For me, it can happen at any time, it can't be reproduced at will. I could be sitting in the pits with the engine running, or I could be out racing. It's only LFS it happens in though, and only in the test patches.

Quote from Byku :

And here's just an example . Again sorry for posting on this thread . It would be good for both "camps" .

Very nice picture-in-garage!

May i try it?

Quote from dougie-lampkin :

For me, it can happen at any time, it can't be reproduced at will. I could be sitting in the pits with the engine running, or I could be out racing. It's only LFS it happens in though, and only in the test patches.

Exactely, is happens at any time and seems to be related to low fps rate, or at least can cause it. Actually I don't know if it slows down LFS in any way. It sounds like "reverbation over reverbation", or "sound stream over sound stream", i can't explain. And at some point the sound gets louder and louder and louder and then it seems like LFS restarts the sound engine. A hick up happens in the game, and the sound gets lower, also I get better framerates, before it starts again...

All I can see is that it could be related to some model of Realtek HD chipsets, and probably is related to low fps, since my laptop has a Intel G965 onboard video chipset and I get around 25~45fps at 1280x800 (my guess, i can't remember).


Well. Its a real known issue for now on.

sound like typical microphone feedback... also u can try to gradualy decrease directx audio acceleration..

I don't think it's FPS related though, mine usually gets around 250-300 FPS, as I've only been playing LFS in single player recently

I don't think it's mic related either, all my input channels are disabled, and playback and recording muted when not in use

It's hard to explain it alright, it sounds exactly like if you loop a mic into a playback feed. If I have WMP open, it jams for a few seconds. If I stop the music, and minimise LFS, the reverberations stop. But if I play the music again, it starts echoing again. The only fix I've found is to plug the headphones out and in again, and shift+w in LFS.

Quote from Aid :

sound like typical microphone feedback... also u can try to gradualy decrease directx audio acceleration..

so why does it only affects LFS?
even if all feedbacks are off, even the speaker feedbacks, it's still happening?

whats speaker feedbacks? are we talking about the same thing? i have a feeling we don't. i don't know... what i know mic fb has similar symptoms because i had it in the past.. why only lfs? i don't know... maybe its a bug? or maybe it happend when there is constant loud sound for enough time for fb to build up tried another racing sims? i'm only guessing can't tell u 100% however that would be 1st thing i would check.. and i would check it few times to be sure, what really is causing it? i don't know

Quote from Aid :

whats speaker feedbacks? are we talking about the same thing? i have a feeling we don't. i don't know... what i know mic fb has similar symptoms because i had it in the past.. why only lfs? i don't know... maybe its a bug? or maybe it happend when there is constant loud sound for enough time for fb to build up tried another racing sims? i'm only guessing can't tell u 100% however that would be 1st thing i would check.. and i would check it few times to be sure, what really is causing it? i don't know

Sorry, I was taking about "Loudness Equalization" setting under Optimizations tab.
It's checked here, could be it. I'll uncheck it, test and report. Thanks.



@dougie-lampkin:
Can you check if it is checked there too?

(/me ashamed?)

It's unchecked here since I installed realtek, I found it made things far too quiet

Got some issue with windows 7 64bit

When I do Shift+F4, the screen is going nuts, going fullscreen black, then half screen black and it wont stop.

The other thing is ABS on Rb4

http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=x3cm6t&s=5
Brakes 1214 Nm @ 70% , fron and rear lock diff

Quote from Dmt :

The other thing is ABS on Rb4

http://tinypic.com/player.php?v=x3cm6t&s=5
Brakes 1214 Nm @ 70% , fron and rear lock diff

Locked diff is probably the cause. AFAIK, LFS, as with most ABS systems, compares the speed of the wheels to work out if they're locked or not. If the front and rear diffs are locked, its suddenly lost 2 points of comparison - the only difference in speed will be front and rear wheels. If the front and rear axles lock at the same time (entirely possible) the ABS is likely to get confused and assume the car is stationary.

Is the centre diff locked or high torque as well? If so that'll make it even worse.


Whether this is a bug/error or not is, perhaps, debatable. I doubt there would be a problem with a more realistic setup.

