Well, this is a shock to me. Got a new screen. New place. Wanted to race some, so i got into iRacing. It's pretty great. But something was off. Just the feeling. It wasn't as... well... fulfilling as something in my past was.

To be honest, I've gone from game to game. NR2003, LFS, rFactor, iRacing. Each time i find a great open racing (except iRacing), end up having issues for a while, then come back to find that everything i know is gone.

I really don't know what there is I could do, but I don't want the soul of CTRA to die. I would rather fight a pointless battle to bring it back from the dead than see it gone forever. Everyone here knows they miss it.

So... my question is... is there any server that will do the same for us? Will they recreate the feeling that CTRA did? Or will someone pick up CTRA themselves and revive it? Or will it's creator keep it dead forever?

LFS just isn't the same without CTRA. LFS and CTRA go together like .... well... like... a computer and monitor go together. It's just pointless without the other.

So... will we just let it die? Not CTRA itself.. but that feeling. Or will we recreate it? Rebuild it? Renew it?

.... probably not. But i'd rather we did... =/

LFS without CTRA is much better in my opinion. CTRA was, and apparently still is, overrated.

If you really must get your "points fix", try LR|Race Center 1.. start in XFG/XRG and move up from there to other cars.

It's not really so much the "points" that i enjoyed.

=) I just liked knowing that there was a place that generally had full servers that were properly managed where people drove remotely sane, and i didn't have to join a team or a league. I could just plop in and everyone would be like "Hey whats up!"

I could care less for my CTRA "license"

Also... the only places i'm finding are in languages i don't understand.

> > Also, ^_^ The bump and jump server was a nice little breather from real racing.

I liked the clean racing. I don't really have time for leagues and such, so just a pick-up race every now and then was a really good thing. I barely ever play LFS nowadays...too bad really, I really like it.

well... i can't seem to get a good pickup race in either rFactor or LFS. I could always do iRacing but then i'd only get one race done in an hour....

My only problem with the CTRA system was that it was a major grind for us middle-pack finishers. I was forced to level up on cars I didn't really like and I don't think I ever actually qualified for the second server. I don't mind having to prove I'm not a wrecker, but a bit more of a reward for racing cleanly would've been nice.

The racing on the LR servers is very similar to the CTRA system, but it does seem to have some extra features that reward individual performance as well as that of the group (if what I've been told is true). So you might get loads more points for actually winning, but you're also rewarded for beating your previous bests.

LFS Forum General Consensus - CTRA sucked, thats why every driver used to race on there.

Quote from Intermediate07 :

LR Race Center is only good for TBO lovers ...

How did you work that out? It's usually full of of XFG / XRG drivers with the odd points-whore going in a TBO car.

Quote from teedot :

LFS without CTRA is much better in my opinion. CTRA was, and apparently still is, overrated.

Agreed.

Quote from Dajmin :

My only problem with the CTRA system was that it was a major grind for us middle-pack finishers. I was forced to level up on cars I didn't really like and I don't think I ever actually qualified for the second server. I don't mind having to prove I'm not a wrecker, but a bit more of a reward for racing cleanly would've been nice.

Agreed.

Quote from teedot :

The racing on the LR servers is very similar to the CTRA system, but it does seem to have some extra features that reward individual performance as well as that of the group (if what I've been told is true). So you might get loads more points for actually winning, but you're also rewarded for beating your previous bests.

I think the LR server is great and actually a better place to race than the CTRA servers ever were because at peak hours it is really really packed; the server allows more people to race than the CTRA servers did. The bigger the grid the better, IMO.

However, from the few times I've been on it seemed to me that it would take me forever to increase my ranking enough to drive the TBO's (I'm also a middle-pack finisher). But there's great racing to be had in the XFG/XRG as well, so...

Quote from Intermediate07 :

LR Race Center is only good for TBO lovers

How did you get to that conclusion? I've only ever seen one (1) guy drive a TBO car on there, on a full server.

I for one hope the CTRA doesn't come back

*giggles*

Well, the LR server is a great place to be, but I wished they separated the TBO cars and slower cars. Usually the TBO drivers canot drive at all, and I am amazed they even managed to get those 800 points, because they sure as hell canot drive.
But as you say, I have seen one of them drive great, but the others are not even worth mention.

