I was sure it gave the car in front a slight boost, or it at least did in S1 days as there were leagues with rules that were pretty biased against drafting as it helped both cars far too much.
The SCCA is FULL of lawyers. And doctors. They are not professional racing drivers and they need to afford their members with certain safeties. In the old days in FV the tactic used to be to bump the gearbox and knock your opponent out of gear. That was back when the club portion of SCCA was inhabited by young professionals. That's the fun of competition, playing just a little bit dirty, but not being a douche.
That's what I was referring to above. LFS does not simulate the push/pull effect.
It doesn't simulate it at all, all aero change is on the rear car.
Pretty much it. LFS basically makes a wedge of air disappear from the lead car, causing less resistance on the following car. When there is less-to-no air on the front, all the downforce seems to be removed, which IMO is extremely exaggerated. And there is no effect on the leading car whatsoever.
Scawen said he has been working on the aero like a year ago I think, hopefully that's one of the "big things" he has in store for us this year.
Aero, to my knowledge, has never been properly simulated in any game. It's too complicated. Even still, I've never seen a car actually pushed down by air in any racing game.
What do you mean? I know it can't be completely simulated, but many sims have had the basics of it mastered (NR2003, iR, and ASR somewhat).
As a downforce car goes faster it rides lower since there are thousands of pounds pushing down on it. I've never seen that in a game.
Yep, that was what I was thinking you meant. Like I said though, at least basics are simulated in some sims.
I thaught it did that in LFS, I never realy looked at it though.
Thats a big thing for suspension geometry then, I always took downforce into account on my setups. But now that I think about it, I coulden't have been doing it properly if I wasn't looking at it anyway.
Ya I looked at one of my replays in the FBM going down the back straight at Blackwood and from 0-125 there was no change in ride height. FBM is no F1 car but it should still press down with several hundred pounds above 110 or so.
FBM is not very much downforced.
I believe this forces áre simulated and also is the suspension reaction to it...?
I believe this forces áre simulated and also is the suspension reaction to it...?
I don't know. I've only tested the FBM as I'm only a demo user. But even so much as 100 pounds would be enough to move the suspension noticeably and at full wing angle the FBM is producing about 330 pounds of force at 120 MPH.
If you press F during a replay (forces view)you can see the downforce acting on the car as it speeds up.
Im pretty sure it does effects suspension and ride hight etc.
The bumpdrafting issue is not just in the cars with downforce tho
SD.
Im pretty sure it does effects suspension and ride hight etc.
The bumpdrafting issue is not just in the cars with downforce tho
SD.
No, LFS doesn't model this.
I wouldn't call blocking or bumpdrafting cheating though - the only reason it's bad in LFS is collision detection. If LFS' netcode was perfect and the damage model was too i'd have no problem giving or taking... :P
I'm not really a fan of bump drafting.
Slipstreaming is more my cup of tea.
Slipstreaming is more my cup of tea.
Bump draft can be fun and challenging sometimes. For example if 2th and 3th joins team and bump drafts on straight to catch up with the leader and make the race much more interesting.
Alltho I see the problems with it, aswell that it sucks for the 1st man to get catched on the straight because two people desided to team up against him. Neverthless, racing is racing, sometimes it means that you have to use some rather interesting technics
Alltho I see the problems with it, aswell that it sucks for the 1st man to get catched on the straight because two people desided to team up against him. Neverthless, racing is racing, sometimes it means that you have to use some rather interesting technics
According to Newman Haas Racing, their test center said that IRL cars can produce enough downforce to drive on the roof of a tunnel, without falling, @ around 100mph. That's crazy xD My instructor also told us the wings on Formula 2's are effective around 80+mph or more. lol the suspension travel on most formula cars is like an inch or two, that number I'm not sure about but it's not more then a few inches max.
note: you should buy the S2 license, it's totally worth it.
I actualy thought about how cool that would be, people told me it was impossible, but considering the downforce, if you had a tunnel with a very large diameter it might just work. Although I doubt you will find anyone willing to try driving up side down at 100mph. They'd have to be
illepallWell...people do say that Indy is crazy
Reading this, I can understand the other side from a different view point.
I can take it as bump drafting in a car isn't cheating, but exploiting the game engine's limitations to gain an otherwise unfair advantage could be considered wrong.
Am I correct in assuming this is the argument of the original post?
I personally don't like doing it. I don't trust people well enough to do that. I'd rather just time my movements and back pedal a bit to get a better run at a better part of the course. This strategy has served me well for years.
As long as there is competition to be #1, there will always be someone that will cheat to try to obtain it. If they want to cheat the system, I'm not gonna say anything about it then, it doesn't affect anyone except the ones that do it, but if they want to cheat to beat other players, then I would say something.
meh, it's just a personal choice, I think it's wrong. Draft and pass is the way it should be. If people can't do that, it shows everyone else that they only care about themselves, not about others. That's not cool with me, those selfish b-tards. I always think of others, and make sure everyone's best interests are kept in mind.
meh, it's just a personal choice, I think it's wrong. Draft and pass is the way it should be. If people can't do that, it shows everyone else that they only care about themselves, not about others. That's not cool with me, those selfish b-tards. I always think of others, and make sure everyone's best interests are kept in mind.
I'm bumping someone ahead of me to give the person ahead of me a boost instead of myself...ya that's selfish alright
I'm just guessing the travel based on just looking at a Formula 1 car sitting still versus at 190 MPH. The only reason it entered my head was when a SPEED announcer mentioned it and I could see the cars a lot lower at high speed than say sitting on the grid or a pit stop.
Ya I'm getting S2 when my Porsche wheel gets here.
If I "bump" someone, it means I've made a mistake, If someone bumps me from behind once, fair enough their mistake, if they continue to bump me on a straight peice of road I would come to the conclusion they were trying to wreck me, how could I possibly think someone impacting my car is doing it for my benifit alone?
If someone tries to bumpdraft me in a race, I consider it my right to hit the brakes hard and slow us both down.
SD.
Slightly OT: Another tactic Iv'e seen is when you go for a pass, get inside,side by side at apex, then the car on the outside does not give enough room for you to complete the pass, instead they turn into you on exit, I mean who exits a turn and stays on the inside of the track? anyone know what I mean?
Braking is the worst thing you can do, and will probally cause both the drives, in additional to the ones around you to wreck. The best thing you can do if you feel uncomfortable with it, spam "
" faces, and most likely the person behind 'ya will take the hint. If not just write "stop" or something similar, shouldn't be too hard to write on a straight
" faces, and most likely the person behind 'ya will take the hint. If not just write "stop" or something similar, shouldn't be too hard to write on a straight It's not the worst thing at all if you don't mind losing a bit of time in that one race While I certainly don't advocate brake testing and crashing into people who are doing something I don't like, if the "please don't make intentional contact with my car" bind and trying to move off the line to let off the gas don't work, one can expect to lose more time than they'd gain..
While I certainly don't advocate brake testing and crashing into people who are doing something I don't like, if the "please don't make intentional contact with my car" bind and trying to move off the line to let off the gas don't work, one can expect to lose more time than they'd gain..
"Bump drafters" - straight cheaters
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