it's no rocket science. some racers just need a little longer than others to be convinced to buy a license. if someone really likes to race and has the money he WILL buy a license. you cannot honestly think, that an active racer with enough money will stick to the demo because he is satisfied with blackwood and the 3 cars. i am sure the devs have thought a lot about this. this marketing strategy is imho very effective AND very sympathic. this unrestricted demo IS LFS.
I do indeed, i feel if he was as you put it "satisfied", why would he spend £30 if he was "satisfied"?
But thats your opinion and your entitled to it so i think we can leave it at that.
Ok, i think I'm going to buy S2 soon, but
DON'T take away anything from demo racers...
ok 3 tracks and 3 cars are much...
but, first of all, the car park isn't really a 'track'
rally, is what you need for that feel...
and the normal track for tarmac races...
and second of all
3 cars are much but 2 cars are nothing...
you take away everything from the demo then...
and s2 license is actually more like an expension pack if you ask me...
that is just for the REAL simracers,
3rd of all
if the demoracers will buy s2 sooner, without having a REAL idea how the game is, they will think the game is boring earlier and there will be more crashers...
So it will only be better for the cash for the devs, but i thought i've heard that they cared more about the players, so resulting in less happy devs...
So... SAY NO to less game in demo, you make the devs happyer...
!
DON'T take away anything from demo racers...
ok 3 tracks and 3 cars are much...
but, first of all, the car park isn't really a 'track'
rally, is what you need for that feel...
and the normal track for tarmac races...
and second of all
3 cars are much but 2 cars are nothing...
you take away everything from the demo then...
and s2 license is actually more like an expension pack if you ask me...
that is just for the REAL simracers,
3rd of all
if the demoracers will buy s2 sooner, without having a REAL idea how the game is, they will think the game is boring earlier and there will be more crashers...
So it will only be better for the cash for the devs, but i thought i've heard that they cared more about the players, so resulting in less happy devs...
So... SAY NO to less game in demo, you make the devs happyer...
!I bet you would buy it if the devs did limit the demo version and not just "think" you might buy it..
well, I actually never heard about LFS until end 2005/start 2006.
If it was more restricted, i think i would just play it for a couple of times, I would have no idea what it's really like, and I would still Play NFS by now...
I actually don't think it would be better to restrict it!
If it was more restricted, i think i would just play it for a couple of times, I would have no idea what it's really like, and I would still Play NFS by now...
I actually don't think it would be better to restrict it!
well, if we had this argument in german, i am sure i would have used better words to describe what i meant. but unfortunately i have to use a language in this forum i am not used to use
. no one who really likes the lfs demo will stick to it forever. some racers will race the demo longer than others but after some months everyone will buy the full version. no one would benefit from any restrictions. it takes a while for many racers to really get into lfs and if they knew from the beginning that they only have 30 days to play the demo, many would just not try it out. and as i said.....i am sure that the devs have thought a lot about this and imho it works.Plenty of arguments in German on the German site for you im sure,
http://www.4players.de/renders ... AYOUT=index&world=lfs
http://www.4players.de/renders ... AYOUT=index&world=lfs
no?
illepallAs there is an England V Germany fight going on... Then i may as well add 5-1!!!!!!! 
lmao
I think the demo content is a fine line that the devs have got about right. If the content were to be further limited, I think there would still need to be a solid multiplayer element.
The netcode in LFS is one of its strongest elements where it is clearly ahead of all of its sim racing rivals. People argue (ad nauseum) about physics, but in the end, as most of us are not racing drivers (and those that do race probably only race a very limited range of cars), the physics debate is often down to what we think feels right. The netcode is a little more clear-cut in which sim has done the best job.
Online play clearly works well in LFS, even for those still suffering 56k dial-up. If this was removed or severely limited from LFS (like nKP) many demo racers would be unaware of how strong LFS is in this area. Compare how quickly you can get down to racing in LFS, switch cars, tracks and servers and compare that to rFactor, which also has a multiplayer demo.
nKP has abysmal netcode (many fans report great online racing, but I'm yet to find it) and an even clunkier race entry process than rF. nKp's decision not to have multiplayer in the demo is probably wise considering how bad it is, but (partly due to the content activation not being robust) they made the decision to allow demo users full access to the rest of the content.
For independently developed and distributed games, it is probably wise to have a strong demo that demonstrates the strongest features. If the demo was more severely limited they may run the risk of not attracting so many people to buy licenses. If so many dedicated racers are happy with the demo (and they must be aware of the extra content if they buy S2) then it is likely they wouldn't buy anyway or are not currently in a position to buy. If they were 'forced' to buy S2 to continue racing online you will gain a few more license sales, but you might run the risk of more potential customers not being won over by a demo that doesn't do LFS justice.
As it stands, it is a generous demo. Any cut backs in content would have to be well considered. Maybe a time based limitation would be the best, if it could be securely implemented. Maybe nag screens showing S2 content or, even better, the ability to play S2 content replays. What better way to try to convince a demo user of what they are missing than to allow them to play the replays of some great S2 races within their unlocked LFS? (it may already be possible though - I've not tried it)
The netcode in LFS is one of its strongest elements where it is clearly ahead of all of its sim racing rivals. People argue (ad nauseum) about physics, but in the end, as most of us are not racing drivers (and those that do race probably only race a very limited range of cars), the physics debate is often down to what we think feels right. The netcode is a little more clear-cut in which sim has done the best job.
Online play clearly works well in LFS, even for those still suffering 56k dial-up. If this was removed or severely limited from LFS (like nKP) many demo racers would be unaware of how strong LFS is in this area. Compare how quickly you can get down to racing in LFS, switch cars, tracks and servers and compare that to rFactor, which also has a multiplayer demo.
nKP has abysmal netcode (many fans report great online racing, but I'm yet to find it) and an even clunkier race entry process than rF. nKp's decision not to have multiplayer in the demo is probably wise considering how bad it is, but (partly due to the content activation not being robust) they made the decision to allow demo users full access to the rest of the content.
For independently developed and distributed games, it is probably wise to have a strong demo that demonstrates the strongest features. If the demo was more severely limited they may run the risk of not attracting so many people to buy licenses. If so many dedicated racers are happy with the demo (and they must be aware of the extra content if they buy S2) then it is likely they wouldn't buy anyway or are not currently in a position to buy. If they were 'forced' to buy S2 to continue racing online you will gain a few more license sales, but you might run the risk of more potential customers not being won over by a demo that doesn't do LFS justice.
As it stands, it is a generous demo. Any cut backs in content would have to be well considered. Maybe a time based limitation would be the best, if it could be securely implemented. Maybe nag screens showing S2 content or, even better, the ability to play S2 content replays. What better way to try to convince a demo user of what they are missing than to allow them to play the replays of some great S2 races within their unlocked LFS? (it may already be possible though - I've not tried it)
Some really good points Rob. Got me thinking.
I do see where whitey's coming from. So many Demo racers ARE satisfied with what they get, and don't mind not having online stats, or downloading skins, or the BF1, FOX, GTRs etc.. they get Blackwood and 3 pretty good fun cars. It's quite a lot, for no investment.
BUT.. being satisfied with what they have, they're never going to invest the £24 it takes to get a licence. If they've got everything they need to give them perpetual happiness, they'll never buy S2.
Good.
LFS is backed by a community of enthusiastic sim racers, who support the devs in their efforts, propose changes, point out bugs, sing its praises to potential newbies, and race their hearts out at every opportunity. The last thing the LFS community needs (dev's bank balance aside for a moment) is a bunch of ex Demo people who FEEL forced to invest their money, grudgingly do so, and then sit and whinge about how they spent their money on something that "isn't even finished".
Thanks, but no thanks. Let's keep things as they are because it keeps the community strong. The demo being time-unrestricted and content-restricted effectively filters out a good deal of bland, unenthusiastic, overly passive and generally non-plused people from LFS, while the S2 licenced community continues to grow and to thrive, noisily and passionately.
LFS netcode does kick ass. It's absolutely brilliant. It's a genuine example of how it CAN be done. The perpetual demo does stand as a perpetual example of excellence in coding a multiplayer racing sim. I do agree with Rob on all points he makes, here.
Being able to run S2 replays on the demo would be a solid plus (no it isn't possible at the moment), and would be the best way to show off S2 content. If it could be coded safely without risking hacks, I do think it's a strong improvement suggestion in its own right (though I think it's been proposed before, IIRC). According to Vykos, "LFSTV" is a feature that has been decided on by the devs, in the future. I would assume this means that either the demo, or a separate "LFSTV" application will be available for non-licenced users to peek into our world. I can imagine an exponential increase in licence sales as a result of the birth of that baby.
I do see where whitey's coming from. So many Demo racers ARE satisfied with what they get, and don't mind not having online stats, or downloading skins, or the BF1, FOX, GTRs etc.. they get Blackwood and 3 pretty good fun cars. It's quite a lot, for no investment.
BUT.. being satisfied with what they have, they're never going to invest the £24 it takes to get a licence. If they've got everything they need to give them perpetual happiness, they'll never buy S2.
Good.
LFS is backed by a community of enthusiastic sim racers, who support the devs in their efforts, propose changes, point out bugs, sing its praises to potential newbies, and race their hearts out at every opportunity. The last thing the LFS community needs (dev's bank balance aside for a moment) is a bunch of ex Demo people who FEEL forced to invest their money, grudgingly do so, and then sit and whinge about how they spent their money on something that "isn't even finished".
Thanks, but no thanks. Let's keep things as they are because it keeps the community strong. The demo being time-unrestricted and content-restricted effectively filters out a good deal of bland, unenthusiastic, overly passive and generally non-plused people from LFS, while the S2 licenced community continues to grow and to thrive, noisily and passionately.
LFS netcode does kick ass. It's absolutely brilliant. It's a genuine example of how it CAN be done. The perpetual demo does stand as a perpetual example of excellence in coding a multiplayer racing sim. I do agree with Rob on all points he makes, here.
Being able to run S2 replays on the demo would be a solid plus (no it isn't possible at the moment), and would be the best way to show off S2 content. If it could be coded safely without risking hacks, I do think it's a strong improvement suggestion in its own right (though I think it's been proposed before, IIRC). According to Vykos, "LFSTV" is a feature that has been decided on by the devs, in the future. I would assume this means that either the demo, or a separate "LFSTV" application will be available for non-licenced users to peek into our world. I can imagine an exponential increase in licence sales as a result of the birth of that baby.
Some people buy software and some people never will. This is the nature of people. If people are happy with the demo then let them be happy with the demo, what is the problem.
NKP and rF never put out a real demo and what you see in those forums is people bitching about what they actually got for their money. With LFS there is nothing to bitch about. You can try the sim in all its glory and those that like it part with cash.
NKP and rF never put out a real demo and what you see in those forums is people bitching about what they actually got for their money. With LFS there is nothing to bitch about. You can try the sim in all its glory and those that like it part with cash.
Demo racers
(63 posts, started )
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