@Degats: I think the ABS also looks for a sudden speed reduction in a very short time, avoiding that confusion, but i'm not sure about this

maybe he should just consider a clutch or viscous lsd at a high torque setting, see if that sets anything apart

Perhaps the ABS discussion should move to the ABS spin-off thread


Regarding real cars we have (in no particular order)
BF1 FBM MRT VWS RAC

The rest of the cars are based on real cars (some more loosely than others)
XR - Mitsubishi Starion
XF - Citroen AX
UF - Classic Mini
FZ - Porsche 911 (almost identical in specs to a specific version)
LX - Caterham
FX - Opel/Vauxhall Astra Coupe
RB4 - probably the hardest to match, general consensus is a combination of Toyota Celica/Toyota Supra/Mitsubishi Eclipse/Mitsubishi 3000GT
The other SS cars are based on real championships, IIRC F3000 and something else - It says exactly which ones in the forum somewhere

/off topic

Quote from Degats :

Locked diff is probably the cause. AFAIK, LFS, as with most ABS systems, compares the speed of the wheels to work out if they're locked or not. If the front and rear diffs are locked, its suddenly lost 2 points of comparison - the only difference in speed will be front and rear wheels. If the front and rear axles lock at the same time (entirely possible) the ABS is likely to get confused and assume the car is stationary.

Is the centre diff locked or high torque as well? If so that'll make it even worse.


Whether this is a bug/error or not is, perhaps, debatable. I doubt there would be a problem with a more realistic setup.

Great! I also noticed this and thought exactly in the same way with you! Because of I usually drift the RB4, my front and rear wheels get hot and lose a lot of traction, which will cause this rare situation to happen much more frequently! It becomes pretty easy for all wheels to stop/lock exactly at the same time with really hot tyres! It took for a few laps for me to figure it out though, since I wasn't able to turn when I was braking sudden and hard enough that all wheels stopped exactly at the same time. But I was really happy when I saw this, and found out the cause. I thinked that I once more proved to myself that I had some knowledge about the ABS systems and car physics. (I love the way which physics and systems like ABS are impelented so realistic in LFS :razz I wonder if there is a check for this situation in real cars. Perhaps the sudden speed reduction thing might be a good idea to start!

Quote from Scawen :

It's not really supposed to be a high visibility thing - it's so that in those occasional cases when you join a track and you think "Which track am I on? Which way should I go?" you can start to move and look for the arrow.

On Z13 i have fps 20 all the time and on 0,5 Z i have about 100. any solutions?

Quote from !!the king!! :

On Z13 i have fps 20 all the time and on 0,5 Z i have about 100. any solutions?

update LFS its graphics setups, look there about I think, or...wrong

Quote from !!the king!! :

On Z13 i have fps 20 all the time and on 0,5 Z i have about 100. any solutions?

Revert back to 0.5Z

won't help if that bug would still be in 0.6A

Quote from !!the king!! :

On Z13 i have fps 20 all the time and on 0,5 Z i have about 100. any solutions?

Well, try a fresh install of Z, test that again and update that one to Z13, maybe something in your LFS graphics settings got changed and you weren't aware. Also check out the shadows settings off/low res/high res. Improvements in the shadow quality might be effecting you FPS.

I founded one bug in Z13 about shadows with ramps, but its propably already posted.

I just checked more closely and carefully the new shadowing system and it produces jaggies which I never noticed before in the older version of LFS.
Nothing major as its really hardly noticeable. Using latest Catalyst driver (9.6).Tried also the previous version of the driver.

Interesingly the FPS differens for example in BL with view on wheels is sometimes up to 20FPS between the old 0.5W and 0.5Z13.
Seems there is still room for improvement in the code to get more out of it.

Something we noticed last night during some setup work was, If you have previously run the newest test patch that has ABS included. When or if you do a new install and run your set from the test patch ABS will still be activated even though it doesn't show up in your pit commands.

Do you mean ABS works when it is OFF in setup menu or ABS works ie on XFG which doesn't have ABS anymore?

Notice that you may have Brake Help enabled in fresh install, but I'm not sure.

I mean Havoc was running the XRT on a new install and he had ABS. I was specing him and told him the reason he wasnt burning tyres was because he had ABS on. He informed me he couldn't possible have ABS on because on his install there is no ABS.
He went into the pits to check and no ABS ON/OFF button was there. But when we spec him ABS is kicking in under hard braking.