions were discussed and other sites picked up on this and generated news and interest in LFS. IMO the last few years though have seen a gradual decline in engagement and it has hit those that you meantion above badly. But this sentiment is yet to register with the devs. Apparently everything is just "situation normal", according to below.
Sure there's those "noisy forum users", but there also those who support LFS by hosting servers, running events and building up communities and interest, only see it erode, as the game stagnates.
Scawen and Co have their development philosophy and many times they've said that is what's important to them. But it's not sustainable if development and engagement continue to decline. By the time S3 comes out, LFS will have many new competitors.
In many way LFS is going the way of the Commodore Amiga. Cornered the market and had so much potential, but sat still for too long.
I guess while this thread remains open it offers some hope, as it speaks loudly to the devs. The fact it dwarfs other threads in hits and posts, does say something about the community unrest with LFS development.
Tripe. This thread is big and it is here because we, the mods, have merged every non-abusive/not-ban-worthy VWS thread into one. We did that because the small minority of empty pots that are making the loudest noise also like to repeat themselves when they're bitching and moaning, over and over and over and over and over and... over as many different threads as possible.
Fortunately for the rest of the community - the vast majority of LFSers that aren't rattling their virtual sabres - the devs are continuing to do what the devs said they would continue to do; work on LFS. I very much doubt Scawen has spent more than a few minutes on the forum in the last couple of months. When he's deep in code, I know for a fact, he doesn't spend his days hanging out on the forums. He always works intensely on the code, massively focused, as a new patch is approaching.
The truth is that history has shown that when Scawen goes most quiet, good things are coming. Anyone who's been here for a few years, and who thinks about it for a moment, knows this to be the case.
I agree. And I personally don't care about the Scirocco. Other updates are FAR more important than that Scirocco, this should be made clear.
I personally start very much thinking if they at all do something. If they develop the game. Basically, if they are at all ALIVE
Most of people who are not happy with the situation, at least I would be happy if they just confirmed they are alive, they still know they're the devs of LFS and that they haven't thrown the whole LFS business into trash can. No need for progress updates if these are so "bad".
So the only thing the community needs top know if the devs are at all developing LFS, if they at all have interest in LFS. If they confirmed that, then I'd be happy. So what the Scirocco. Don't care if it comes out in 2010. Just I need to know if they at all are developing the game. And if they have given up the project, then why not say that LFS has come to the end of development. Period.
Totally agree. Who wouldn't fork out additional cash for a significant update. It think 90% of the posters in this thread would.
You're not alone. The old RSC days were the best. Scawen actually participated in discussions about the game and its development. Improvement/suggestions were discussed and other sites picked up on this and generated news and interest in LFS. IMO the last few years though have seen a gradual decline in engagement and it has hit those that you meantion above badly. But this sentiment is yet to register with the devs. Apparently everything is just "situation normal", according to below.
Sure there's those "noisy forum users", but there also those who support LFS by hosting servers, running events and building up communities and interest, only see it erode, as the game stagnates.
Scawen and Co have their development philosophy and many times they've said that is what's important to them. But it's not sustainable if development and engagement continue to decline. By the time S3 comes out, LFS will have many new competitors.
In many way LFS is going the way of the Commodore Amiga. Cornered the market and had so much potential, but sat still for too long.
I guess while this thread remains open it offers some hope, as it speaks loudly to the devs. The fact it dwarfs other threads in hits and posts, does say something about the community unrest with LFS development.
Yes, Scawen is right on what he says, but that's what happen when you promise a patch early 2009, I think they would explain why it's now delayed again without any news or posts from the devs (apart of the Scawen's post "moving house", supposely they started to work on it again on half February). Anyway, it's not in the main LFS web, where they puslish all news, so like not everybody read the forum, not everybody knows anything about Scawen and patches.
Solution? publish some news saying something like "sorry for delay, we still working on it, you will have more news soon", in that way, many people will stop asking for Scirocco, patch and devs, Don't you think?
It's not tripe Sam. It genuine sentiment (regardless if they are separate threads) and not everyone here's an empty pot.
I'm not sure what evidence you base this "quite = good" thing on, but looking back from the RSC days, the pace of development has slowed greatly, along with community participation and it's latently obvious. Those that can't see that, are either new to LFS or should take off the rose coloured glasses.
. People are no different because of the licence they use, and I can't believe some people think that.
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