Quote from IlGuercio :

Free of charge,since you like free things:

See you in the forum,looks like you guys cant move an inch from here.
I know,i should quit it...but its such fun to dismantle some people's arguments.

So I think it isn't being so funny lately...

New track awesome, so do we get to see the rest of the V1 calendar as well?

V1 doesn't have a calendar.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Bob's post

Great post Bob. I agree.

The new track is setting a precedent in LFS. It's a real track and it's laser scanned. You can only assume at some point other tracks and cars will be added, and since Scavier are moving towards greater realism and detail then it's a safe bet that laser scanning will probably become the new standard for tracks inside LFS.

Concerning the price- laser scanning costs money. iRacing already charge per track prices which compare with or exceed the cost of S3. We don't know how many cars and tracks S3 will include but the more of them there are, the greater the value S3 will be. It's premature (and extremely immature) to start shouting about the cost of S3 since we don't have any idea what it's going to include.

Quote from Ger Roady :

So i go at this point then and play GP4 again with poor Rain

GP4 is still the benchmark for rain IMO. Drying lines have not been done better since.

Quote from Takumi_lfs :

Where is the promised wannabe rain? falling off parts? better graphics or whatever. They promised us alot but none got implented into the game. Why are they promising us those stuff if they arent even busy with it?

I don't find the new business plan bad, but the biggest problem I can see emerging from that is that people will now HAVE the right to moan if development is slow.

Till now people who payed for S2 didn't really have to right to moan because they bought what they could already have access to, with an added promise that things were going to evolve.

If now they buy S3 being able to access only one more track and a car, with the promise that more content will be added, they WILL have to right to moan that development is slow and that they want more cars and tracks faster. There has to be some kind of line drawn by Scawen when S3 is open for buying.

The only way I can see this working is saying that with the 12 pounds or so you will have the right additionally to only a track and a car, with MAYBE some others added in time (but again some people will feel they have the right to 2 and others the right to 6 add-ons). This may work but MANY people will feel it is expensive (not that I find that expensive). Or they just lower the prices, and start selling the tracks and cars separately as they come. This could be a win-win because everyone will buy them and it will pressure them to release more content to get the money flowing. And why not, with this business model they could contract people to do just one track or a car and get their cut.

Hope I made myself clear...

Quote from PedraumF :

IMO, S1 for £8, S2 for £8 and S3 for £8... £36 is way too much.

And about these "If you don't want to pay, fine" guys, I totally disagree... just because I don't want it expensive, or because it's not getting the way I think it's better, it means I have to shut up and get sad?

Or you can understand and have fun.

Or you can somehow convince them to make your ideal game.

come on use some common sense, since when did a game was made under a democracy.

It is nice to see that LFS is not dying, thanks to S3! But one thing bothers me, will S3 be much more demanding to your hardware? I will pay S3 license without any problems but im not going to be happy if i need to buy new CPU/GPU to make it run nicely...

Quote from sosna :

I dont think that someone who set it aside is easilly going to return though.At least that happened to me.

Thats what you (in general) dont understand!

Then why are you here.

Quote :

New track new car, nice...
Where is the promised wannabe rain? falling off parts? better graphics or whatever. They promised us alot but none got implented into the game. Why are they promising us those stuff if they arent even busy with it? We got this stupid barrier bug, no fix? Oh wait, just dont hit them. Riiiiiiiight.

Im surprised the dev's haven't given up based on the totally crap attitude from 95% of the people posting here... LFS has new things coming yet people always start bitching moaning and complaining.

It's pretty simple really.... If you aren't happy with the speed of development or the new things they are bringing to us, uninstall LFS from your computer, remove LFS forums from your favourites and be gone.

Quote from Paranoid Android :

If now they buy S3 being able to access only one more track and a car, with the promise that more content will be added, they WILL have to right to moan that development is slow and that they want more cars and tracks faster. There has to be some kind of line drawn by Scawen when S3 is open for buying.

