having seeing i have to say patrese's fault ..sorry, but Ring was already there, didn't move his line and got hitted.
@Ring; Its looks hard to decide but I think your fault is little more than XRG driver. You have clear left, and same goes for XRG; he had almost clear left (you had no overlap), than at the braking zone he brakes little early than you as all XRG's do normally, you should known that & should have been prepared for that also.
I said hard to decide because the moment & position of the XRG when just starting brake (nose pointed left-according to the track longitudinal axis) is not what ppl generally do. This point is debatable but still since you hit the XRG, I can say that its mainly your fault because its braking zone.
And for the ppl who thinks its "big no no" to braking front of someone, you need to reconsider and think about the yellow flags, some abnormal conditions, IRL, etc. And its normal for ppl having different braking distances, so, be prepared for early braking at braking zones.
IMO, best thing is don't wait for the front car's stop lights, brake just little earlier and adjust the brake pressure by keeping the safe distance.
I said hard to decide because the moment & position of the XRG when just starting brake (nose pointed left-according to the track longitudinal axis) is not what ppl generally do. This point is debatable but still since you hit the XRG, I can say that its mainly your fault because its braking zone.
And for the ppl who thinks its "big no no" to braking front of someone, you need to reconsider and think about the yellow flags, some abnormal conditions, IRL, etc. And its normal for ppl having different braking distances, so, be prepared for early braking at braking zones.
IMO, best thing is don't wait for the front car's stop lights, brake just little earlier and adjust the brake pressure by keeping the safe distance.
@halo, the reason I didn't give fault to Ring is because he was going in a straight line, they were 3 deep in a line going into a turn. Even though he had space for less than a split second, you never try and take that space unless you want to get hit (like what happened)
Yes all were in brake point, but you brake together, you don't brake while turning to the outside of a turn just to make the turn better.. you were 3 wide going into the turn, you should consider that until you're out of the turn, not try and change it .. before the turn.
Better safe than sorry .. that's always the case.
Yes all were in brake point, but you brake together, you don't brake while turning to the outside of a turn just to make the turn better.. you were 3 wide going into the turn, you should consider that until you're out of the turn, not try and change it .. before the turn.
Better safe than sorry .. that's always the case.
@XCNuse, as I said, its hard to judge.
When I took the crash both sides point of view, I think I probably brake earlier than Ring does and look for another opportunity to pass XRG if I am faster & more consistent than him. A little early braking could save this crash.
For XRG's point of view; I would keep my car straight as possible (not to try gain extra space by moving far left) and try to take the turn as perfect as possible with this narrow entry.
Two POV together I concluded as I said above post, but its race, its happening most of time, they can say "race accident" "sorry" - "sorry" both sides and move on. Both Patrese and Ring are good drivers I believe, I dont think that they made this kind of mistakes so often. I count adrenalin, stress, environmental factors etc.
I also think that this example is good to show that sometimes things are not black & white (well most of the time)
When I took the crash both sides point of view, I think I probably brake earlier than Ring does and look for another opportunity to pass XRG if I am faster & more consistent than him. A little early braking could save this crash.
For XRG's point of view; I would keep my car straight as possible (not to try gain extra space by moving far left) and try to take the turn as perfect as possible with this narrow entry.
Two POV together I concluded as I said above post, but its race, its happening most of time, they can say "race accident" "sorry" - "sorry" both sides and move on. Both Patrese and Ring are good drivers I believe, I dont think that they made this kind of mistakes so often. I count adrenalin, stress, environmental factors etc.
I also think that this example is good to show that sometimes things are not black & white (well most of the time)
Thanks, I really appreciate your nice words
Oh no no I completely agree, accidents happen and that's what this is, I'm just saying, to keep stuff like this from happening (which I'm sure everyone does lol) all you have to do is know how to hold your line in a turn when people are near, even if they aren't necessarily right next to you.
All just a learning process..
All just a learning process..
IMO, the XRG braked for the corner, which he has every right to, and was in front at the time, the XFG also braked, but did not do so in time, and hit the XRG which spun it and put them both in the gravel.