Without CTRA (bump & jump), we have lost small circuit race, on "AU autocross".
At this day, the few remaining race on AU are drift / without people..
Personnally, i think LFS have lost a part of interest without CTRA.
Perhaps we need official server.

Quote from The Very End :

Well, the LR server is a great place to be, but I wished they separated the TBO cars and slower cars. Usually the TBO drivers canot drive at all, and I am amazed they even managed to get those 800 points, because they sure as hell canot drive.

+10000 to that. Thats the main reason why I don't race there that much anymore.. there's always some no-lifer, who have got enough points for teh XRT he/she can't handle, ruining other peoples races

Quote from Tukko :

+10000 to that. Thats the main reason why I don't race there that much anymore.. there's always some no-lifer, who have got enough points for teh XRT he/she can't handle, ruining other peoples races

Never seen that happen

Another "Oh my.... No more CTRA no more LFS.... QQ"

Jesus... Its dead.. Simple as that

To the question will we renew it/rebuild it, well don't know about us. However, Becky is creating a similar but a lot better system Blue 2. So yes, it should be back and it should be a lot better.

In the mean time, enjoy LFS as it is right now. The update shouldn't be too far away now IMO, therefore it will bring new fun and a new learning curve if the new physics are brought it. Giving a lot more life for LFS.

So yeah. Forget CTRA, everyone was happy playing the game as it was when CTRA was not there, and no one was moaning.

Quote from DevilDare :

Another "Oh my.... No more CTRA no more LFS.... QQ"

Jesus... Its dead.. Simple as that

To the question will we renew it/rebuild it, well don't know about us. However, Becky is creating a similar but a lot better system Blue 2. So yes, it should be back and it should be a lot better.

In the mean time, enjoy LFS as it is right now. The update shouldn't be too far away now IMO, therefore it will bring new fun and a new learning curve if the new physics are brought it. Giving a lot more life for LFS.

So yeah. Forget CTRA, everyone was happy playing the game as it was when CTRA was not there, and no one was moaning.

hobba hobba hobba... new kind of CTRA?! good news!

Quote from Jakg :

LFS Forum General Consensus - CTRA sucked, thats why every driver used to race on there.

I don't think that this is the "general consensus" at all.

CTRA was great while it was there and it certainly was a big shock to see it end. But it gets annoying when people like the OP here say "LFS is pointless without CTRA".

It's gone, get over it.

I still miss BnJ

Quote from Töki (HUN) :

I still miss BnJ

i don't... it never went away for me.

I miss CRC

Back in the demo days CRC was the shiznit!

booo I demand answers!

Quote from DevilDare :

Becky is creating a similar but a lot better system Blue 2.

Blue 2 shouldn't be compared to CTRA, it is a rethink of the base concept "How to improve LFS via INSIM server management?" without the baggage of what the X-System became. It's a fresh start, with a totally different approach to managing LFS servers by taking stock and looking at what LFS needs now, rather than evolving the route the existing concept took.

Having said that i've not been working on it at all for some months. I have been having a life! YAY me, but not so good for development of personal projects.

In time, should my life allow me the flexibility to work on personal projects again I may use the neural network insim core i've got almost finished for a smaller project such as giving LFS some social networking tools, and from there gradually expand it. Rather than trying to deliver a whole new system in one hit.

At the moment however i'm more concerned about things away from LFS. I'm very happy with where my life is at the moment, and the burden of developing major systems that aren't part of my day job is not something I can easily squeeze into what is otherwise a full and enriched lifestyle.

Perfectly understandable Becky, and good to hear thingsh turns out right.

About this sytem, Blue 2 or what it was called, it's still under development yes, but it's going slow due to real life matters?
Again, understandable and I do not say "FINISH THIS NAOW!" , just curious on what we can expect of this system if it were to be released?
I know nothing about this insim but would be great fun knowing something more of it, something you can reveal?

Quote from The Very End :

Perfectly understandable Becky, and good to hear thingsh turns out right.

About this sytem, Blue 2 or what it was called, it's still under development yes, but it's going slow due to real life matters?
Again, understandable and I do not say "FINISH THIS NAOW!" , just curious on what we can expect of this system if it were to be released?
I know nothing about this insim but would be great fun knowing something more of it, something you can reveal?

Yes real life is taking precedent, as you know Tor I have a partner in my life at the moment and we're almost living together (technically, we have our own places) - she puts up with me coding all day whilst working (I work from home), and I somehow don't feel that me then coding in the evening is going to go down very well. That in itself basically curtails development.

On top of that what time I do get to myself I am chosing to use for different things than coding right now, also i'm considering retraining myself to take a new career path atm.

If Blue 2 does appear (incidentally, it would likely appear under a different name, "Blue 2" is the project name, then it would appear in stages:

So the first thing you would get is the ability to instant message and email directly to any LFS server, with full integration to an instant messaging client (Win/Mac/Linux) and a web page. The idea being teams could keep in touch with each other whatever server they go on, and endurance racing teams could communicate with their driver. Of course, the whole thing would be designed to work without nuisance factor, so you wont get spammed or interrupted whilst you are racing.

The neural network core, which is almost complete, would support connecting to every LFS server - but it would be up to server operators to chose to opt into the system. Demo/S1 and S2 would all be supported.

From there additional functionality could be built into the system over time. I planned, for instance, to inplement rolling starts, warm up laps, and safety car procedures - fully configurable and controllable by the server admin. Standardisation of these features would meen all drivers know what is going on and would know the procedure in any league without having to train drivers in the protocols etc.

In addition to extra server rules like "no auto gears", "use 2 tyre compounds in the race" etc etc, the standard features would also be available like track rotation, league scoring and web hosting, team web pages with stats and full social network integration (such as twitter feeds etc).

Ultimately, I planned to provide a new means of tiering that was designed to share responsibility between all operators and address the issues raised by those who disliked the CTRA approach of a self contained tiered system.

My final vision would see it effectively as the primary web portal for LFS in all but forum, skin uploading, and lfs spectator (which I was also considering redoing but in true 3D, I have a prototype here which proved the concept), by which time I would hand it over either to the devs or to the LFS community as open source.

That was the plan anyway.

Great post there!

Yeah, I have been stalking you a little on the facebook and I don't think it's a secret that you are searching for something new, fresh, or anything that ain't your old work-place

The system you describe, sounds absolutely brilliant. I love the mail / instant message thingy you mention. The only thing that I would question would be the rescources it used on these opreations, not the computer but the network itself. The speed wouldn't be a problem since the game uses like 4-5 kb/s download / upload when playing, and only time it increases are at track chance, layout change and skin download. With all these features as instant messaging and such it probally would demand some more.. or .. well I have no clue on these things, and I have enough line for it anyway, just question if it demands some extra kb/s.

As the other features, I would love to see them done with insim, but at same time I think it should be work for the developers to do. These are fairly small things, yet probally very hard to code. Rolling starts and the other things would be bloody awesome, but 1 - we would need a larger oval (even if rolling start works perfectly on normal road tracks) , 2 - again I think that would be a bitch to program in insim, and since it's such a great feature it should be implented in LFS.

The message system would be great. Some kind of system that would link up to sites, storage areas or other places where these messages were saved. But within game, or in the insim they would be able to be readed. Lets say it's linked to some kind of forum, storage, database or whatever for team X. Now the team leader desides he want to notify the team on a matter, so he makes a message in this folder. Lets say that all the other drivers were on a server with this insim applied on. Now they would get a little mail icon in one of the corners. The others could then push this icon to veiw the inbox, and then read the message. They could also reply to it from here.

I think it could be a very usefull feature for leagues, or other happening when you need to reach the members but don't have time waiting for the to read the forum, instead they could race and read the message between a race, or simply as they races / specates.

The entire Blue 2 design revolves around a neural network. With Franky supporting the project and a few of the big teams already willing to run nodes on the network there is already sufficient bandwidth to connect to the entirety of LFS.

Basically Blue 2 doesnt run on 1 computer, it runs on a network of computers all over the world and all sharing the workload.

Quote :

I think that would be a bitch to program in insim

Very little of the Blue 2 concept has not already been done in one form or another, it's just either never been done right or in a universal framework allowing it to run concurrently on so many servers at once. Even warm up laps have been done before (by myself and MoE).

Quote :

Lets say it's linked to some kind of forum, storage, database or whatever for team X. Now the team leader desides he want to notify the team on a matter

That's aboslutely it, using 2 different types of messaging (IM and Mail) the system will allow communication ingame, all will integrate to a Skype/MSN style IM client available on multiple platforms, and the web portal - with group/league/personal messaging possible and in theory it should even be possible to link it into team forums (provided the teams are using the Blue 2 web portal rather than their own for their forums).