Get it into your head,you don't have any right.
You can either spit or swallow,nothing else.
Wanna buy S3?Do it.
Want to save money?Leave it there.
Playing LFS is NOT an inalienable right,what should i say to convince you.
You seem to have some serious problems understanding what is your right to do.
illepall

Quote from teedot :

Im surprised the dev's haven't given up based on the totally crap attitude from 95% of the people posting here... LFS has new things coming yet people always start bitching moaning and complaining.

It's pretty simple really.... If you aren't happy with the speed of development or the new things they are bringing to us, uninstall LFS from your computer, remove LFS forums from your favourites and be gone.

If it was me i had already blocked their license just for fun.
If you dont appreciate my work you dont deserve the RIGHT to use it.
Simple as that.Remember that this is a LICENSE,you aren't even buying anything for real.

Quote from IlGuercio :

Get it into your head,you don't have any right.
You can either spit or swallow,nothing else.
Wanna buy S3?Do it.
Want to save money?Leave it there.
Playing LFS is NOT an inalienable right,what should i say to convince you.
You seem to have some serious problems understanding what is your right to do.
illepall

re-read his post.

Quote from Scud81 :

I will pay S3 license without any problems but im not going to be happy if i need to buy new CPU/GPU to make it run nicely...

I was missing that...really.
So they should not only release a FREE product but also give you some money to buy a new system.
Weapon of choice,i think that's the answer...

Quote from JJ72 :

re-read his post.

Why?
Is just the same old story in a different suit...
I don't like it,i want them to rush,not too many tracks,i want more,he wants less.
I mean,do you really think that acting like so is one of our rights?

Quote from IlGuercio :

Why?
Is just the same old story in a different suit...
I don't like it,i want them to rush,not too many tracks,i want more,he wants less.
I mean,do you really think that acting like so is one of our rights?

cause he was actually defending the game.....not complaining.

Quote from IlGuercio :

Why?
Is just the same old story in a different suit...
I don't like it,i want them to rush,not too many tracks,i want more,he wants less.
I mean,do you really think that acting like so is one of our rights?

Re-read it again. I didn't moan for an instant, nor have I ever in the 6 years I've followed Lfs. And I'm not about to...I'm just exposing the possible risks that this change will maybe bring, but on the other hand I'm sure Scawen will figure it out. What I'm saying is till now they were never exposed to any rightful criticism, and they should keep it that way. I've seen the lynching mob running around creating chaos in the forums far too many times to want them to have the slightest excuse to start over.

I fail to see what made you react that way in my post, other than your defending rage fest. But please read it one more time, and if you still don't get it, just ignore it.

Quote from Scud81 :

It is nice to see that LFS is not dying, thanks to S3! But one thing bothers me, will S3 be much more demanding to your hardware? I will pay S3 license without any problems but im not going to be happy if i need to buy new CPU/GPU to make it run nicely...

Not in foreseeable future, like explained here, internal version of the game (graphics, physics, all features) is not going to suddenly become "S3", just the content. So same graphics for now. It is likely that Rockingham will be little heavier because of increased detail.

So I was right in thinking you had aces up your sleeves I'm very happy about that (that you had aces I mean ) The OP in this thread still looks too much as an afterthought but with a real track coming (and laser scanned) I'm certainly not complaining.

The screenshots are gorgeous and I'm really looking forward to drive on this track. And in LFS of course

Hope that'll be soon enough In the meanwhile I'll just wait for the new tyre physics patch

Quote from Paranoid Android :

I don't find the new business plan bad, but the biggest problem I can see emerging from that is that people will now HAVE the right to moan if development is slow....

etc, etc....

People will moan whether they have any right to or not, that's a given.