At the end of the day the XRG was in front and taking note of his position on the track, should have been expected to brake when he did by other cars, plus if you crash into another car then surely the person who did the hit is at fault.
As others have said, a racing incident, but avoidable nonetheless.
At the end of the day the XRG was in front and taking note of his position on the track, should have been expected to brake when he did by other cars, plus if you crash into another car then surely the person who did the hit is at fault.
As others have said, a racing incident, but avoidable nonetheless.
see the development of accident XFG black car ahead of me but I respect him and do not come into line because I know what will happen, and leave a place redline XRG see that we are both left and enter into my line like I am there and not impact came back but when hanging side and stops at the same time in my line
and sorry my english is very bad
and sorry my english is very bad
Exactly XCNuse, I agree thats the safest way to do to avoid contacts & being cursed by LFS's famous damage dynamics.
Racing with tight margins is maybe good for IRL competitions but in LFS we are racing like we had some major disabilities (you can count lags, viewing differences, controller difficulties/limitations etc).
Racing with tight margins is maybe good for IRL competitions but in LFS we are racing like we had some major disabilities (you can count lags, viewing differences, controller difficulties/limitations etc).
He didn't come into your line at all, he overtook you, and was in front. 
Yea, that's why I almost always back off first because I'm not as crazy as the next person may be lol, I always brake early if anyone knows me, like I said, better safe than sorry!
I would much rather be pulling half second slower lap times than ruin an entire race!
@dan, he BARELY overtook them, top down he was like 3" at best bumper to bumper, that is hardly an overtake, especially if you're on the inside of a turn and braking late for an XRG.
If you are going to over take you have to follow through, just because you're ahead doesn't mean you have complete control. And yes, he totally went into his line, he cut both of the GTis off, you sure you're watching the right lap lol? It isn't until like 3/4ths the way through
3 sec in your case, yet you still seem to think you can comment on braking points.
I have much experience with this car more than 30,000 laps my settings also allow you to stop a lot later just did not expect that an experienced driver as patrese will move left after we have seen that there two cars
Yes but everyone will back me up on the fact that those brake points you're referring to are STRAIGHT LINE brake points.. that makes a HUGE difference.
A 5 degree change in direction.. twice.. will lengthen your braking distance far more than you think.
Fail!
Patrese... no offence but get off your high horse. Being able to hotlap does not equal race-craft or sportmanship.
Not saying you don`t possess those, i don`t know you to make such statements, but everyone has eyes to see, even if they`re not qualified to even look at you
.From what i can see you are a good driver, but you were partly at fault. Superhumans make mistakes too you know.
About line, what line to take? You were in the braking zone. He was braking late, you must`ve heard his engine rev. You`re not alone on track.
In these situations you don`t jump in front of your opponent. Even slightly. You thought he had room to move, he was afraid to move left, not wanting to hit Rising, thinking there is no room, things happen quickly at speed.
It`s easy to watch the replay at 0.125x and see what should`ve been done, but when you play it realtime..
If you were at 150m mark..
In a perfect scenario you would have kept your inside line, he would have braked earlier, and try to pass you inside as you would exit slower/go wide.. but it`s never perfect.
Racing incident
. Case closed. The winner: Rising, who had some hindsight.I really can`t put the blame on anyone of you. No reason to have an awkward situation, at most it is a lesson to learn.
You both could`ve had a great time if you didn`t crash. Something worthy for a "good pass" message
. Now you`ll have something funny to remember, and maybe respect eachother more. I imagine you smiling ":-)" to eachother when you meet on a server saying "look at the shitstorm we created on the forum" 
. Something funny happened tonight, seeing your usename, i remembered this.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIhGJyLR6TI+1
Shhh! :hide:
Oh damn.
haha, it's okay it took me like 5 minutes until I figured out what was going on lol I thought they were talking about T1 and 2 the whole time haha!
I'm not the one who was complaining about the incident and I haven't bothered to respond untill a person with a influental position passed judgment on a event that he clearly isn't qualified to pass judgement on.
If you care to look at the replay again, you will find i looked left twice, the second time knowing it was clear for me to go back on the racing line.
I had FULLY (1/2m) overtaken by that time and therefore had every right to be where i was.
