Hi,

I was thinking that it should be a server option to ban players who are using vob mods. This could be done by the server detecting the number of polys of a clients car and comparing it to the number of polys that that car should have. If the numbers do not match, the player gets a ban. I think this could be added quite easily, and it will stop vob mods ruining gameplay for those who have not modded the game.

And what if a modded car has exactly the same amount of poly's, while it's a totally different car?

Quote from Bose321 :

And what if a modded car has exactly the same amount of poly's, while it's a totally different car?

That's extremely unlikely, unless the modeler has made the car to an exact number of polys, which is very difficult

I'd love if this would be made somehow, and you probably know why Alex

Well HEX mods have same number of poly's. Also, there are 3D Studio Max scripts that can reduce poly count exactly to amount you need.

Maybe there is another way to do this, if the X,Y and Z values of the 3d model are send to the server and they do not match with those of the LFS cars, then the action will be taken.

I highly doubt that any of the hundreds of illegal mods that have been released already have the same poly count as the LFS cars. Also, decreasing the poly count would mean bad quality cars, so modders are unlikely to decrease the polycount to one as low as the LFS cars.

Quote from RS1T :

Hi,

I was thinking that it should be a server option to ban players who are using vob mods. This could be done by the server detecting the number of polys of a clients car and comparing it to the number of polys that that car should have. If the numbers do not match, the player gets a ban. I think this could be added quite easily, and it will stop vob mods ruining gameplay for those who have not modded the game.

Nice idea +1

Go the ISI route and kick those for file mismatches?

i.e. the files you have are different than those that the host has

Quote from RS1T :

That's extremely unlikely, unless the modeler has made the car to an exact number of polys, which is very difficult

It's not really difficult to do it,(in 3DS Max)just do connect,rearrange the vertecies(or however it's wrote) and you're done. And I think Max Script can do that XYZ thing too,not sure tho.

Quote from Dalek0220 :

Go the ISI route and kick those for file mismatches?

i.e. the files you have are different than those that the host has

doesn't LFS do that already, to some extent? "cars don't match host cars" or something...

LFS does already check memory for modifications and marks modded servers appropriately, so perhaps the system could be extended to include the memory where the visual data is loaded into.

What is actually the problem with other people's cars looking locally different, that would warrant this in the first place?

Quote from Bob Smith :

What is actually the problem with other people's cars looking locally different, that would warrant this in the first place?

If the modified cars have different dimensions, contact between cars could occur when it normally wouldn't using the standard models.

Could this cause those using the standard models to be unexpectedly punted by a car that is seemingly a foot away, but on the mod version actually making contact ?

Quote from Bob Smith :

LFS does already check memory for modifications and marks modded servers appropriately, so perhaps the system could be extended to include the memory where the visual data is loaded into.

What is actually the problem with other people's cars looking locally different, that would warrant this in the first place?

Certain mods cause hits similar to those caused by bad lag. Some modders keep the original LFS bounding box, but the majority don't, and this affects the collision boxes online and locally. This can screw up bumper to bumper races and police chases (Not that anyone cares about that here)

Quote from Bean0 :

Could this cause those using the standard models to be unexpectedly punted by a car that is seemingly a foot away, but on the mod version actually making contact ?

Yes, thats exactly what happens, and i've seen it far too many times.

Race driver grid got this, any changes to the game, and you cant play online.
Very good.

Devs make us awsome cars, only thing the others do is changing them
Idots

Quote from aroX123 :

Race driver grid got this, any changes to the game, and you cant play online.
Very good.

Hackable in 5 mins using CheatEngine or TSearch.

If they are changing the physics bounds, although this is actually better for a mod, it does mean the vehicle should be multiplayer incompatible. So this should definitely get looked at, even if such mods are against the devs wishes, if it is tarnishing the overall racing experience. Plus it must be so easy to rework the physics mesh to allow ghost car like cheating.

What about calculating md5 of *.vob file? I think it is the easiest way for detecting mods.

Quote from rudvil :

What about calculating md5 of *.vob file? I think it is the easiest way for detecting mods.

1st: whirpool > *
2nd: would be easy to avoid using tools like WireShark.

Yeah, you overtook me. I was just going to write this about the md5 sum. It's a very good idea, it doesn't takes only 0.04 seconds.

Edit: Shadowww, other methods will be hackable with Wireshark, too. If I'm not mistaken, some way of encrypting the stuff send through network should be implemented, but that will be difficult.

Quote from Shadowww :

1st: whirpool > *
2nd: would be easy to avoid using tools like WireShark.

Actually i mean client side md5 check, when game is loading, and if hash sum is different, game will not start.
And it will be much harder to avoid this, because you will need disassemble lfs.exe

Quote from rudvil :

Actually i mean client side md5 check, when game is loading.
And it will be much harder to avoid this, because you will need disassemble lfs.exe

No it won't, client side means you need a compare value on the client side, which the mod user could simply modify to fit the modified vob.
You can completely forget client side solutions, they're all waaaay too easy to avoid/crack.
Hashing the vobs and comparing them to hashes on the lfs masterserver is the most promising solution. Encrypted or not, it's still crackable, but it's as good as it gets.

The only solution a mod user can't crack is to have the server run all the physics and kick/ban users who report unexpected behaviour, such as collisions when there are none with the original model, or no collision when there should be one. Problem with that is that it puts more load on the server and that lag could cause false kicks/bans.

Quote from rudvil :

Actually i mean client side md5 check, when game is loading, and if hash sum is different, game will not start.
And it will be much harder to avoid this, because you will need disassemble lfs.exe

That would require as much skills as pre-tweaking cars in exe. Which mine sister can do (seriously).