From experience, the Dev's have been pretty tolerant of all the complaining, it's only when it reaches a head that they tend to respond. From all the whinging posts i've read, i get the distinct impression quite a few folk in here simple don't "get" LFS, they don't understand the ethos behind the game, they don't understand the working practices, they don't understand the basic character of the game/it's community or the Developers, they don't understand the amount of work involved, or the spirit in which the whole enterprise lives. LFS is a bit like a cottage industry, or a friendly little country pub that only serves real ales and home made food. It's not a place that endlessly churns out insipid fizzy lagers or mass produced tasteless boil in the bag chicken tikka. It's a niche product, it's a quality product, it's a hand built, coach built Rolls Royce or Morgan car. LFS isn't Toyota or GM, it's a bespoke product, it's a thing of quality, not quantity.

I personally find it odd that people are complaining about the pricing of S3 if it only contains 1 track and 1 new car. I've happily paid twice that for only 1 plane for FSX, and over 4 times that for a bit of scenery. I guess the masses have been spoilt by the superfast developements of large faceless companies releasing addon after addon for all the big budget games out there. However, in my experience, these addons only have a shelf life of a few weeks at most, then the whole game is consigned to the back of a dusty cupboard. Not so with LFS, at least, not for the diehards who "get it".

(I'm not preaching to you Andriod, i know you already know all this stuff )

^ a perfect summary I guess

Some people just don't get it though.

Quote from Scawen :

Anyway this frees us from having to "finish" S2 before releasing S3 content. It's not clear what "finishing S2" means any more. The LFS software and content can just keep improving and we can gradually do the features and improvements that we want to over time.

One thing we discussed was the possibility of just calling the software "Live for Speed 0.6A" and forget about the Alpha / Beta tag. It's very stable software so doesn't really need those tags.

This is REALLY great news!

TBH I think if you announced this in a more visible way some time ago we would have spared tons of whining and threads that have poisoned the community of forum goers.

Quote from Paranoid Android :

The only way I can see this working is saying that with the 12 pounds or so you will have the right additionally to only a track and a car, with MAYBE some others added in time (but again some people will feel they have the right to 2 and others the right to 6 add-ons). This may work but MANY people will feel it is expensive (not that I find that expensive). Or they just lower the prices, and start selling the tracks and cars separately as they come. This could be a win-win because everyone will buy them and it will pressure them to release more content to get the money flowing. And why not, with this business model they could contract people to do just one track or a car and get their cut.

Hope I made myself clear...

I think that is the part you wanted to clarify the most.
Think i got your point but i reckon that it has always been like this.
Devs realease a new stage(S3 now)with just some of the final releases.
They do tell us that updates are to be expected but,obviously,they can't tell us the precise date on which the content will be added.
I think that everyone who is thinking to buy something has to read the conditions,and can't complain if development is slow.
Are there contents to be expected:yes.
Are they coming soon:no one knows,the variables are so much and they're not just related to the game itself.
My point is you can't complain about the amount of time,what is slow for you may be superfast for them,especially if we keep in mind that the group is only made out of 3 people.

Quote from IlGuercio :

I think that is the part you wanted to clarify the most.
Think i got your point but i reckon that it has always been like this.
Devs realease a new stage(S3 now)with just some of the final releases.
They do tell us that updates are to be expected but,obviously,they can't tell us the precise date on which the content will be added.
I think that everyone who is thinking to buy something has to read the conditions,and can't complain if development is slow.
Are there contents to be expected:yes.
Are they coming soon:no one knows,the variables are so much and they're not just related to the game itself.
My point is you can't complain about the amount of time,what is slow for you may be superfast for them,especially if we keep in mind that the group is only made out of 3 people.

The problem is your thinking is morally correct but logically flawed. Till now there was no expectation of more content, just more development of the software. The one time there was in S2 with the Scirocco you can see where that lead to. Till now criticism could be cut down to its roots because it had no right to exist. People had already got what they bought for, and the rest was just immaturity, misunderstanding or opinions on the general direction of the product in the future. If the devs make people buy a bit of content AND a promise of more content, they will open themselves wide open to criticism. I do NOT want that for them, but people would have the right to give their opinion in the product they invested in and have expectations from.

Again, I'm sure the devs have thought this through and will find a way to protect themselves if they haven't already. It is too simple of a loophole to miss.