And yes, i still would have made it round the corner unlike XCNuse who may have got his brakes set differently or whatever.
I don't even care if i was right or wrong, but what does bother me are backseat drivers who think they know better but haven't produced
any evidence of that.
I mean, would you listen to someones advice about where or where not to brake who is nearly 3 seconds slower than you?
Writing this sitting on a Shetland pony
We aren't bashing you man! We are simply saying due to the positions of all the cars, you should have kept your line no matter how far ahead you are, if you pass.. you keep your line, you don't cut them off ASAP. That's just how it is.
What does that have anything to do with me? And why would you bash me saying that I'm 3 seconds slower than you are when you don't even know if I am or not, even if I am why would that make a single difference.. on any account?!
What does that have anything to do with me? And why would you bash me saying that I'm 3 seconds slower than you are when you don't even know if I am or not, even if I am why would that make a single difference.. on any account?!
Slightly OT, but how can we tell that you looked left, i believe you when you say you did, but i just don't see the drivers heads turn, not just this replay, i mean in any replay, including one i made myself where i deliberately looked around constantly for the whole race, yet my drivers head never moved when i watched the replay back again.
Plus don't bash moderators, its a bad thing to do y0
Plus don't bash moderators, its a bad thing to do y0
It makes a difference because you think you know where to brake when you don't.
Simple.
I also don't know what you are talking about "direction change".
I'm beginning to think you are watching the wrong lap.
Just look at the bloody steering wheel and tell me about "direction change".
If you are talkings about the tiny steering input to the left to get a better angle (after i cleared Ring) and call that direction change, then we live on a different planet.
I see the lovely American flag next to your name, but something makes me think you are Bulgarian.
Simple.
I also don't know what you are talking about "direction change".
I'm beginning to think you are watching the wrong lap.
Just look at the bloody steering wheel and tell me about "direction change".
If you are talkings about the tiny steering input to the left to get a better angle (after i cleared Ring) and call that direction change, then we live on a different planet.
I see the lovely American flag next to your name, but something makes me think you are Bulgarian.
I can. Have you tried chase view though rear window?
Okay Patrese you can listen to me now..
Not that this has anything to do with the thread, but
I just did 11 HLVC compatible laps and uploaded it to LFSW, my PB now in XRGT at BL1GP Sunny is .. and I can't upload hotlaps with test patch 15
Old Laptime: 1:36.07
New Laptime: 1:34.610
Patrese Lap: 1:33.65
Now.. no longer do you have to listen to someone who is "3" seconds slower.. especially for someone that everyone here knows isn't a RWD type person.
HLVC Meaning the lap is 100% clean, no interference, no drafting, no nothing.
Next time I wouldn't be so quick to judge someone like that, it could come and bite you in the rear end one day!
(replay & RAF uploaded incase you don't believe me...)
PR done on final lap 11 (only intended to do 10 but.. I figured why not)
But really I think it's just your attitude towards me, when .. I am American, I live in Georgia.. always have my entire life.
And yes, steering input = directional change no matter who you are.
On topic however, my brake points were still before 110m to get the turn in right. Also I was braking in a straight line, not turning.
Not that this has anything to do with the thread, but
I just did 11 HLVC compatible laps and uploaded it to LFSW, my PB now in XRGT at BL1GP Sunny is .. and I can't upload hotlaps with test patch 15
Old Laptime: 1:36.07
New Laptime: 1:34.610
Patrese Lap: 1:33.65
Now.. no longer do you have to listen to someone who is "3" seconds slower.. especially for someone that everyone here knows isn't a RWD type person.
HLVC Meaning the lap is 100% clean, no interference, no drafting, no nothing.
Next time I wouldn't be so quick to judge someone like that, it could come and bite you in the rear end one day!
(replay & RAF uploaded incase you don't believe me...)
PR done on final lap 11 (only intended to do 10 but.. I figured why not)
But really I think it's just your attitude towards me, when .. I am American, I live in Georgia.. always have my entire life.
And yes, steering input = directional change no matter who you are.
On topic however, my brake points were still before 110m to get the turn in right. Also I was braking in a straight line, not turning.
My or redline xrg car foult
(93 posts, started )
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG