Quote from Gentlefoot :

Not sure I agree with that. I think the CTRA system resulted in a generally higher standard of driving than other servers that were less well controlled.

It was a principle motivation on UKCT's part to try to introduce a higher driving standard on public servers. League racing frequently had meticulous marshalling, but before STCC and then CTRA servers public server admining amounted to simply kicking and banning. Often peer voted. We set about changing two cultures - admin responsibility and driver accountability.

It's easy to forget or ignore what the culture was like before the CTRA, but I think the days of re-joining the track in the path of other drivers are over now. That was one of many culture changes that the CTRA, I think, can claim responsibility for in public server racing.

Quote from Gentlefoot :

However, the fact that it was so popular did tend to keep the numbers lower on the other servers and smaller grids always result in a higher standard of racing simply because the drivers who are idiots stand out like sore thumbs.

The CTRA attracted drivers from across the entire spectrum of the LFS community. Whatever you have to say about the standards of driving in the CTRA public servers can be, generally, said of any other public server at the time. It's long gone, now, and I've no longer any emotional attachment to it. I can reflect on the CTRA days and simply recognise that we worked with what we had, and what we had to work with was whoever turned up to race. Nothing more, nothing less. We did our best for as long as we could, and then when it died, it was very very dead.

@ 5haz, say what you want about the driving standards in CTRA, but there were 2x as many reports filed against you in the CTRA system than you filed yourself.

Quote from SamH :

@ 5haz, say what you want about the driving standards in CTRA, but there were 2x as many reports filed against you in the CTRA system than you filed yourself.

Because I took to telling other drivers what I thought about them, obviously they didn't like what I said. This was mainly due to frustration at having absolutely no way to get people who clearly should not be racing online off the grid, regardless of how many reports you filed against them.

And I only ever filed about 2 reports, because the system was so difficult to maintain(?), reports were largely ineffective. My page on the site said I never had any reports filed against me anyway. :rolleyes:

This is a problem with popular servers running fancy insim systems, they often punish those who turn up to have a proper race and get pissed off rather than those who are not in control of their cars or are completely oblivious to the presence of other cars.

The problem was/is not unique to CTRA, any popular server is usually full of idiots, racing with +26 grids on road courses simply does not work. Especially if half the grid haven't even yet mastered their cars in a straight line, or don't understand what blue flags mean.

I have since learn't to give popular servers a wide berth, and I have a lot more fun as a result.

Bump and Jump was one exception though.

I agree with you (we ran smaller grids on lower ranked servers) in the main, but it's too easy to criticize everyone else's driving. My experience - and it is VAST experience - is that the drivers who are quickest to criticize other drivers are in fact the ones lacking fundamental skills. Whether it's basic driving ability or lack of spatial awareness, bullish and irresponsible driving or a multitude of other possible driver facets, they are the ones that lack SOMEthing.

Considering I've reviewed literally thousands of LFS "incidents", one might expect me to be pretty jaded about the standards of driving in LFS. I think I've seen the worst that the community has to offer (and had the pleasure of banning it ) but in fact I'm satisfied that an overwhelming majority of active LFSers do actually try to drive well. They try to learn from their mistakes, they DO share what they learn with others, and they are a good bunch.

As time went on, I became uncomfortable with the power that the CTRA accumulated. I wasn't happy that a ban from the CTRA system could render an LFS licence almost useless to some license holders. Too many people regarded the CTRA as the ONLY place to race, and while we set about doing our best to deliver an amazing service, we never expected 2 years down the road to still be the only server system operating at that level.

That kind of responsibility is something I'll take on if you pay me, but ONLY if you pay me. I'm not a megalomaniac, and on a very fundamental level the CTRA became something that carried very little appeal to me. Not because of the system, not because of the racers, but because of the lack of alternatives.

Now the CTRA has gone, other systems have arrived on the scene to try to fill the gap, and I'm really glad about that. I know that much of the ethos we tried to develop in the CTRA days has been adopted by others, and that works for me. I think we set a tone, but I'm glad that it's up to others now to run with it.

Sometimes I think what a really powerful and popular system of servers needs to run properly is a megalomaniac, so what if a ban results in a user not being able to race on the one server they ever raced on, if they were driving in such a way that resulted in them being banned then they deserve it IMO.

I know systems where certain trusted members who frequent the server are given limited admin powers, the result being that any idiotic driving is dealt with in a matter of seconds rather than not at all, making the whole racing experience much less frustrating for everyone. Of course the whole thing relies on trust, but from what I've seen, these limited admins can be relied upon to be level headed enough.

The rest of CTRA was a grand idea, the system for dealing with bad driving is the only thing that I really really hated.

But... that's just it....

Sure CTRA is dead... but the object of having a public server we can all enjoy surely can't be dead entirely. If it is, this game will eventually fall to the likes of iRacing. (I've had more continuous fun races on there than I've had on here. Actually, I've only had one true experience as fun as CTRA and that was on Old-skool racing or something like that. Pretty fun. Only raced KY1 though. =/

Race 1 was my personal favorite. Alway enjoyed it. Occasionally won, occasionally didn't. I didn't worry about my license. I just liked the close racing, the fun layouts, the enjoyable atmosphere. And the BnJ server was always a great stress relief. Much better than these now annoying cruise servers. Seriously, they just remind me of my obnoxious cousin. "Oh lets not race... lets just cruise..." ..... but this is Need for Spee... "Oh... nonono... we're not racing. We're just cruising. Look at me and my... JAGuARR"......

I mean.. if that sounds offending to gays... sorry.. but he does talk like that.
> > So... my point is.. even if i have to do it myself, is it possible to bring back the soul of CTRA. Not the licenses, not the points, but the racing itself. Is that possible? I mean, even in it's prime, NR2003 had OpenSpeedway and TeamXtremeRacing (i think thats what it was call o.O), the two most popular public servers at the time. OpenSpeedway STILL exists, and i have the joy to be a part of a 30 man race. A 30 man race, with NO server browser. Sierra took that offline. Now if you're still getting 30 people in at one time, you're doin something right. But i realize it was all because the racing was close, you know it's there, and people will join.

We just need a server like that. Sound impossible, but can be done... and i personally think it should be, but hey, thats just one guys opinion.

Quote from SamH :

I agree with you (we ran smaller grids on lower ranked servers) in the main, but it's too easy to criticize everyone else's driving. My experience - and it is VAST experience - is that the drivers who are quickest to criticize other drivers are in fact the ones lacking fundamental skills. Whether it's basic driving ability or lack of spatial awareness, bullish and irresponsible driving or a multitude of other possible driver facets, they are the ones that lack SOMEthing.

I agree. It's a matter of temperament.

Quote from Intermediate07 :

Yes sorry I forgot to add FWD

BTW: here is a short video about the FOX Junkies server ^^

WATCH

That's why i can't finnish one race there . The LR is better for me, the CTRA was the best